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Yao needs to concentrate on Defense and Rebounding

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by tinman, Nov 5, 2008.

  1. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    dude u are comparing games that u never saw and u googled.
    I watched last nights game and many of dreams games. he would never let up on defense. u guys judge dream on games u never saw. oh ill find the article for you. by the way the spurs have david robinson, he's not a scrub compared to big baby. thank you for this post. u gave me ideas.
     
  2. killlogan

    killlogan Member

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    Yao needs a backup most.
     
  3. BrooksBall

    BrooksBall Member

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    Tonight, Bynum is doing exactly what tinman is suggesting Yao needs to do.

    He is having little impact on the offensive end (9 pts on 4/9 shooting) and has been blocked twice.

    But he has 17 rebounds, 4 blocks and only 1 TO.

    So, he's playing defense, owning the paint and not letting his lack of offense impact the rest of this game. I'm not saying he does this every night. It's just an example of what Yao should have done last night.
     
  4. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    I'm glad tinman started the thread because if I had said it, I'm a hater. What tinman started is what I've been saying for yrs. I've started threads stating why u can't build around him and was most hated, not that I care. I've gone back and forth arguing his actual impact and was cussed out. I guess I was wrong thinking the rox would have the best center in hoops for 10 yrs, yet it looks like his crown will last 2 yrs. With Howard and Bynum being so young, its really frustrating the progress of those guys. The Rox can win with Yao, they just needs to keep him upright and help minimize his shortcomings.
     
  5. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    Alvin,
    do you get this point?

    1. its about his DEFENSIVE EFFORT, not his OFFENSIVE EFFORT

    I'll give you an example.

    I can make a pizza, buy the dough and ingredients, and bake myself a pizza.
    that is effort.

    I can also call Pizza Hut.
    this requires little or no effort.


    Ok now, let's put this into what happened last night.

    Big Baby Glen Davis, he's short and fat, he doesn't not have position on Yao.
    Yao has the best position to get the rebound.

    Yao can stick his arm out and grab the ball.
    This is effort.

    Yao can stand there and do nothing while Glen Davis jumps as high as he can to grab the ball.
    This is not effort.

    Is it judging him to point out that playing without effort is unacceptable?
    Yao does not suck, his effort sucks.
     
  6. flamingdts

    flamingdts Member

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    I think Yao does indeed need to work harder on defense. I question his rebounding more than defense. It is the part where Yao can't grab a rebound that disappoints me.
     
  7. leebigez

    leebigez Member

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    davis aint fat, he just big boney. D:
     
  8. bingfei236

    bingfei236 Member

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    dude, you must be very angry, i get you, but look at the bright side, we knew yao, he will bounce back. i questioned about his rebound ability, but i never question about his effort. last game, he just lost his confidence. it happened to any player at some point. to be honest, tmac's defense on allen cause us game too. as rocket fan, we have been talked a lot about yao's ability under basket, no matter defense or he should dunk instead of lay up, but yao is who he is, he is not gona to change suddenly. we all disappointed about his performce last game, but as rocket fan, we bash and continue to support.
     
  9. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    I'm judging his EFFORT.

    here's the definition:
    –noun
    1. exertion of physical or mental power:

    Again, stop talking about OFFENSE. This was Dream's worst offensive game. He was in foul trouble so he was limited OFFENSIVELY. but DEFENSIVELY he played with his usual effort

    Paper: HOUSTON CHRONICLE
    Date: FRI 03/13/1992
    Section: Sports
    Page: 1
    Edition: 2 STAR

    Spurs stymie Olajuwon, Rockets

    By EDDIE SEFKO
    Staff

    SAN ANTONIO -- Hakeem Olajuwon and David Robinson usually cancel each other out when they play.

    Thursday night, Olajuwon was canceled a little more thoroughly than Robinson. Olajuwon was limited to his worst offensive game in more than two years and the Rockets suffered a 104-98 setback to the Spurs at HemisFair Arena.
    ------------


    With Olajuwon and Otis Thorpe battling foul troubles, the Rockets fell behind fast and had their two best offensive weapons on the bench for a good chunk of the half.

    The Rockets nonetheless scored the last nine points of the first half to slice the deficit to 47-36 going into the third quarter.

    Olajuwon, like Robinson, was a complete non-factor in the first half. Neither scored a field goal; Robinson had only two points. Olajuwon had none, and he had zero late in the third quarter.

    That the game was painfully low-scoring to that point should not have been surprising. But when Maxwell knocked in a 3-point shot to start the second half, the Rockets had the gap down to eight points and it didn't go into double digits again in the third quarter.


    ----------

    Conclusion on DEFENSIVE EFFORT VS YAO YESTERDAY

    YAO (vs Kendrick Perkins/Leon Powe, Big Baby)- 7 Rebounds 0 BLOCKS 0 STEALS
    with only 3 PERSONAL FOULS

    HAKEEM (vs David Robinson -Hall of Fame Center) 7 Rebounds 2 BLOCKS 3 STEALS
    with 5 PERSONAL FOULS

    So Dream was in danger of fouling out at any point cause he at 5 fouls vs a Hall of Fame Center, while Yao was still obsessed with 3 PERSONALS. You need 6 to FOUL OUT. What does that say?

    Oh Yao even says he was thinking of these dumb fouls the whole game.
    http://www.chron.com/disp/story.mpl/sports/bk/bkn/6095183.html
    “The early fouls changed a little bit of my game but cannot be my excuse,” Yao said. “I played a bad game, probably one of my worst games in a long time. I need to figure out what happened besides just thinking about those early fouls. I think I hesitated, worried about getting another foul. I think I moved not quick enough.”
    Ron Artest had 5 fouls. So Yao was not the one who was in danger of fouling out.

    ----

    here's your OFFENSIVE STORY that you love so much:

    With David Robinson and a flurry of other San Antonio defenders harassing him, Olajuwon was 2-for-13 from the field.

    "I don't know what to say," Olajuwon said. "I think it was my fault we lost. I was missing some shots I could have made.

    "I guess I'll have to start all over again."
    Robinson, San Antonio's star center who, like Olajuwon, rarely has a sub-20-point game, had only 15, but it was enough to make Olajuwon's night look even worse.

    Olajuwon did not make alibis for his bad night, although he did say the Spurs routinely hit him on the elbow as he went up for jumpers.

    Olajuwon's teammates saw no reason to cite him as the culprit.

    "Those two guys usually neutralize each other," Kenny Smith said. "Hakeem still attracts a lot of attention.

    ---
    For Yao:
    The Celtics did not make things easy, keeping Yao surrounded with Kendrick Perkins in front and Garnett from behind, a defense made stronger by the Rockets’ inability to rapidly move the ball away from that loaded strong side.
     
  10. shortfuse3

    shortfuse3 Member

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    get this through all of yall's heads. when was the last time you said "nice rebound" whenever yao got a rebound? yao will never be a good rebounder.
     
  11. Starscream

    Starscream Member

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    I am glad you were looking at this game. This is exactly what most of us are talking about when it comes to Ming. There are so many other ways to impact the game.

    Just a few nights ago Ming and Artest led us to the win against the MAvs with Mcgrady sitting out the entire 4th. But he was not a nonfactor for the game. he had like 7 dimes and for a good stretch of the 3rd he made some crucial baskets to keep us in the game.

    He wasn't dropping 30 but his impact was felt. When it comes to Yao once the O is negated he gives up on everything but even worse he causes deficits with a complete meltdown on D and consistent turnovers.

    Somebody on the team -whether it be the coach, Mac or later on in the season Artest- needs to chew him out after such a night -like WTF are you doing our there, grab a freakin board man, play some D!!

    How can a franchise center who gets max money, who proclaims this is the year when Artest was picked up be a complete no show when they are playing a statement game against the defending champs?? We only play Boston twice a year, if you cannot get up on that then what can you get up for?
     
  12. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    when is dunking part of defense? that's offense . offense is when you score points.

    defense is when you try to stop the other team from scoring and rebounding is when you grab the basketball when there is a missed shot.

    How tall are you? 6ft tall?

    find a friend who is 5 ft tall.

    go to a wall, stick your arms straight up, and write the word "REBOUND" on the wall with a pencil at the highest point you can reach.

    tell your short friend to touch the word REBOUND.
    now you try it.

    If you wrote the rebound at your highest point, you still don't have to jump to touch that part of the wall.

    your friend has to.

    Thank you. I hope this makes you understand things.
    [​IMG]
     
    #152 tinman, Nov 6, 2008
    Last edited: Nov 6, 2008
  13. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    If Yao put this EFFORT like this, we'd blow Boston out, regardless if Yao misses 10 dunks in one game.
     
  14. yaopowered

    yaopowered Member

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    Yes, but you're forgetting who the Celtics Defensive Coach is. Tom Thorbideau or however you spell it.

    Tom knows Yao Ming inside and out. It's not a surprise therefore that the opposition would attack Yao's weak points.

    What Yao needs to do is study the tapes, and figure out how the Celtics were able to defeat him, and adjust his game.

    Yao CAN and WILL recover from this poor game. I also think that Yao Ming was a little tired. This is the effect of playing too many 40 minute games. Yao Ming should only be playing about 33-35 minutes.
     
  15. yaopowered

    yaopowered Member

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    Tinman, you need a brain.

    A 5 foot man will out rebound a 6 foot man if the 6foot man weighs 310pounds, and the 5 foot man only weighs 150lbs.

    Grabbing rebounds has nothing to do with height, or size. It's about speed, and reaction time.

    Yao Ming is very tall, but also very heavy, and very slow. This is why he cannot grab as many rebounds as you might think.
     
  16. yaopowered

    yaopowered Member

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    Look, Yao Ming is a dominant Offensive player. Stop comparing him to other Centers who are 7'0. Being 7'6 and 310lbs, Yao is in the extra large category. How many extra large centers were able to play at Yao's level?

    Yao's size is both a blessing and a curse. On the one hand, he's virtually unstoppable offensively, one on one. but on the other hand, Yao's slow, and this affects his defense.
     
  17. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    So are you ok when Yao got outrebounded by Glen Davis and Len Bias right?
     
  18. yaopowered

    yaopowered Member

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    It's ONE GAME, man. What's Yao's #'s the past several seasons? He's had double double averages.

    You might have an argument if you are analyzing entire seasons, and Yao only averaged 7 rebounds per game.

    But Yao has averaged 10+ rebounds per game. The last several seasons. He's averaged 20+ points per game. How many guys in the NBA averages 20/10?

    You have ZERO argument here TinMan. You can take ANY superstar and trash him for ONE POOR GAME. What's the point??

    You have no point.
     
  19. yaopowered

    yaopowered Member

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    Look, TinMan. Here's what you can do.

    After this season's over, if Yao only averaged 7 rebounds and 7 points, THEN YOU CAN TRASH HIM.

    But if Yao again averages 20/10, you'd be an IDIOT for picking ONE BAD GAME to criticize him.

    I'd like to revisit this thread at the end of the season. Ok? MARK MY WORDS. I will confront you at the season's end. If Yao averages 20/10, you owe Yao Ming an apology.
     
  20. cuddie

    cuddie Member

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    I felt it was necessary to point out that you contradicted yourself.
     

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