[Official] Reggie Bush or Someone else -- Vince Young out of running

I think you are pretty much right (particularly these days financially it doesn't make sense for so much money being locked into two QBs), which is why I suggest the following:

 

Elway was selected first in the 1983 draft. Aikman went 1st in 1989.

That's a loooong time ago

 

so david carr will be next, right?

 

While I wouldn't be adverse to trading Carr for the right package, I think getting the right package could be tough because of the down year we just had and his cap situation.

 

Let's see #1 picks for RBs and Qbs since 69 (Superbowl appearences, titles) * is Hall of Famer

1969 *O.J. Simpson, rb (0, 0)
1970 *Terry Bradshaw, qb (4,4)
1971 Jim Plunkett, qb (2,2)
1975 Steve Bartkowski, qb (0,0)
1978 *Earl Campbell, rb (0,0)
1980 Billy Sims, rb (0,0)
1981 George Rogers, rb (0,0)
1983 *John Elway, qb (4,2)
1986 Bo Jackson, rb (0,0)
1987 Vinny Testaverde, qb (0,0)
1989 Troy Aikman, qb (3,3)
1990 Jeff George, qb (0,0)
1993 Drew Bledsoe, qb (2,1)
1995 Ki-Jana Carter, rb (0,0)
1998 Peyton Manning, qb (0,0)
1999 Tim Couch, qb (0,0)
2001 Michael Vick, qb (0,0)
2002 David Carr, qb (0,0)
2003 Carson Palmer, qb (0,0)
2004 Eli Manning, qb (0,0)
2005 Alex Smith, qb (0,0)

Rbs totals: 5 picked, 2 Hall of Famers, no superbowl wins or appearences.

QB totals: 15 picked, 2 Hall of Famers (though Aikman and the great regular season Peyton are close to shoe ins), 12 superbowl wins, 15 appearences.

Think about it, even top 5 backs of all time like OJ and Earl couldn't carry their teams to the Superbowl. If the Texans think Vince Young is going to be an elite pro QB (not necc HOF level), no matter how good you think Bush is (and I don't think he is near the can't miss status of Earl or OJ) you go with the QB. The Texans pick should almost entirely hinge on assessments of VY.

 

Ding ding ding !!!


Also, if people are blaming Casserly and Capers for their poor picks, why isn't Carr considered ONE of those poor picks?

The guy holds the ball forever, locks onto one receiver, and has no pocket presence, he is an adequate QB at best.

DD

 

I agree and I have been saying since before VY entered the draft or the Rose Bowl, spending your number one pick on a running back is a waste. you can not argue with those totals.

to me the only options are VY or trade.

 

^

If Carr is really this bad and we need a new QB this bad, then I hope Kubiak & company seriously consider drafting Matt Leinart.

 

WHAT ABOUT LEINART?

 

I'm not ready to give up on Carr yet. Let's give him an improved offensive line and another offensive weapon and see what happens. I think Vince is obviously a great player, but let's keep in mind that running the NFL as a QB is nothing like college and Vince had an extremely dumbed-down offense at UT-Austin.

 

grrrrr...i'm mad!!!!! grrrrrr!!!!

i'm sure leinart will get considered.

 

How can you scan the field or show pocket presence when the line can't pass block? How can you hold the ball forever when more often than not the rush is on you before you have a chance to set up? Why wouldn't you lock onto to AJ when Bradford (the worst number 2 receiver in the league) and Gaffney are your other choices? Have you noticed how much the TE is playing a role in the playoff teams passing game - we don't have one. No QB (VY included) can succeed under these circumstances. It's obvious you love VY - good for you he's a great player, but quite trashing a guy that has shown nothing but class for an organization that has done nothing to help him. In year 2 we cut our sack totals in half, what did Capers do - move the O-line coach to TE coach to bring in Pendry his good buddy - guess what the sack totals jumped right back up. Did Casserly do anything to address the line (other than overpaying for a mediocre Weigart and Wade), the WR situation - NO. They tried to darft Joppru but unfortunately he has been the most injured player in the history of the NFL. I don't love Carr, but it is absolutely absurd to make the above comments about him. My only concern with Carr is that the lack of protection has ruined him. You haven't heard him whining to the media about the lack of help or anything else for that matter.

 

What you guys are missing is that this in a once in a lifetime chance at a haromonic convergence.

Were you around for Earl's Love Ya Blue days?

Did you see Dream rise to greatness?

How did you feel when Rocket came home to lead the Astros?

I was around for all of those and it was better than sex on cocaine. It is absolutely worth whatever the the risk of taking Vince is to have a chance at that feeling again. Take anybody else and whoop-t-do you are one of 32, another team of anonymos mercenaries toiling in the name of anytown USA.

Take Vince and the Texans are our team, and we will live and die with it. Yes you can get that kind of passion by winning Super Bowls like Dallas or Pittsburgh but we could have it instantly, just by drafting one of the top players in the draft. Drafts are just big crapshoots anyway, why not go for the mega-jackpot?

 

i couldn't agree more.

if all other things are equal...it still ain't equal.

 

That doesn't sound very rational. They should draft the better player. If they think Vince won't be a superb pocket QB and they think Bush has the potential to be a total stud then they should take Bush. I am not in the mood for making this a crapshoot because of the feelings people have for Vince.

 

That is a pretty small sample size of RBs. And although there are 12 Super Bowl wins for QBs you have to also consider the teams around them. Many of them probably had great RBs.

And all of this is moot if the scouts don't rate Vince that high. Before the championship game he wasn't even coming out.

 

but it's not that big of a crapshoot. that's the point. it's not like before the Rose Bowl people were saying VY wasn't a first round pick...or even a high first round pick. people were just assuming he wasn't coming out.

the premise that bush is a sure thing and VY is a crap shoot is probably what bothers me most about this argument. they're BOTH a crap shoot. it's the NFL draft. just look down that list of #1 drafted players. you just don't know for anyone. the difference between bush and young isn't as pronounced as many of the pro-bushers think it is.

 

the reason the sample size is small is because you can get running backs anywhere in the draft. and that's my point personally.

 

Well, since VY was 2nd in Heisman voting, led his team to a perfect season, led the NCAA in passing efficiency, became first player EVER to throw for 3000 yards and rush 1000 yards, was Rose Bowl MVP, shattered the total yards in a NC game, and is a guaranteed Top 3 pick, I'm gonna go out on a limb and say the scouts do or wil rate VY that high.

Whether he was coming out or not was VY's choice. I'm sure he wanted to win a NC and a Heisman, but figured out a Heisman isn't worth everything he'd be passing up. Also, when you're projected to be a possible #1 pick to your hometown team, you would probably declare as well.

 

None of that will help Vince in the NFL, except the big game experience. The scouts will not care about his awards or stats. I am not saying he will be rated poorly or anything. But pointing out his accomplishments does not mean he will be a good prospect.