[Official] Reggie Bush or Someone else -- Vince Young out of running

Really??? All this time, I was wondering, "what camp is kas13, ic2k, big texx and trader jorge in?"

 

I heard that Mack Brown called the NFL officials and was livid. He vehemently supported Vince. Nothing new for Mack to lobby people - kinda reminds me of his lobbying of the BCS voters to get them into the Rose Bowl a couple of years ago.

So what we know is that Vince took the test the first time, and "scoring errors" were made. Hmm, that's interesting. I wonder why these errors never happen to anybody else. Then Vince gets to take the test again and scores higher. Well I would hope he would score higher the second time around!

 

TURN THOSE MACHINES BACK ON!!!!

 

You were in Indianapolis?

 

Put me in the "I think he really scored a 6 and they covered their !@#$ to keep from getting in trouble camp" as well.

Hell of a football player, dumb as an ox.

...........I wonder if Vince had to choose between Herbie and John Hancock as an answer?

 

Wow!! So you actually think the NFL is taking part in a conspiracy to cover up VY's orignial score because they are afraid he might sue? Exactly what does VY gain by suing the NFL? The answer is is NOTHING. He is still a projected Top 5 pick and would lose far more by trying to battle the NFL over a leaked test score. He knows it, his agent knows it.

So far the word is that his score was incorrectly graded. Like Vince Young, the NFL has much more to lose by trying to cover up something that isn't a big deal anyways.

Your last paragraph just shows how little your post actually means. It's not suprising to hear VY-haters believe that he indeed scored a 6 despite numerous reports that the score was incorrect. I wasn't sure what to think when I heard the new, but now that the reports are saying it was graded incorrectly, I'm not going to believe that the NFL is in some kind of conspiracy cover up.

I'm beginning to realize why you are a running joke on this board.

 

LOL!!

 

That's probably why combine officials decided to rescore everyone else's test and not just VY's.

 

Two questions for the Young is a Genius camp:

1. Is this the first year that a wonderlic test has had to have been re-graded?

2. Why do insiders continue to maintain that Young actually scored a 6?

 

I'm in the Vince 6 camp too, and I think Vince is the man, just not a very smart one. I hope he really succeeds in the NFL, I just want Reggie Bush more. And I really don't believe Casserly when he says that the score doesn't matter. Not that it matters anyway, they are not drafting him and never intended to.

 

VesceySux, what did your sources tell you today?

 

Whoever said Young is a genius? We're just think the test was graded incorrectly and according to the reports, that's exactly what happened. We also think comments like "VY is dumb, everyone knows it," or "Have you heard him talk, he must be dumb," have just as much merit as saying "We shouldn't draft D'Brick because he is ugly."

But to answer your questions:

1. When was the last time a score that low was leaked? I'm sure combine officials wanted to know A.) Who leaked the score? and B.) Was it even the right score? As said above, good thing they checked since, according to combine officials, they found out who leaked and that the test was indeed graded incorrectly.

2. I don't know why, but sometimes people believe what they want to believe and they won't change (I think this thread is a good example of just that). But as long as combine officials are saying that his test was graded incorrectly, I'm going to go with them.

 

gucci, can you at least admit that the whole situation is totally bizarre? This is nuts. First everyone says he got a 6. Then someone thought they were misquoted and it was really a 16. Then allegedly Vince took it a 2nd time and made a 16. Which is it? Amidst all of this, you have Mack Brown sticking his nose into it, as well as an outraged Young camp? Then Casserly, fearing that his #1 pick is losing value, jumping in and defending a candidate's wonderlic score? What the heck is going on?

If there ever was a potential cover-up situation, something this bizarre would be a likely candidate. That much we can agree on.

 

I would add a few things.

1) yards after contact. Most lead NFL backs produce a lot more yards after contact than Bush likely will be able to. Bush is hard as heck to contact, particularly in the open field, but has a fairly high center of gravity and doesn't break a lot of tackles nor push piles compared to other elite runners. It was really obvious in the Rose Bowl, the difference in what White or Young did after contact was vast.

2) I think stevel completely understimates the inside running issue and Da Man too easily dismisses it as well. Against Texas, Bush got the corner in a big way on a run play 1 time. Texas is a fast college defense, but no where near the speed of pro defense. Further, SC had incredible blocking all season--LenDale benefited form it greatly too (almost 7 yard average despite being their short yardage and goalline guy). Remember all 7 of the primary blockers of SC (including TE and FB) are draft prospects, and 3 of the 5 available this year will be drafted by the 2nd round--they have overmatched everyone for 2 years including Texas. The hole was almost always where it is supposed to be and usually very big--it didn't take what I'll real good innate feel for when to be patient for a hole and when to not. Countless NFL backs seem good in all the pre-draft numbers (speed, strength, college rushing) but just find producing in an NFL game a diffirent story--it requires is a lot more finese in tight space (see Curtis Martin) than speed or even strengh, though both the latter are also nice to have if you have the former. Bush rarely had to produce out of an average play, let alone in a bad or negative play (why I hate the Sanders comparisons, who could turn bad plays into great plays like noone else, be it college or pros).

I will say Bush has a phenom burst (1st 10 yards), has great balance, and is extrordinarily elusive--that gives him the chance to be a great NFLer. But I think the questions for him as a workhorse are well founded, as his being an NFL workhorse worthy of a #1 type pick. NFLers are talking about the concern as well.

It doesn't mean Bush won't or can't be a workhorse, or that he won't be a dominant every down back who you can hand it over and over too for 1st downs. But he has growth to do as a football player and you just don't know. Further, to say he is as sure thing as Faulk or Sanders or Dorsett--guys who I think you hope Bush will duplicate in the NFL--I think is a big stretch. Those guys had much heavier loads, much longer track records, with much bigger targets on the chest and with inferior help (whenever Bush was in there you always had to be prepared for a pass and try to cover match-up nightmares like Jarrett and Byrd in addition to Bush). IMO Bush has been in the ideal situation to showcase his exceptional talents, but also to cover his limitations. Maybe the limitations are modest, and maybe they are much bigger than his proponents are ready to admit and in turn him make him much more of a utility/speciality player in the NFL than an elite all around tailback. His talent and potential is great, but he certainly isn't the surest thing to ever come around as an RB prospect, anyone saying that is fooling themselves IMO.

But then I am a Bush-hater according to some folks. Actually I don't have a big problem with the Texans drafting him. But I don't think they should use the 1st pick to do it (lots of extra money and maybe lost opper costs for someone who is desperate to take their top rated QB and give the Texans comp to move down), and definetly want to see VY and RBush workout before being firm.

 

Oh, sh*t. I knew I forgot to do something today. Thanks for reminding me.

 

There are conspiracy theorists everywhere, so this isn't much of a surprise. If you want to believe Charlie Casserly, Floyd Reese, NFL sources, NFL spokespeople, and others are all part of a huge burnt orange conspiracy, more power to you guys.

But, let's put all that aside. Even if, in the completely insane hypothetical that the "6" was valid... how on earth did he score a 16 the second time?

The Wonderlic is essentially an IQ test. It's hard to study for. Either you know the material, or you don't. And don't tell me how Vince memorized some of the questions to do better the second time. If he really, legitimately scored a 6, that's illiterate. Borderline mental r****dation. If that's the case, I'm really doubting that he was able to memorize multiple questions that he saw for 12 minutes at the most.

IQ tests are meant to be replicable. You shouldn't have wide variances from one test to the next if taken by the same person. Not even if it's immediately afterward. On rare occasions, some players have increased their Wonderlic... McNabb supposedly went from 12 to 16, and Culpepper from 15 to 21. But to go from 6 to 16... that's almost triple his previous score. How realistic is that?

Any test random enough to produce extreme variances like that from the same person is not a reliable indicator and thus (in that scenario) couldn't and shouldn't be taken seriously by anyone. So, for the biased folks out there that somehow still believe Vince legitimately scored a 6... could y'all explain to me how this test has any validity whatsoever if he can almost triple his score on a second test?

 

Easily. If he didn't pace himself properly the first time, he could have left a lot blank. The second time around he manages his time better.

 

Good post. But the 6 to 16 is nearly triple and its almost double. Not to mention its easy to "triple" a 6. You are right that he almost tripled it, but bud light might have half as many carbs as miller light (2.5 to 4.5). I am not sure what the company is but I have seen it before. Good point except for the triple thing.

 

also a very good point, and most likely what happened. Many have said Vince wasn't "prepared" , I heard someone talking about this same thing bigtexx said today (possibly richard justice)

 

Living in Austin i've heard a million interviews with VY and he's a bright guy ~ no way in hell he scored a 6 on that test.



Hey ic2000 remember the last guy you belittled after he scored a 6 on the wonderlic?