To all my ninjas responding to posters making ignorant comments made in this thread: Shut up! Just shut up! He doesn't get it! He'll never get it! It's been 4 days! THE COWS CAN SPOT RACISM BY NOW! Forget about it please!
There's really no reason to get so worked up about this discussion. Sometimes comparing views can be a very useful thing - I know I'll be more conscious of what's going on when I see somebody make the gesture in a rude way.
i dont know, maybe he saw me in the rearview looking at him when he started honking. maybe he saw me getting off the freeway (it was on offramp that lead to a red light.) maybe he was superman and had x-ray vision. i don't see why this matters.
That is a good point but ignorance while understandable isn't something that should be excused. I will again like this to the situation where Steve Kerr called Yao a "Chinaman." Kerr didn't know the history of the term or that it was considered offensive, the equivalent of "n^gger" or "darkie". When he was told that it was an offensive term he apologized and said that he wouldn't use it in the future. Since then I don't think anyone has accused Steve Kerr of being a racist and the issue is pretty much forgotten. Whether the Spanish National Teams knew that this would be considered offensive they do now and rather than offering lame excuses they should at least recognize that there are people offended by this.
3814, you started off okay. But slowly and surely you showed your ignorance and true sentiments with each new post of yours. I think 3814 is even dumber and more pathetic than snc. The only difference is that it took 3814 over 7 pages or so to reveal this. He is definitely more clever and insidious than snc. Judging from his posts though, I can only imagine how much of a fail he is at any type of freelance writing whatsoever. For the rest of you who are trying to justify your feelings to these ignorant posters who obviously live in their own little priviledged world, please stop. For them to admit that there is anything wrong with these photos is for them to admit to certain social constructs at play and priviledges that they benefit from every single day of their existence. They would never do that. These posters should be picking up a book or finding out more information on their own to seek any truly genuine thirst for knowledge or understanding they claim they have. The internet is right in front of them and a click away. But instead they are telling you to justify your feelings, life experiences, history, and logic to them. How arrogant and ignorant is that. For a more enlightened discussion of the topic, please visit here http://www.racialicious.com/2008/08...tball-team-honors-china-with-a-wink/#comments And by the way, just more proof of Spaniards being culturally stupid. (and no, I don't mean all Spaniards, so don't get all flustered) http://minoritymilitant.blogspot.com/
I was just curious. I normally can't tell people's ethnicity from a car behind. I was just wondering if perhaps there was a chance you misconstrued the person's actions. If not, that's terrible.
I think you're misunderstanding me. I agree something is not right about the photos, but I don't label it as "racism" since I don't believe they intended it in a racist way. We both agree it's wrong, but we don't agree on the definition of racism. And that's fine...but there's really no need to make things personal. I believe what the players said when defending their actions while you do not. Sure, they should have apologized for the harm, but I still don't see it as "racism"...just ignorance. I also find it funny how the people most offended by the team's actions are the one's that throw out the most personal insults. Isn't there something wrong with this? Can't we discuss an issue without calling each other names? Before you point the finger at Spain for being racist, maybe you should look yourself in the mirror for being rude. Edit: By the way, I never knew the history of the tennis team doing this before. If it is indeed a habit for Spanish teams, then it can't be defended as a spur of the moment gesture that wasn't intended to do any harm.
If I had wanted to be rude to you, I would have told you to STFU after your very first post on this topic. But I didn’t do that. I patiently waited for what is now 8 pages for you to present your perspective and argue your points. I thought you would express some new, great insight that has never been expressed or argued before. But no such thing happened. And all throughout I was hoping for you to slowly understand the issues through the process of reasoning and discourse with the other posters. At the very least, I was hoping for you to quietly back away from your ill-informed, presumptuous position...and perhaps come back at a later time when you were more educated. Instead your ignorance and disingenuousness continues to spread over some 8 pages which becomes more and more apparent with each new post you make. I waited patiently for your freelance greatness, but instead we got 8 pages of the privileged telling a whole race of people how they should think, feel, and react because you are such a great intellectual expert in this area. Just in your last few posts, you have shown your blindness and dishonesty. Allow me to quickly point this out to you. I never once made a post calling Spain racist. Not once. So please don’t misquote me and put words in my mouth. However, what the Spain basketball team did is racist. You see, there’s a difference between being racist and doing something racist. Funny how you can’t see this while you call the Spain players ignorant. Ignorant of what? Ignorant of committing a racist act perhaps. Here’s a second example of your failure. When DANgerous shared his very recent experience of some driver making the same “friendly and affectionate” gesture to him while he was driving, your only response was “If they were behind you, how did they know you were asian?”. It may be construed as ignorance on your part because maybe you have never driven in your life before and would not know how someone on the road could tell if you are white or not. But what your post really revealed is again this arrogant, privileged mentality of someone who discredits the personal life experiences of others so readily. Then when DANgerous responds to you and asked “why this matters”, you reply with “I was just curious. I normally can't tell people's ethnicity from a car behind. I was just wondering if perhaps there was a chance you misconstrued the person's actions. If not, that's terrible.”. Your reply reinforced the uppity skepticism that you had in your previous post and also showed that you somehow still do not believe it could have happened the way DANgerous described. Your reply may also signal your sheltered existence and gross ignorance of issues regarding race, racism itself, and people who don’t look like you. And that is why I have asked you to go find out more for yourself if you are truly discoursing with good intentions by doing some research, getting some life experiences, opening up a book, or just simply opening up your mind. It’s not something you will ever understand through posting on a basketball board in a matter of days especially for someone like you with your advanced stage of ignorance. Are you backpedaling now? Seriously, you're ignorant but amusing. How can I be rude for calling you something you admit yourself; for calling you ignorant? Please read your own words. As others have explained to you, the act is racist...plain and simple. How can this gesture be harmful but not racist? What does “pointing the finger at Spain” as you put it, where the basketball team and the Spain basketball federation committed a very ignorant, harmful act (which you yourself have agreed so) and has had a long tack record of these racist and race related offenses have to do with my so called “rudeness” where I am engaging and responding to your ill-informed and disingenuous posts? Think before you post please. And don't let my "rudeness" deter you from freeing yourself from ignorance and your own biases.
That was a really long post, but you didn't really argue anything. You just called him ignorant over and over again. The first four paragraphs of your post all said the exact same thing. Now I'm with you on the fact that this photo was stupid and offensive, I'm not arguing with you. You waited all of this time to post thinking that your post is somehow going to change the minds of this bbs and all who read it. Then you said nothing. You just threw insults at him the whole time when he is not insulting anyone. You had maybe one or two sentences in that whole babbling post that said anything. Think before you post please.
Really? I thought his attitude the whole time questioning people’s judgments and personal experiences was quite condescending. At least that’s how he comes off on the internet. I never thought I would change anyone’s minds as I was only referring to 3814. Brush up on your reading comprehension and you will see this. Look here, I told 3814 the following: “And that is why I have asked you to go find out more for yourself if you are truly discoursing with good intentions by doing some research, getting some life experiences, opening up a book, or just simply opening up your mind. It’s not something you will ever understand through posting on a basketball board in a matter of days” And here “These posters should be picking up a book or finding out more information on their own to seek any truly genuine thirst for knowledge or understanding they claim they have.” Maybe you meant I somehow thought I was going to change people’s willingness to seek out information and be open to the possibility that new information and understanding will change their minds. Then yes, you are right. But I don’t expect to change anyone’s minds.
There is no way that opening up a book is going to change anyone's mind on something of race. He knows what a Chinese person is. He doesn't think it is offensive. That's the end of it. You getting offended because he is not offended is dumb. Nothing he said was near as condescending as you. Don't make things uber personal, it is just a debate.
You can't be serious about this. Reading can change anyone's mind about practically anything. I think they call it "education" or something.
Thank you for the definition. Let me rephrase: Reading a book isn't going to make him think that the picture is offensive.
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_-BBBsPTzajw/SKSHWjwYt_I/AAAAAAAACm0/L4bYB0YjXmc/s1600-h/Estados+Unidos_Japon+2006.psd.jpg
It is racist if the Chinese said so. I dont care about Li-Ning spokeman, the company does not want to lose contract and recognition business wise. but if the normal Chinese people think it is racist, then it is. It is just a childish and non-sense for the whole Spanish team(men/women) and their sponsor to do this.
