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[WSJ] Video Analysis: How a Pro-Trump Mob Overran Capitol Police

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by basso, Jan 12, 2021.

  1. malakas

    malakas Member

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    Of course. Terrorists should be censored. And prosecuted.
    Radicalised Islamists are detained before they even have commited a crime nowadays.
    BUT Trump terrorists should be allowed to freely call to arms others and incite treason, a coup and murders.

    I didn't know you were a supporter of terrorists dachuda.
     
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  2. mdrowe00

    mdrowe00 Member
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    ...oh so that's the defense now.

    ...the devil made them do it. Wonderful. Glad that got cleared up. Glad I watched everything.

    Even happier that Chuck Norris actor#2 wasn't on set for this scene.

    Sums up this whole disgusting, sorry, treasonous episode.

    And STILL, a bunch of them are going to jail for a long time. If they're lucky.

    This actually does more to indict the Donald's administration (who has the responsibility of securing the federal capitol, particularly at times of potential unrest) than it does to exonerate it...but I understand that's not the angle.

    Let's play.

    Oathkeepers are a right-wing paramilitary group. They want to fight the government and have said so publically many times. The last thing they would have is an "infiltrator" that wasn't aligned with their motives involved in this action (that was probably planned far in advance). They would not be opposed to any violent confrontation with the government (because that's their M.O.), so they would be especially susceptible to "infiltration" by an "agent provocateur", all gung-ho and ready to grease the wheels if things don't get moving, because this is their big chance.

    The "agent provocateur" gets into the capitol building opposite the "peaceful protestors" who are already unlawfully inside the capitol building. Inserts himself into the crowd of "peaceful protestors", makes a scene, causes a disturbance of the (unlawful, because it's inside the capitol building) "protest", tips over a boiling kettle that shouldn't have been on the stove in the first place, steals away like a thief in the night, and accomplishes his mission to not only discredit the "peaceful protestors" on behalf of lawful democracy (and Donald Trump, since there's no difference between the two), and grant the evil space alien lizards disguised as Democrats a victory they had already won and proven through extraordinarily latitudinal "investigative" legal means (if not having any evidence at all of any specific instances of election fraud, as posed in the court petitions, being available for review qualifies as being investigative)...

    ...which forced these "protestors" to, barely an hour after the president told them to be there (unlawfully), go to the capitol building and set things straight.

    Hm.

    This would make an excellent plotline for "24". Except that they already did something like that around season two or three.
    Except for the lizard space aliens. That would have been too much.

    Okay.
    First, I've recently checked myself into ellipsis rehab for my rampant ellipsis abuse. Can't solve a problem you don't admit you have.

    I'm not a federal prosecutor. I'm not even trying to pretend to be one on the internet.

    I could shoot this down seven different ways to Sunday. And it's already Wednesday.

    But I'm not going to do it. Somebody else is welcome to, though.

    Don't have time. My cake's done.

    Bye.;)

    ...oh, P.S....

    ...the "agent provacateur" is Jack Bauer...
     
    #42 mdrowe00, Jan 13, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2021
  3. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
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    I think you already did kind of shoot it down. The whole text narration of Acts I, II, and III don't really match what I saw in the video. The video certainly doesn't prove that narration. But some people realize they already look silly and don't mind piling more on top of that if they can pretend their guys aren't so bad afterall.
     
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  4. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member
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    ^ posted by a boomer dung beetle who runs comms for the Proud Boys, basketball message board chapter.

    He should be careful about pissing off his oath keeper "fellow travelers" - they have a lot of ropes and flex cuffs, that they ended up not using while murdering members of congress and the vice president
     
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  5. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member
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    Does anybody pine for the days when @basso used to pretend to be not racist instead of posting white supremacist disinformation conspiracy theories as part MAGA Kristallnacht?

    I actually don't - I like the MAGA basso one better. You know where you stand with that guy, it's preferably with his boot stamping on your face (sciatica permitting)
     
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  6. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    it's fine, really, i thought we could have a discussion, if not a debate, about what went down. but you've convinced me it's pointless. more important things are afoot, so i'm done with this, and this place, for now.

    tag me if thou wilt; i shan't respond.

    i'll be back when the other thing happens.
     
  7. SamFisher

    SamFisher Contributing Member
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    Not sure where @basso got the idea that I was looking for a discussion

    white privilege causes another bad assumption AGAIN sigh sigh sigh
     
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  8. jo mama

    jo mama Contributing Member

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    i dont care who was in there...they engaged in insurrection...if its antifa, anarchists, right-wing militia. it doesnt matter.

    its entirely possible that a left-wing extremist got in there too, but the idea that this wasnt driven by trump supporters or that some agent provocateur stirred them up is laughable.
     
  9. B-Bob

    B-Bob my celli weighs a ton
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    *thumbs up* on avatar switch. .... A new, exciting era begins.
     
  10. KingCheetah

    KingCheetah Contributing Member

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    Can LTS shoot the three?
     
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  11. mdrowe00

    mdrowe00 Member
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    ...it certainly won't matter who was in there to the federal prosecutor(s)...

    ...poor dumb MAGA schmucks...;)
     
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  12. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    So you're going to run away, take your ball and go home? Why don't you rediscover whatever open mindedness you once processed and try reading this:

    PART I

    Why Didn't The FBI And DHS Produce A Threat Report Ahead of The Capitol Insurrection?
    January 13, 20217:16 PM ET
    by Dina Temple-Raston

    In late December, the New York Police Department sent a packet of material to the U.S. Capitol Police and the FBI. It was full of what's known as raw intelligence — bits and pieces of information that turned up by scraping various social media sites. It all indicated that there would likely be violence when lawmakers certified the presidential election on Jan. 6.

    The NYPD sent the information to Washington under the assumption it would be folded into a formal intelligence bulletin by the FBI and the Department of Homeland Security. The FBI's version is known as a joint intelligence bulletin. The DHS produces a threat assessment. These reports are typically written as a matter of course ahead of high-profile events. Local law enforcement officials see them as actionable intelligence — an early warning system to help them prepare for incoming threats.

    And yet, for last week's deadly attack on the Capitol, an event the president himself had promised would be "wild," no formal report was ever released.

    A spokesperson from DHS' Office of Intelligence and Analysis confirmed to NPR that the agency didn't produce any threat assessment about the possibility of violence on Jan. 6. The FBI confirmed it didn't produce one either. Instead, DHS provided a report about the "heightened threat environment during the 2020-2021 election season, including the extent to which the political transition and political polarization are contributing to the mobilization of individuals to commit violence," the DHS spokesperson said.

    "I was surprised that we didn't receive any information" about Jan. 6, Mike Sena, president of the National Fusion Center Association, told NPR. "We received a number of reports, but they were all regarding events all around the election cycle, you know, information sharing."

    The federal government created fusion centers after the Sept. 11 attacks to improve communication and intelligence sharing among local and federal law enforcement officials. There are 80 of them across the U.S., and one of their key responsibilities is to disseminate these kinds of intelligence bulletins.

    The bulletins are considered a finished product — a synthesis of validated and analyzed intelligence that helps local law enforcement make informed decisions.

    Some FBI officials have said that the bureau and DHS didn't produce a bulletin for Jan. 6 out of concern that doing so might run afoul of First Amendment free speech protections that allow people to protest and assemble peacefully.

    But three law enforcement officials told NPR that this didn't stop DHS and the FBI from issuing intelligence bulletins ahead of mostly peaceful demonstrations in Portland, Ore., after the killing of George Floyd last May, before Black Lives Matter marches in Washington in early June or in anticipation of an annual convention of the Islamic Society of North America first reported the existence of the Norfolk FBI warning.)

    (See Part II)
     
    #52 Deckard, Jan 13, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 13, 2021
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  13. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    PART II

    The problem was that the threats they uncovered hadn't gone through any rigorous analysis process. "They seem to have only had a couple or single sourcing," said R.P. Eddy, a former U.S. counterterrorism official and diplomat who now runs Ergo, a private intelligence firm. "So, if you were a consumer of that intelligence and that's all you saw ... you'd say, 'Oh, it's just one source. You know, I'm not so sure I'm going to invest $2 million into extra overtime and get a bunch of new gear for my troops."

    NPR spoke with three FBI special agents in charge around the country and four current and former DHS officials who all agreed that Jan. 6 was a fast-moving event that was hard to anticipate. But they also said a specific threat assessment from the FBI and DHS in the weeks before might well have persuaded Capitol Police and others to beef up security.

    Eddy said if there wasn't an intelligence bulletin ahead of the pro-Trump rally, that was a problem. "If the reality is that ... neither FBI nor DHS did a threat assessment for Jan. 6, that was blinking red. If that's indeed the fact, then that's absolutely a failure of intelligence ... and weird," he said.

    The head of the U.S. Capitol Police told reporters last week that he had no intelligence that suggested there would be a storming of the Capitol. DHS and FBI officials told NPR that what he hadn't seen was a specific threat assessment report or intelligence bulletin from DHS and the FBI. A raw intelligence report a day before an event just isn't the same thing.

    "The invisible obvious"

    Last week, Steven D'Antuono, the assistant director in charge of the FBI's Washington Field Office, told reporters that the FBI was working closely with its partners and that there was no indication that Jan. 6's events would turn so horribly violent. D'Antuono reversed himself this week after it became public that the Norfolk field office had indeed provided intelligence about a possible assault on the Capitol the day before the rally was set to start.

    Local law enforcement partners who spoke to NPR said they felt blindsided by events because they had only a general intelligence report about unrest during the election season with which to work. Typically, raw intelligence, which is what the NYPD and Norfolk FBI provided, needs to be vetted and analyzed before it is actionable. NPR reached out to U.S. Capitol Police asking if a federal intelligence brief about Jan. 6 would have changed its planning and has not heard back.

    The Office of Intelligence and Analysis at DHS is responsible for producing these threat assessments, and it often works in concert with the FBI. The I&A Office, as it is known, has had staffing and operations problems for months, ever since the former FBI agent who ran the division, Brian Murphy, was removed from the job in August after media reports that he was compiling dossiers on journalists and protesters in Portland. Among other things, the dossiers made note of which journalists were publishing leaked documents.

    The acting secretary of homeland security at the time, Chad Wolf, ordered the intelligence office to stop collecting the information on journalists and said there would be an investigation into the matter. A short time later, Murphy filed a whistleblower complaint in which he alleged that he had been told to stop reporting on Russian threats to the U.S. election in his threat assessments. He said he was told it would make President Trump look bad. His whistleblower case is still pending.

    Murphy was replaced in the fall by a longtime member of the department's general counsel's office. He was a lawyer and didn't have an analysis background. What that meant, officials said, was that one of the department's key missions — disseminating actionable threat information out to local law enforcement — was hobbled. This week, acting Secretary Wolf announced his own departure.

    Against that backdrop, instead of a specific intelligence report focused on Jan. 6, the I&A Office produced something more general about demonstrations, according to a DHS spokesperson.

    The National Fusion Center Association's Sena remembers seeing that report, and other local law enforcement officials contacted by NPR said they recall only that back in December there was a bulletin that focused on domestic extremists who might mobilize and create violence "in the coming months." It didn't focus on the Jan. 6 joint session of Congress, and it didn't indicate that Capitol Hill could be a target.

    Some security specialists said they didn't think an intelligence report would have made much of a difference. "It was perfectly obvious, if you read the newspaper, that there was going to be a big rally, that the president was talking about ... be 'wild,' and that the focus was going to be the Capitol, where they were having a certification vote," said former Secretary of Homeland Security Michael Chertoff. "It didn't take rocket science to see if there was a realistic foreseeable risk to the Capitol and you would enhance the security."

    The threat was so out in the open, Chertoff said, you didn't need the threat analysis to know what was going to happen.

    A specific warning finally came from federal authorities the day before the riot at the Capitol. After the FBI field office in Virginia issued that explicit internal warning quoting an online threat that cited specific violence and an assault on the Capitol, officials convened a conference call with local law enforcement to discuss it. But by then it was too late. Less than 24 hours later, a mob would descend on the Capitol.

    Eddy says in hindsight he believes the problem was something he calls "the invisible obvious" — things that sit right in front of us that we don't notice. "The reason that they are invisible to us ... gets to our biases," he said. "The situation here, I'm unfortunately quite sure we're going to find, that it was very hard for these decision-makers and these analysts to realize that people who look just like them could want to commit this kind of unconstitutional violence and could literally try to and want to kill them."

    This was supposed to be a pro-Trump rally, until it wasn't.

    "Foe look differently, foe act differently, say different things," Eddy said. "They don't have the same bumper stickers. They don't have the same yellow flag of 'Don't Tread on Me.' It was hard for them to see that the law-and-order hierarchy in which they were born and bred ... where they got their paycheck, was inciting the mob that was going to commit the violence that was indeed the foe, not the friend."

    This Sunday, the FBI formally warned local law enforcement that armed protests were being planned for all 50 statehouses and the U.S. Capitol. The warning also said an unidentified group was calling on others to help it "storm" state, local and federal courthouses should Trump be removed as president before Inauguration Day. In Washington, the secretary of the Army announced that as many as 20,000 National Guard troops are expected to be deployed with guns.

    https://www.npr.org/2021/01/13/9563...-threat-report-ahead-of-the-capitol-insurrect
     
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  14. FranchiseBlade

    FranchiseBlade Contributing Member
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    More important things afoot? Did Hunter need another laptop repaired?
     
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  15. mdrowe00

    mdrowe00 Member
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    ...he heard Hunter's about to do another porn dump off of one of his laptops and he wants to be early so he doesn't have to pick over the scraps, like last time...;)
     
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  16. Buck Turgidson

    Buck Turgidson Mineshaft Enthusiast

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    Just stop it.

    There's nothing to debate "about what went down". The only future steps are collecting evidence and prosecution.
     
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  17. vlaurelio

    vlaurelio Contributing Member

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    it all started with Hugo Chavez planting chips on voting machines right @basso
     
  18. NewRoxFan

    NewRoxFan Contributing Member

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