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Young over Bush

Discussion in 'Houston Texans' started by rhester, Dec 30, 2005.

  1. Hey Now!

    Hey Now! Member

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    between the guy who started this thread slowly changing his opinion over the course of 2-3 posts to this gibbering nonsense, this has to be the lamest thread in the history of cf... if not the world.
     
  2. Rocketman95

    Rocketman95 Hangout Boy

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    I like the accuracy. But, what else would you expect from the leader in passing efficiency in the NCAA?
     
  3. meh

    meh Member

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    The problem with college stats is that sometimes they translate VERY BADLY to the pros. There's a reason why most Hesiman trophy winners never amount to much, if any, at the next level. I agree that you don't need to have perfect throwing motion, or the strongest arm. But just looking at VY's throw, and compare them to good NFL QBs, and you can see a huge gap in passing skills. He doesn't have the accuracy to throw into tight coverage. He doesn't have good timing on his passes. And there's no zip on the ball. He also gets almost no pressure due to his O-Line and incredible UT running game. Neither of which he figures to get as a Texan.

    I don't think Rose Bowl will settle anything. USC's defense isn't all that great even by college standards. Even if Young can run all over them, it still doesn't mean he can outrun NFL defenders. Remember when he tried to run against AJ Hawk and the rest of that OSU defense? He didn't have much success after they figured him out. When you run outside like Young does so much, fast linebackers and safeties can beat you to the corner.
     
  4. gucci888

    gucci888 Member

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    Agreed. I know stats don't tell the whole story, but in all honesty, you can't be the NCAA's highest rated passer unless you can pass the ball. I agree that our O-Line gives VY a lot of time, but I wouldn't exactly call our running game incredible.

    The same could be said for any player going into the NFL, even Reggie. He loves to cut it outside and beat the offense to the sidelines. The difference is that defenses will be keying in on Reggie to stop the run, VY probably won't get as much attention from the LB's trying to stop the WRs, RBs, TEs.

    We've seen Carr run quite a bit and be able to gain 8-10 yards and getting out of bounds w/o being touched, and if he can gain that type of yardage, imagine what VY could get.
     
  5. topfive

    topfive CF OG

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    The scary thing to me about VY's passing is that semi-sidearm motion. That's the thing that's going to scare pro teams away. Sure, he's 6'5", but that throwing motion means he'll have a lot of passes batted down in the NFL, where everybody is taller and quicker than in college. Plus, it's easy for Vince to remain calm and collected -- he plays behind the best O-line in the country. Put him behind the Texans' O-line with a few NFL monsters coming at him and he's going to get happy feet in no time.

    I heard some NFL scout on TV say that Bush is the best running back coming out of college in at least 30 *years*. I love Vince and think he'll be better as a pro than Vick or (the most obvious comparison) Randall Cunningham, but I wouldn't take him over Bush.
     
  6. bplld

    bplld Member

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    I will take this chance to complain about the hiesman. If young played more during games, rather than sitting out 4th and 3rd quarters so often, than he would easily have won. In many games, the horns blew the score up really bad, and looked on pace to score 100 points, and that just lead to young sitting the rest of the game. Because of this, the one bad game young had, against A&M, cost him the hiesman.
     
  7. Preston27

    Preston27 Member

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    So let's say Young took half the snaps, Bush was sharing the carries about 50/50 with White.
     
  8. topfive

    topfive CF OG

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    Check your stats -- Young RARELY sat out at the end of games, even when the Horns were far ahead. Nordgren, the #1 backup, threw 11 passes all year, and only rushed 12 times. I was always blown away by how long Mack Brown left Young in the games after they were already decided.

    Young didn't win the Heisman because we stumbled a bit in late-season, nationally televised games. In those same types of games, Bush had his best performances of the year. THAT is what decided the Heisman race.
     
  9. gucci888

    gucci888 Member

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    Do you even watch UT football? Any person that did would know that VY only stayed in the 4th quarter in like 3-4 games. Only games VY stayed in was Ohio State, a little of the 4th quarter vs. OkSt., I think he played the entire game vs. OU, stayed in vs. A&M.

    You can't look at how many times Nordgren passed the ball because Mack doesn't want to stop the clock w/ incomplete passes. In those blowouts, we almost exclusively ran the ball in the 3rd and 4th quarters to run the clock. And who cares about how many times he ran? Not sure how many teams would want Nordgren running the ball.

    Do you even watch UT football? Any person that did would know that VY only played in the 4th quarter in like 3-4 games. Only games VY stayed in was Ohio State, a little of the 4th quarter vs. OkSt., and A&M.

    Vs Lousiana La: Played 1st series of 3rd quarter and out.
    Vs Rice: Played 1st series of 3rd quarter and out.
    Vs Mizzou: Played until 4th quarter I think.
    Vs Colorado: Barely played in the 4th.
    Vs TT: Played most of the 4th.
    Vs Baylor: Played 1st series of 3rd quarter and out.
    Vs Kansas: Same
    Vs Colorado: Same

    I'm not saying VY should have won the Heisman over Bush, but VY didn't play in the end of a lot of games. You are completely wrong.
     
    #29 gucci888, Dec 31, 2005
    Last edited: Dec 31, 2005
  10. TigerBait

    TigerBait Member

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    Thats really funny man.
     
  11. insane man

    insane man Member

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    did you just call davis a great young back? he's mediocre. average. normal. at best. he's nothing near great.

    frankly i dont think you take a qb or back. simply because those aren't our most pressing issues. i think both carr and davis can be decent given the right opportunity. and you dont need a great qb to be great. however you do need a great line. and hence D'Brick is where its at.
     
  12. ima_drummer2k

    ima_drummer2k Member

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    Is VY even coming out this year? I'll bet he stays.
     
  13. IC2000

    IC2000 Contributing Member

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    He is no longer the leader in efficiency
     
  14. IC2000

    IC2000 Contributing Member

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    It doesn't matter, even if he was playing at the end they would not be trying to score
     
  15. DVauthrin

    DVauthrin Member

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  16. Uprising

    Uprising Member

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    ummmm yeahhhhhhhh

    I like play like every man.

    But I don't think I have the making of going for Young before Bush.

    If there's grass on the playing field, game on.
     
  17. gucci888

    gucci888 Member

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    Ya, but the poster said that VY rarely sits out at the end of games which is untrue.

    VY did get overtaken yesterday by Ryan Carpenter of AzSt. Hopefully he'll take that position back after the 4th. :)
     
  18. DVauthrin

    DVauthrin Member

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    Rudy Carpenter started all of 5 regular season games and a bowl game against Rutgers. He got mop up duty in 3 other regular season games. In fact, the NCAA.org website says that you have to play in 75%(I'm guessing you have to receive the bulk of the snaps because 8 games would qualify if they accepted his 3 mop up games.) of your team's games, and Carpenter is not listed.
     
  19. IC2000

    IC2000 Contributing Member

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    http://sports.espn.go.com/ncf/statistics

    Radio is 2nd
     
  20. DVauthrin

    DVauthrin Member

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    His name is Vince. Try using it.

    Secondly, Carpenter did not appear on the NCAA official website's stats listing when I checked. I apologize for that mistake. Still, 3 of Carpenter's 9 games played are mop up games like I posted above, so it's debatable whether he should really qualify anyways, but he does.
     

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