[Official] Reggie Bush or Someone else -- Vince Young out of running

Yeah... the longer you've been on these boards the more credible you are.

 

I'm just making sure this bet is still on? And can we start it now, since we all know that the Texans aren't drafting VY? (if anyone still suggests that the texans are even considering drafting VY #1 OVERALL, i'll seriously fall out of my chair in laughter).

 

That wasn't his point.

 

He left out your favorite smiley on that one.

 

I would also love to have a sig bet with anyone that we won't be drafting VY with the 1st overall and they will have to wear the sig...



for eternity.

 

I didn't mean much under 4.3, but at least right at 4.3. Otherwise I start concluding all those college guys he blows by are not an indication of what is going to happen at the next level. One indication of this could be against Texas, who has a fast college defense but not pro fast defense. He only beat the DBs to the corner on a running play 1 time, and Texas was able to handle him on passing routes with a converted safety for the most part (the same plays that obviously worked versus other teams because Leinart went there over and over). He did have two long receptions, but one was on a screen and the other a dumps in a prevent--not an indication Bush is a precise and natural receiver (not equivalent to another #1 caliber WR just lining him out there and demanding doubles as many proponents of his think). IMO your solid pro nickle or FS can cover Bush just fine in most passing routes as they do most backs.

Wild guess, but I would expect Bush (if equivalent to combine like controlled settings) to probably run at just under 4.4. I expect VY to run at the mid 4.4s. Also, at the combine I believe Bush was 5'11" and 201, a long way from 208-215.

Perhaps I am a bit extreme here (wanting Bush to not be just outstanding but Barry Sanders-like phenomlike in workouts), but to me the onus should be on him to prove the overall #1 pick should go for a running back who as spectacular as he was, played in an incredibly favorable system and whom had split duties. As a college football player, when the stake rose and when they were on the same field, VY was the more dominant player and athlete. I need more good reasons why I think Reggie Bush has more upside than VY, certainly right now I don't from what they did on the field. Thus to me (and I have seen them both lots over the course of many whole games for 2 years), Reggie Bush has every bit to prove during workouts as VY in guaging his pro future.

LenDale's plays were not just weighted to the goaline, but to most plays where you knew SC was going to run. Bush's running plays more had the advantage of being passing situations, or unpredictable situations.

I beg to differ. Marcus Allen, Emmitt Smith, Marshall Faulk, Curtis Martin, Walter Payton--all less than 215lbs and none of them would sit down on a 4th and 2 with a game (or season) on the line. Just about never would happen, period. Sanders is the exception and it was one of his limitations. But I give you if Bush is close to Sanders (and shows workouts like Sanders), sure, a #1 overall pick is warrented.

You are correct the Giants occasionally used Jacobs for Barber (which was a mistake) and the Falcons split with Dunn. (Though Portis doesn't sit in goalline despite bigger alternatives nor does Westbrook). However if Bush is in this mold or slightly better--Barber, Westbrook, Dunn and Portis--that is a good NFLer, but probably not worth the overall #1.

 

I think is is extremely doubtfull the Texans draft VY. Very remote.

But at this point I am discussing not what will they do, but what should they do.

 

Yeah but what he said made no sense. I already came back in and gave Vince and UT their credit after the Rose Bowl. I've proven myself in that department. Calling Vince an "unquestionable superstar" is not a very intelligent comment.

There is no such thing as an "unquestionable superstar" when talking about draft picks. These are guys who are yet to play a down in the NFL.

 

That's covered during freshman indoctrination -opps "orientation" class at A&M.
Whoop!!!

 

damn you're dense, i'll make it real easy. i predict VY will be a superstar, you say he'll be a bust. if i'm right you eat crow and vice versa. did that make sense? then you question if VY fans, most of whom have been here a long time would still be around this site if he's a bust. are you saying we fear the wrath of KAS13? most of us in here are big boys who can take care of ourselves. get over yourself dude.

 

I sure do! Lock up your wives!

 

I think Bush will run in the high 4.3's or right at 4.4. Like i said earlier, there's a difference between being fast and quick. Probably the main reason everyone is so high on Buihs is only two backs (Sayers and Sanders) have been able to change directions without changing speeds. That's something only LT posseses right now in the NFL and that's probably your best RB. That's what really makes him special. Check out the 40 times of all the star RB's in the league, I think you'll be suprised that most of them actually run in the 4.4's. Let's omit the Rose Bowl for this debate. Granted, it was the National Championship and UT and Vince played a great game. Bush was good not great. Point being is that it was still only one game. Dan Marino never won a superbowl. Elway didn't do it until he got TD. My point is, it's one game. Reggie Bush had a spectacular season. So did Vince. The debate can't center around one game (which it seems like it has been a little lately). Bush can be an effective receiver and he blocks well. If he gets matched up against a LB then it's over. Truth be told, most NFL CB's can cover RB's out of the backfield. Bush is training with LT (the best in the business) so I'm extremely confident that when he gets to the NFL he's going to be vastly improved in a lot of areas (not to mention prepared).


I just don't agree with this statement at all. Most of LenDale's TD's came at the goal line. That's a fact. Other then that, they spilt carries between them. Of course you noticed Bush in there more on passing downs (because he was always in) but he made plenty of big plays on running downs too. I don't think anyone would argue that LenDale was used it short yardage situations but that's not a knock on Bush. A loto f scouts think the guy is better then Williams and will be the second back taken. Splitting time with another first round pick and still accomplishing what Reggie did is something to be commended , not questioned. It's hard to stay in rythem when you're in an d out but he did because he is a game breaker (nobody can argue that either).

Payton, Smith and Martin are all power backs. So to me, that argument goes out the window. faulk and Allen didn't have another star in the same backfield with them and we are comparing the NFL to college. Who's to say that once Bush is the only guy in the backfield he won't be as effective as Faulk or Allen. I think he'll be real close to Marshall Faulk actually. Look at Faulk's 40 time.


Portis had a bunch of multiple TD games last year but wasn't consitant in the past two years. Westbrook used to split carries with Buckhalter (but he was injured). We agree on Barber and Dunn. Anyways, I think Bush will be better then all of the above so it's a moot point. However, before Gibbs turned Portis into a power back, one may have argued he was worth a number #1 pick. They got Champ Bailey for him.

The bottom line is that Vince and Reggie both had exceptional seasons and are elite athletes. Something that can't be ignored is that we obviously both have our opinions about this but the consensus is that bush is the best prospect. Vince isn't even in the mix anymore. Not to be the top QB selected and he could drop a bit. I know scouts and analysts are wrong all the time but they still have more credibility then us. That's why we are doing what we're doing for a living and they are doing what they're doing.

 

Actually, you're an idiot. I NEVER predicted Vince to be a bust. I actually predicted him to play well but my opinion is that he's 50/50. Either he'll be a star (I think he'll be a very good player) but he could end up being a flame out. I don't think there's any in between for him. Maybe before you go running your mouth you should learn how to read or follow the thread.

I'm not allowed to question certain people now? I thought this was a message board where everone was entitled to their opinion. I ate my crow already and if Vince is successful it won't make a difference in my case. Only if Bush is a bust can you speak to me about eating crow.

"Fear the wrath of KAS13", dude you're a tool. I never threatened anyone on this message board or even came across like that. Glad to know you're a "big boy". Guess what, I could careless? It seems like you're the person trying to play internet bully. Whatever you say bro, that's lame. Since you broughtit up though, I would bet everything i've got that you wouldn't take care of yourself in that instance. This is so stupid anyways, I don't know why people feel the need to pop off their mouths over the internet. You criticize IC2000 for it all the time but you do it yourself. Big frickin' hypocrite.

 

Exactly.

 

I can't seem to face up to the facts
I'm tense and nervous and I can't relax
I can't sleep cause my bed's on fire
Don't touch me I'm a real live wire

Psycho killer, qu'est que c'est
Far better
Run away
Psycho killer, que'st que c'est
Far better
Run away
Oh yeah

You start a conversation you can't seem to finish it
You're talkin' a lot but you're not sayin' anything
When I have nothing to say my lips are sealed
Say something once why say it again

Chorus

Ce que j'ai fait, ce soir la
Ce qu'elle a dit, ce soir la
Realisant, mon espoir
Je me lance vers la gloire
We are vain and we are blind
I hate people when they're not polite

Chorus

 

^Come on get that junk out of here, stick to the topic and stop picking fights.

 

Wow, what a great response from the person who started the argument. Got to love someone runs their mouth and then uses lyrics from a song when they get an angry response. What did you honestly expect? You are the dense one bro.

 

Completely agree. Look at Desert Scar and myself. We were having a great debate without any of this bs and thegary felt the need to chime in and be a smartass. Now we have a wasted page of bs. It's as much my fault for lowering myself to his level though. It's cool, I'm done with the dude. I'd rather talk to someone with a point.

 

have you been following along? reading comprehension is apalling on this site indeed. he said VY would be a bust. i said he was gonna have to eat crow. then he wavers and says it's a 50/50 chance, that he personally thought he would be good but that no one really knows etc, etc. dude is all over the place and says i'm the one picking a fight? and you agree? wow!

 

It's his opinion and you're the one trying to act all sarcastic and make fun of him. People like you need to be more mature and grow up.

You're not even on topic when you post, at least he didn't post some mindless lyric from a song. Didn't go out his way to try to make fun of somebody.

Noone wants to read that crap.