Agree re: grandparents. Why doesn't the man have any input? Is a 9 month pregnancy more burdensome than 18 years of labor for someone else? Or (if the guy is decent and decides he has responsibilities that exceed child support) having to be a father (much more than a paycheck) when you don't want to be one? Or, if the man really wants the child, losing the child so that the woman is not burdened for nine months? What if the man's belief system is such that he truly and completely believes to his core that the fetus is a person from conception and believes his child is being murdered? Is that kind of psychological torture really dwarfed by carrying a child for nine months in all situations? I know: it is her body. But a man may have to continue to use his body in a trade or employment he doesn't want just to comply with law re: child support. If a court determines in that judge's infinite wisdom that a man is shirking work or purposefully underemployed to avoid child support, the man is screwed. So, is indentured servitude ok? (Yes, I get the law puts the child's interest first. And yes, I see the policy reasons for that. But at a certain point, leave my body alone starts to sound like leave my life alone from a man's perspective and that gets zero traction.) So, I know it doesn't sound like I support Roe, but I do. I just can't reconcile how badly the man gets screwed if he disagrees either way with the woman.
You're missing my point and you're leading directly into what im stating. Pro Lifers are energized because they believe the evil lefties are trying to allow late term abortions, up until delivery of the fetus/baby whatever you want to call it. Pro choice take the extreme side and state the religious right are evil because they want to prohibit abortion in the case of rape, incest and other extreme situations. Neither are the crux of the debate. Its the extremist on both sides who are dictating the debate. Outside of the extremist, the vast majority agree there are circumstances where abortion should be allowed. And the same majority will agree that killing a healthy baby/fetus seconds before birth is wrong. I dont care if Roe vs Wade gets overturned. The states will retain the right to dictate their abortion laws. If you dont like your states law, then either work to change the laws or leave. If one wants to genuinely debate the issue, then discuss the grey. If ones argument is that its just a 'clump of cells' minutes before birth, then I would say they are being disingenuous to the discussion. Just as I would say one is being disingenuous if they claim conception is a baby. Sadly this is where most of the discussions start and end.
Many women cannot "leave" the state they live in and "change the laws" will not address woman's current situation. So many women will be faced with the same situation they were faced with before Roe v Wade.
John Roberts is the ONLY person that matters in this WHOLE thing. He will decide if Roe v. Wade is overturned. He surprised with Obamacare, will he do it again?
The easy thing would be to make a joke about tomi lahran and suddenly agreeing with her, but word is that she has always been pro=choice which resulted in her getting fired from the glenn beck show...
It's not a rumor. That's exactly what happened. For all the crowing conservatives do about tHe ToLeRaNt LeFt they sure do seem to eat their own on the issue of babies, bullets, and the Bible. V2: reproduction, rifles, and religion?
It’s called a joke. You are debating about whether or not sperm cells have a heart beat. This is where we are America.
The fact that you really think that I was suggesting laws against jerking off tells you everything we need to know about who is delusional.
I understood what you stated and agreed to it without saying so. You didn't seem to understand what I was stating. Without pointing out that those extremes are noise here, I simply pointed back to what I believe is important - the intent of the law, which is to overturn Roe. While people get worked up on the no exception for rape and incest, it was a necessary inclusion for the overturn of Roe on the basis of fetus as a person. There has been a few pages of discussion on that and it's not as simply or non-grey as you think - that if Roe is overturned it would simply end up in the state. We discussed exactly that point and one of the argument is that the state would have no said so, which naturally then would have much far reaching consequences then intended, or maybe as intended. The extra info I pointed about preg due to rape and a high # of abortion related to rape is just data and nothing more. Hopefully that put some context around the 1%, but in the scheme of thing here, that is not important.
The rest of the country will continue to laugh at the conservatives. Imagine living in a hell hole like Alabama
senator collins isn't the only one trying to distance herself from this... Senate Republicans running away from Alabama abortion law https://thehill.com/homenews/senate/444169-senate-republicans-running-away-from-alabama-abortion-law
the right to kill the unborn is the holy sacrament of the left, Planned Parenthood is their temple they will go to the mattresses to protect it, it is nonnegotiable
It boggles my mind a rape victim can't choose... especially when other WOMEN agree she can't choose. Are people worried about her sincerity in claiming a crime occurred or what ?? R is one of the worst things ever. I don't even like typing/saying the word.
I think that SCOTUS either needs to kick the whole thing back to the states or set a more rigid guideline, on a when does the right to life take priority, instead of where it is right now which is now leading to all sorts of reactionary pushes. Something around the 16 week mark (whatever the science is saying re development), is something that probably wouldn't make anyone happy, but would be a liveable compromise.
Like the opinion peace in cnn. If so many people are pro life then why are the same people for the death penalty like Alabama. https://www-m.cnn.com/2019/05/16/op...risy-parini/index.html?r=https://www.cnn.com/
You should really make more friends on the left and get to know them. You should also learn more about the actual holistic work of planned parenthood, given your interest in the topic. Cheers.
the right to say **** you to the living is the Right's tradition https://www.newsweek.com/alabama-abortion-ban-mother-child-health-care-1426643
3 things we should all be in agreement about if we really care about the babies and mothers Provinding 100% publicly funded access and information to contraceptives for all (hey a program like medicare for all could do this). Vastly improving sex ed in all schools, having mass campaigns for both parents and teens to de-stigmatize sex and the use of contraception methods as much as possible. Vastly improving education overall amongst poorer communities, the more educated one is the less likely they are to become pregnant and have an abortion. Those with college educations have the lowest rates of abortions, perhaps we can find a way to make public colleges more accessible for everyone through better primary/secondary schooling, as well as more programs to make college significantly cheaper for those who cannot afford it, if not make it entirely publicly funded. I imagine these points should be a given to everyone who cares about this subject, but I feel some would have a problem with one, or all of these points.
