Other than Kidd and Nash, who fits the bill as the M.Bibby of this trade? Plus that was a no brainer, Anyone would take Bibby over J will,well anyone except Memphis
Kings traded Jason Williams because they realized he didn't fit Webber's game. Will the Rockets' management have the same foresight to make a move? I suggest you watch the Suns game again to see why Steve and Yao do not complement each on the court.
Jeff McInnis is an FA this offseason. Nothing would make me happier than to sign Jeff McInnis, then trade Francis for Ray Allen or Rashard Lewis.
Not sure it's possible but it's one of the better suggestions I've seen. Unfortunately, the best info I have shows the Cavs with a $3.6m team option for 2004-05. Rashard at SFwd allows you to play JJ at the 2 (and/or bring Mobley of the bench). Plus, when teams go small and try to press like PHX just did, you slide Lewis to PF and JJ back the 3. I haven't read every post in this thread but those of you who are proposing adding Iverson to the Rockets need to do some serious critical analysis of how Iverson would impact Yao's development, team chemistry ("it's about practice"), why Larry Brown gave up and moved on, why the Sixers were nearly .500 during Iverson's recent injuries and the fact that Iverson makes half again more than Francis over the same length of time. I'll skip the expletives but...NO!
I am sorry but people who want A.I. over Steve are serious IDIOTS...This guy has a huge heart and plays hard but is a knucklehead who thinks he is better than any system, any coach and most players in the NBA. This guy didn't suit up b/c he wasn't going to start???? What a joke, and you complain about Steve not passing, what are you going to say when he jacks up 30 shots anight just to score 25 pts. Peace.
I knew I'd generate a response such as this when I made my feelings known. AI comes from a different culture and is a very prideful guy who does not suffer fools (Chris Ford, the 76er organization) nor tolerates any disrespect tossed his way. I don't want this to become a debate on AI because as I posted, given the current dimwitted state of the Rockets organization, such a bold move will never ever occur. That said, for the past 5 years I have been watching as many Philly games as possible via Directv because AI is one of my favorite players to watch (T-Mac & KG are two others). No one in the league today can match his guts and desire. He's been stuck playing on some pretty bad teams - even by Eastern Conference standards - yet he's never whined nor pulled the kind of crap that Alex Rodriegez just did up here to get to a better team. All he's ever done is played his heart out night in and night out and the results back this up: NBA scoring champion, League MVP, Olympian. Forget his looks - forget the tatoos - forget the braids - this guy is a WARRIOR on the court. That's why I admire him. The last guy who played with this level of will and determination was Michael Jordan. That's exactly the kind of player this team needs - someone who knows exactly what it takes to win and is willing to pay the price and do what it takes to be a champion. That does not describe SF, Mobley, Taylor or any of the other dweebs that inhabit the roster. SF & Mobley are nowhere near this guy's level although I'm certain that Stevie "a legend in his own mind" Fancy considers himself to be AI's peer and equal. Come this Friday night take a good hard look at SF's "act" against GS and then catch AI's performance on Saturday against the Heat and you'll come to understand my position.
Allen Iverson 38.7 FG% Steve Francis 39.7 FG% Allen Iverson 6.8 asst/4.3 TO (From the SG position) Steve Francis 6.0asst/3.6TO (From the PG position) Allen Iverson 2.4stl Steve Francis 1.6stl Allen Iverson 74.7% on 9.5 FTA Steve Francis 76.3% on 5.3 FTA Allen Iverson 3.7reb Steve Francis 5.5reb Allen Iverson: One Finals Appearance Steve Francis: No playoff appearances Allen Iverson has more playoff appearances, more international appearances, attracts more fans, and has more heart than everyone in the NBA. Now, MAAAAAAAAAAAAYBE that doesn't make up for his bad practice habits... But to say it's dumb to choose Iverson over Francis.. Well, that's dumb.
He's no knuckleheaded player but this isn't the place to argue about his flareup with Chris Ford who BTW was wrong but who's apparently following orders. The Sixer organization wants to move AI so they are trying to turn their fans against him (good luck with all that). SF & Mobley are knuckleheads because they commit the same mistakes over and over and over. Come Friday night, they will be making the same F'ups that they did on Monday. Nothing will have changed - nothing ever changes with these two. Iverson is a great player does not consider himself to be above the system or the coach but that's what the media would have you believe (Sure he had problems with Larry Brown but so do a lot of players). It's funny in a way because of his culture and looks, AI is always portrayed as a bad guy - a thug - just because he doesn't fit the image that many folks consider to be acceptable. Well, Kobe was the NBA poster child for the squeaky clean "boy next door" and we all know now how much of an illusion that turned out to be. So image is nothing. What matters are results. Night in and night out, Iverson produces results. That's something that neither SF nor Mobley can attest because night in and night out, you never know what you are going to get from these two bozos. In Philly, AI has to jack up 30 shots because he's carrying the scoring load for the entire team. Here paired with JJ and Yao, he would not be carrying the full offensive load. He'd be playing with a superior big man in the post - something he hasn't had at Philly. Plus, AI can do the one thing that SF can't and that's move without the ball. IF SF is not a true PG and you have to choose between AI & SF as your SG, who is the better player at that position? After 5 years, I am forced to conclude that SF is what he is and that to continue to hold out hope that he will somehow "get it one day" is an exercise in futility - one that I am no longer willing to engage.
Kings traded Jason Williams for Mike Bibby. Lakers use Fisher as point guard, traded Van Excel. At the year Lakers rebuilt, they traded Eddie Jones, Elden Campbell, Van Excel. Moral: You need guts to give up great players and assemble a team with proper players who fit the system.
depends on what you mean by "producing results"...yeah he scores 50 pts every now and then....this means nothing if you lose the game, partly cuz you take crappy shots all night with your teammates wide open.... You think our gards have problems? try convincing Iverson to pass the ball to yao...
You picked three successful examples, but there are more failures in the NBA by doing that. Plus, Francis was the Franchise player before Yao's arrival, neither J. Williams, nor NVE was qualified for that lable. Do you remember how long did it take the Kings & LA to make the change? I believe they let them played a couple seasons before made the trade. We haven't had a full season yet, all you "experts" already declare "Francis doesn't fit"!
Franchise has been playing better as of late. He has certainly passed the ball more, driving and dishing out to the shooters. It seems as if he is adapting to JVG's system, albeit slowly. The only problem I have with Steve is that he's never been a pass first player. Perhaps he is learning that nuance of the game in this stage of his career. Franchise is one of the best ball handlers in the league and one of the most explosive. I think he should capitalize on this speed and strength by driving to the paint more and initiating body contact. There have been several instances I've seen where he drives and dishes out where he could've initiated body contact and drew a foul.
Although I have been a Rockets fan for long long time, I couldn't watch their games regularly because I don't live in the States. From the games I could watch, I have to admit that SF3 is a player with great athleticism and passion in the game. Yes, he's not perfect, and he makes boneheaded plays from time to time, but really, the fire and desire in the game from him really bars noone in the league. Skills or discipline can be taught, but the heart can not be. I understand the frustration for Rockets fans, spoiled by Dream's dominance, had to settle for mediocracy for the past 4 years. They, including me, sometimes scratch heads hard and puzzle by the poor decision making from our guards, or lack of aggression of Ming, or poor shooting of Cato. But hey, that's why we have been medioc for the past years. Now, we finally see some lights, with Ming's development, guards' adaption to JVG's system and build-up of team confidence. Those are all the improvement we asked for long long time. Are we there yet, hell no. But is it really a good idea to rebuild from scratch? I don't think so, why would we take away the chance to prove from an improving group? Not to mention, the Rockets team, who we rooted for, due to different reasons Can we solve all the problems with one trade, SF3 against a far less talented but disciplined and pure traditional PG? I would argue that. Lots of names came up on this board, like Eric Snow or AI. Snow is not talented at all, although he's very disciplined, but if you want to be a real contender, not to settle for mediocracy, I wouldn't think of him at all. I belive I watched more eastern conference games than some of those brought up his name. AI is a different story, he's a brave guy with great passion and talent. Many raptor fans keep asking why VC can't do that But he peaked, injuries affected his game a lot lately. If he wants to pass, yes he can do it great, look at the all-star games and Olympic games. But his temper could be a big problem. Maybe he will be flourish with Ming and Rockets again, and he deperately wants to win a ring, that he would defer and sacrifice to achieve that, I believe. But still there is no guarantee for a sure success. And you have to go through adaption etc again. I watched last night's Raptors-Jazz game. Carlos Aroyos (?) was great at the beginning, but the Raptors came back, led by VC and Jalen Rose, he somehow paniced and made some boneheaded play. With limited talent, everyone played to their upper limit with Sloan's system, and you have to give Sloan credit. Jazz has only AK47 as a star calibar player, was not able to withstand the Raptors' came back. What does that tell you? Talent is very very important to success in NBA, and it can not be taught. Yes, lots of young kids failed with super talent, becuase they were unable to learn to be better within certain system. But there is no player success without talent. Hinrich or Aroyos look promising, but they are not tested and proved, with the regular season closing, some of the young teams are going to struggle, because pressure is not easy to handle. It's a learning process. That's why I would not want to start over again, especially when I see clear improvement in the team, even they are not there yet, which is clearly shown in the Suns game. But I am willing to give them more time. Lots of people said that we already gave them 4 years. But it's different. Coz there wasn't change in the past 4 years, not to blame Rudy, but they basically played the same game in the past 4 years. Basically they didn't learn anything. This is the year, they finally are learning to have a system, and play within a certain system. Let's just cheer for them.
But, hey, do you really think that you can just trade Francis for someone who is a better point guard and the perfect fit for Yao? Any one in their right mind would consider the answer obvious: NOT A CHANCE. Ok, do you really believe that it's a complete impossibility that we could trade Francis for a Kirk Hinrich or a Brent Barry? Both of those guys would be better fits for the Rockets and we would get an additional player or players in the deal. It's not just about raw ability, it's about how the players fit with each other and their value relative to their salary. Francis is a max player that doesn't complement our best player. We're not getting max player value out of him. If you play a zone and pack it in to stop Yao, then you also stop Francis...simple as that. We're not going to have Yao stand out at the 3 pt line, so the middle isn't going to be open for drives. Now, on the other hand if you put a Hinrich or Barry out there with Yao, he'd make teams pay for packing it in on Yao. Both are also better passers than Francis and smarter players. Heck, we might even actually run a decent fast break. Sane's suggestion of Rashard Lewis and Luke Ridnour for Steve? Sign me up. Hinrich and Chandler? I'll take that one too. Of course, in a dream world, I do a three way and end up with both Hinrich and Lewis. There's lot's of moves that we could make that would make us a better team and everybody has their own opinion on what the right one is, but saying that there's "No Chance" is just silly.
Hinrich and Lewis? *Drools...* What worries me is that the Rockets have the resources this offseason to make these kinds of deals happen, but it remains to be seen if CD will get the job done. Steve Francis, 6.9M TE, 6th man of the year (hopefully) Mo taylor, and Kelvin Cato SHOULD be able to get us Rashard Lewis and a decent PG AT LEAST, right? For example, if you dangle Cato in front of the Pacers, Heat and Mavericks, you're bound to get some decent value in a trade. Something liek Jonathan Bender and either Jeff Foster or Scot Pollard. For Francis, some of the deals mentioned include Ray Allen, Rashard Lewis, Luke Ridnour, maaaaaaaaaaaaybe Kirk Hinrich, then there's Micheal Redd for example. Lots of things can be done. Even our 4.5MLE will be extremely valuable as I'm sure, unless Detroit win it all, Rasheed will consider us very very seriously (As long as we don't trade Mobley). This team has the resources to come out of this summer as one of the most talented teams in the league.
