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German Chancellor Angela Merkel announces she will stand down

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by MojoMan, Oct 29, 2018.

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What is better in your view, Nationalism or Globalism?

  1. Nationalism

    6 vote(s)
    40.0%
  2. Globalism

    9 vote(s)
    60.0%
  1. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    She is losing electoral support in Germany because of her globalist open borders and political correctness agendas, both of which people across Europe and here in the United States are rejecting in rather spectacular manner.

    But support for globalism is apparently alive and well in this forum. In fact, I would not be surprised if you support that agenda yourself.
     
  2. Ottomaton

    Ottomaton Contributing Member
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    Forget it, he's rolling.

     
  3. Raz

    Raz Member

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    Interesting, where did you get that from? Some first hand information: None of your assumptions are close to reality. Reasons for Merkel's party and her coalition partners to lose ground mainly have to do with interal scuffles and stagnancy in relevant topics like digitalisation, gentrification, pollution or the emergency in nursing jobs. "Open borders" is more of a topic in Greece, Italy and Spain, can't remember anyone even talk about political correctness when it came to the recent state elections in Bavaria and Hesse. Merkel has been in charge since 2005, after such a long time a lot voters tend to change.

    And why would I support nationalism, when the EU granted peace and economic stability for over 70 years in core Europe? If someone knows to what nationalism leads, it is us.
     
  4. Spooner

    Spooner Member

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    Fail
     
  5. AroundTheWorld

    AroundTheWorld Insufferable 98er
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    To be fair, her reduced popularity has a lot to do with her decisions in the refugee crisis, and her stubborn refusal to reverse course (which also strengthened the far right party AfD, and which is in contrast to many other sudden changes of direction in her politics). Still, the poll question seems only very vaguely related to the topic of her stepping down.

    In my personal opinion, it is high time she leaves. I met her recently and had a chat with her. She is friendly enough, but as I stated above, I don't think her decisions with regard to opening the borders and not enforcing the law have been the right ones.

    But when I look around in the world and I see "leaders" such as Erdogan, Putin, Trump, Duterte, Bolsonaro (not to even mention MBS and the crazy guys in Venezuela), she seems much less bad compared to those guys.

    I hope that either Spahn or Merz will be the successor. And I hope that Germans turn away from AfD and the illiberal leftists. I'm ready for more liberalism (FDP) combined with enough law and order to make us feel safe.
     
    Yung-T and B-Bob like this.
  6. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    The UK Guardian believes Angela Merkel will probably struggle to make it through the next three years as Chancellor of Germany, especially once a new head of her CDU party is elected this December. If the Guardian editorial board is correct, this announcement is just the first step in the reorganization of government control and political power distribution in Germany in the months to come:

     
  7. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Don Murray at the CBC (Canadian Broadcast Corporation) agrees with how tenuous Merkel's position as Chancellor for another three years is likely to be. He then takes that concern to the next level with some insightful observations about how this and the recent election results are poised to upset the governing coalition in Germany, and after that possibly the balance of power in the European Union.

    The Social Democrats (SPD) have traditionally been basically a left-socialist leaning party. Merkel's CDU has traditionally been, in European terms, a moderate right party. In the current grand coalition the CDU/CSU and the SD have formed an unnatural political alliance in large part as a defense of the EU's open borders immigration policy, which the people of Europe are increasingly rejecting.

    The SPD and the CSU have been decimated in recent elections and the CDU's setbacks have also been quite substantial. If the current grand coalition falls apart, as the author of the article above appears to be predicting, then it appears likely that the new government will "shift right" which in means that they will respect the national sovereignty of Germany and the will of the people over the elites more than the current globalist leaning government of Germany under Angela Merkel's leadership has in recent years.

    Without the commitment of Germany to the open borders immigration policy of the EU, other countries in the EU, most who are also under extreme pressure from their citizens to reverse these policies, are not likely to remain committed to these policies either.

    This could be the beginning of the unraveling of the globalist policies of the EU and maybe of the entire EU itself.
     
  8. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    Could you define "globalism"?

    I am generally confused.
     
  9. BruceAndre

    BruceAndre Member

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  10. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Over half of all Germans believe the SPD (Social Democrats) should abandon their coalition with Merkel's CDU party. This will bring down the German government if this happens and could well trigger new federal elections, which are not likely to strengthen the hands of either of these two traditionally powerful parties.

    Of course the elephant in the room is the contest between globalism vs nationalism, especially when it comes to immigration and trade, not only in Germany, but across the EU. Sound familiar? These are the same issues that Donald Trump successfully campaigned on to become the current president of the United States. And they are also the same issues which have brought down the primary de-facto leader of Europe, German Chancellor Angela Merkel.
     
  11. Eric Riley

    Eric Riley Contributing Member

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    Post a poll with two restricting options. See the results. Complain.

    You really are insufferable. At least RocketsLegend is entertaining.

    Edit: Ignore list just got longer.
     
  12. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    The race to replace Angela Merkel as head of the CDU is underway, and it is immensely important.

    It appears that there are three candidates for the position that are primarily being considered at this point, including the apparent early frontrunner Friedrich Merz, Angela Merkel's apparent hand=pcicked choice Annegret Kramp-Karrenbauer and Jens Spahn, who is regarded as the preferred candidate of the "far right" of the CDU. We should keep in mind that the CDU has been losing support from its right flank to the AfD party, which has been growing rapidly on a platform of controlling and restricting immigration in Germany.

    Merz appears to be an extremely talented national leader in Germany who enjoys great respect from members of the CDU party. He is currently not serving in the German government as a result of losing a power struggle with Merkel back in 2002.
     
    #32 MojoMan, Oct 31, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2018
  13. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Here is a quote from a good article on the leading candidate to head the CDU, Frederich Merz from DW (Detsche Welle).

    Anyone getting a slight feeling of deja vu here? No, Merz is not Donald Trump, and only an imbecile will try to imply that he is. But here is a guy who is not afraid to confront the forces of "Identity politics" and "Political correctness" and who appears ready to change course on immigration control and border enforcement, if he is given the reigns.

    As the polls in my previous post show, Merz has the early support of the people to take over this role. Also, as all recent elections in Germany over the last few years have shown, the German people have had enough of this open borders agenda. They want their country back.
     
  14. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Frederich Merz spoke out today and did not mince words. If Merz takes over the head of the CDU, this will no longer be Angela Merkel's Germany. Bloomberg reports on Merz's comments today.

    So, a couple of important observations here. Countering the rise towards populism with a push to emphasize national identity just means making it OK to be proud of being a German. It means taking what has been outside of the government and bringing that into the agenda of the government.

    From there fringe extremists who are trying to hijack the "nationalist" agenda in an effort to promote a racist or anti-German globalist agenda can be dealt with and presumably marginalized, while people who want what is best for the country and the citizens of Germany will be unified in their goals and priorities. Just like we are when we pledge to protect and defend the constitution of the United States.

    Also, this is politically a strategy that is likely to be as effective as Trump's strategy to champion middle-America by protecting our borders and revisiting our unfair trade agreements. If Merz is elected as head of the CDU and then calls snap elections, he will re-incorporate the followers of the AfD back into the CDU with probably as dramatic of an effect as Trump winning the rust belt states during the 2016 election.

    It is "on," people. I do not understand how it is that most other people here in this forum and across our country do not find all of this as interesting and as fascinating as I do.
     
  15. Raz

    Raz Member

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    Don't think so. Whoever strongly disagreed with her refugee politics voted the Nazis anyways, but CDU/CSU/SPD constantly lost in polls within the last few months and all voter interviews confirm, that migration and refugees wasn't that much of a topic and hence responsible for their loss of around 10%. In fact, CSU tried to copy the Nazis and potrayed themselves as the law-and-order-party with explicit language towards migrants and refugees, yet they still lost big time due to Horst Seehofer's crazyness and Markus Söder being the unaware ******* that he is.

    Agree with you though, that Merkel has missed the right moment to step down.

    Beware. Merz is part of a company that was involved in the c*m-c*m/c*m-ex fraud, which cost us around 50 billion Euro (that we know of). Not the kind of person you want to give power. Pretty obvious more a lobbyist than a politician. Same goes for Spahn and Linder. They don't give a **** about poor people and have nothing to offer to solve the problems I mentioned above, them in charge would mean our government works even more for the corporations and not for the people, so the social segregation advances further ahead.
     
  16. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    Really the question is

    What is better?

    Globalism: Acceptance of people unlike you
    Nationalism: Rejection of people unlike you
     
    mdrowe00 likes this.
  17. mdrowe00

    mdrowe00 Member

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    ...when you put it like that...kinda shoots holes in all that "...we are all one human race..." stuff, don't it?:D
     
  18. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    Again with the racism. Par for the course.
     
  19. MojoMan

    MojoMan Member

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    With Angela Merkel on the way out, so is her vision for the EU. They wanted to build a "Politically correct," United States of Europe, compliant and committed to the globalist orthodoxy of the Neo-marxist left. But it turns out the individual nations are just too diverse and their peoples are not sufficiently deferential to the plans of their elitist "betters" to make this experiment work.

    Here is an excellent article discussing evaluating Chancellor Merkel's effect on the EU and the Eurozone, and the effect of her departure on the EU in political terms. Given the unrest in places like Italy, Poland, and Greece, not to mention the UK or Germany, or the effect of US policies under President Trump, this is turning into a very difficult situation for the EU that does not appear to have a clear or easy solution.

     
  20. Bobbythegreat

    Bobbythegreat Member
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    I dunno about that, I would bet her vision for the EU has more staying power than you'd think.
     
    MojoMan and justtxyank like this.

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