i think this is messed up. also i think most of us have enough money that we can pay some absurd fines and be annoyed and pissed but it doesn't make a difference at the end of the day. however there is a sizable percentage of the population which cant say the same. and these kinds of nuisances really hurt the pulling self up via bootstrap ability.
Wow man. That blows. I had nearly the exact same situation happen to me two years ago. My insurance was renewed but I had forgotten to put it in the car, so I only had an expired certificate on me at the time. The cop phoned my insurance company to verify that it was in fact renewed (though he did warn me that if it wasn't, that I would be summoned to court and forced to pay upwards of $2000 -- but of course it was renewed so it was all good). Anyway, to make a long story short, I ended up paying the $80 ticket, and that was the end of that. I'm glad Ontario doesn't have silly BS like you're going through.
Out of curiosity, why is it that you live in Texas, but your van is not licensed in Texas and your insurance is from out of state? Are you in school or on some sort of job? Also, why is the address on your driver's license wrong?
I'm in school here. My insurance was from out-of-state because I mistakenly believed it was a national company and was, therefore, nationwide. The address on my driver's license is my Houston address.
Here are my two threads. Notice in the second one, I explained what they were suspending licenses for these days. (ie. The one you posted in.) What started as a good idea has become extremely corrupt. http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=103234 http://bbs.clutchfans.net/showthread.php?t=113186
Weird, didn't remember this - thanks for pointing it out Fatty. The doubly strange part is that, one month after I wrote the above post in Fatty's thread, I got pulled over and ensnared in the very process I was writing about .
People credit the DPS with a great deal of incompetence - and I say credit because I do not believe it is deserved. I think the rules/regulations/bylaws/standards/laws/protocols and whatever else they want to stick in there are purposely designed to engender confusion and create difficulties in, what should be, a relatively straightforward process. Once you're in the snare, the obscure regulations and detrimental weirdnesses of DPS's system are designed to keep you there, and keep you paying, as long as possible.
I agree I think I know of at least one instance where I paid the SAME TICKET TWICE I literally have to pull all my records statewide it will be an ordeal but . . . . have to keep that stuff in order Rocket RIver
I don't think any insurance company is truly nationwide. Rates tend to be different in different states. Your original post seemed a bit confusing since you said you were insured in the same state that your van was licensed in. It would probably be a good idea to get Texas license plates for your van since you live in Houston and go to school in College Station.
Your face is tired. Go back to preschool where you belong before my I crush you with my post count. You D&D ****s are hilarious. Big buzzwords everywhere like you're trying to impress your girlfriend's dad. Thats like a totally outrageous paradigm, I'm totally proactive about it. But anyway this thread got moved and is therefor now out of my jurisdiction, so good day.
Holy crap dude, that totally sux azz...Around 635 and Monfort (Dallas), they started putting up the red light cameras...Total f'n rip off...Yeah yeah safety, but c'mon, its for the revenue...My boss got a present in the mail this week...He ran a red light and they took a picture and video...crazy...
I live in College Station now. And you're right, that'd be a fantastic idea - but here's the problem: because of all this garbage being flung at me, and all the money being extorted from me, I can't get the plate changed right now. I've tried. I have to wait the 7-10 weeks before I can do so. Hopefully, I won't discover some brand new fee/fine that suspends my license again before that happens - at this point, I'm relatively sure I can be grabbed at any time, for any reason, if the state decides they'd like to take more money from me.
Because I lived in Houston when I got my Texas DL. I'm sure your line of questioning here is intended to produce the effect that I'm at fault. Well, here, let me clear things up: I am. I did not have valid insurance at the time I was pulled over. I did not realize my insurance wasn't valid, but it was. Now, here's the question I'm asking, and have been asking: Is the frustration, the huge outlay of cash, the failure of the courts or DPS to provide any sort of information about where and when these payments are supposed to come up (each one, after the ticket, was a total surprise), the constant threat and/or actuality of having my license suspended despite the complete necessity of having a car - is this all proportional to the crime? Are these laws, these ****ed-up procedures, and so forth, really there to make the roads safe, or are they there to extort as much money from citizens as possible?
Amen, bro... I know a lot of you are going "so what" until it happens. Fact is: You can run a red light now, hit a person, run away and get caught, and it would still be the same as thadeus' and my's plight. (Class B misdemeanor) It's r****ded, and it is a money-grab. EDIT: And to all that think it won't happen? What's next? Texas just decides that any offense warrants a suspended licence? Do you think speeding is more attrocious than a sticker? As of now, Texas does. Suspension on licences was originally brought forth to dictate illegals, who never left the country thereafter. Bravo, Texas! Then, folks realized how easy it was to manipulate the law law law. I meant that. The Texas Constitution has well over 300 amendments, and counting. I love Texas, but enough is enough.
Does the punishment fit the crime - it doesn't appear to. Could you have taken the necesary steps to prevent all of that from happening - most certainly. You were apparently stopped for some traffic violation which I don't think you mentioned. Although you lived in Houston or College Station, your van had out of state plates. You said your were insured in the same state where your van was licensed. I assume you moved from some other state to Texas. One of the first things that should be done when moving to a new state is to license your car. You said one of the delays is that the address on your license was Houston and not College Station. This leads to one of two assumptions - you no longer lived in Houston which means you should have changed you addres on your DL, or you still had a residence in Houston so somehow, you should be checking your mail. Should things be more clear - Yes. Does the amount of expense and hassle you have gone through seem appropriate for your transgressions - No. Are the laws out there to extort money - No. Are there cops who use their position to "harass" folks they think should be "harassed" - Yes (although I strongly believe it is the minority, because of all the people I personally have known throughout my life, none have ever been harassed by cops). Could you have avoided much of the situation by doing things that should be done (e.g. licensing your van in the state in which you live) - Yes.
They should be clear enough that one is made aware of everything that's going to happen upon conviction of failure to provide proof of insurance. Every hidden fee, every hassle - EVERYTHING. It wouldn't take much effort for the state of Texas to, for example, provide a little sheet of paper with the entire procedure on it. Why don't they do that? I don't think any reasonable person would find the expense and hassle proportionate to the 'crime'. So, why so much expense, and why so much hassle? Then why are the laws so obscure, and why does each arm of the fundraising force mention that they're not required to tell you anything? Also see the above: why not inform people? why so much expense, and why so much hassle? Why, for one example of many, does the $260 letter from DPS concerning the annual fee from the 'Texas Driver's Responsibility Program' never ONCE mention that it's a tri-annual payment? The mention a lot of other stuff - but that part isn't on there. Why won't DPS tell you when the next bill for the next year is going to be sent? I asked when I called - they wouldn't tell me. You must know the right people then. When I was a kid, I had my face slammed into the hood of a cruiser for no obvious reason ('DOWN ON THE CAR!') Many of the people I have known have been harassed by cops, and a handful violently harassed. So, are these sorts of cops in the minority? Maybe. I don't know. Yes, I could have done many things, but the only thing that would have made a difference in the situation I'm in right now would be having valid insurance at the time I was pulled over. I'm not avoiding my responsibility here - I'm saying that the entire process is completely unreasonable, largely arbitrary, and designed to generate revenue. Just because it could have been prevented (maybe) doesn't mean it's justified. Here's a hypothetical: The new 'Texas is Awesome' window sticker is now required of all vehicles living in the state of Texas. It must be updated every 6 months, and the sticker costs $150. You must also have the registration form for the sticker in your vehicle at all times. The registration form comes in the mail 1-4 months after you purchase the sticker. If you are pulled over for any reason and found NOT to have the sticker or the registration form, you will be fined an undisclosed sum of money in an undisclosed number of installments over an undisclosed period of time. The fines can be found out by reading the DPS procedure handbook, which is 1500 pages long, but is subject to change at any time. Failure to pay any of these fines will result in your license being suspended, which will require you to submit 4 forms to the local DPS office within 30 days of failure to pay (30 days from the date DPS sends out the invoice, wherever they send it. NOT 30 days from when you receive it. If the mail does not reach you, DPS has asked the post office that the letter NOT be forwarded to your new address - even though all your junk mail is forwarded easily). Each of the 4 forms requires a $100 filing fee. Failure to provide any of the 4 forms within a limited (but unspecified) time frame will result in your license being suspended again, even though it's already suspended, but now you'll have to pay for the 'FAILURE TO PROVIDE THE 4 FORMS' charge, which is $250 and a bill will provided to you by DPS at their leisure. Until you fill out the 'FAILURE TO PROVIDE THE 4 FORMS' form and pay the $250, you cannot fill out the original 4 required forms. If you are pulled over at any point during this process, you will be taken to jail, but you will still be required to pay the fines, as well as the 'Texas Traffic Offender' program fine levied against all who are put in jail for failure to pay required state fees. The fine for the 'Texas Traffic Offender' program is $260. Failure to pay this fee in a timely manner will result in your license being suspended - again. ...but all of this could have been prevented if you had remembered to put the registration paper for your 'Texas is Awesome' sticker in your glove compartment. Yes, it could have been prevented - so everything else is your fault.
I don't know why the letter you receive doesn't mention that the annual surcharge is a three year commitment, but the web site clearly states it. I am still confused as to why your van is not licensed in the state of Texas. Also, with respect to your insurance, did they say that since your insurance was from out of state that you essentially were uninsured? Did your insurance company know that you were living in Texas? If so, it seems you should have some recourse against your agent for not telling you that the insurance policy you had needed to be reassigned to someone in Texas. For instance, assume you were carrying your insurance card at the time you were pulled over. If they are telling you after the fact that it's no good since it is from out of state, why wouldn't the cop have told you the same thing upon examining the card?
That really sounds like a hassle Thadeus. If it makes you feel any better it sounds like every state's DPS / DMV is a quagmire of bureaucratic obfuscation and ineptitude. Unfortunately is that driving isn't a right so many localities and states have no qualms about regulating it and milking drivers for money.
