It's been a while since I've read such pure, unadulterated crap. Excuse me, but the last time I checked Yao was one person and Wang was another. Yao has his agreement with the Rockets and whatever incomprehensible entities in China and Wang has his OWN agreement. TWO SEPARATE PEOPLE and TWO SEPARATE AGREEMENTS. All the rest of this is just the tree falling alone in the forest. Does it make a sound? If it does, I'm not listening any longer.
I hate the fact they are holding up Yao in this process, I don't know WTF they specifically want from the NBA either. People say NBA can do squat helping China out on this thing, I wish otherwise. Feel free to bash China, but I can't stand it that Wang is made out to be guilt free in this. Wang should know that his violation of agreement will create trouble for Yao Ming's NBA career beforehand. I guess he didn't care about that. I wonder what Yao Ming is thinking about his friend's behaviour that holds him up for his NBA career, maybe he think Wang has done nothing wrong in it? or if the worst thing happened, do you honestly think that Yao will only blame the officials, while he's riding a bike in Shanghai and Wang driving his mercedez in Dallas? Yao will be the victim of two parties if that's the case, one is a petty man called Wang, another is the cowardice govt. officials.
Panda, I think most Americans would disagree with you about the Wang case. We don't believe the government owns anyone. Did Wang have any choice but to sign the agreement in order to play in the NBA. Its kinda going up to a starving man and saying "I'll feed you if you give me everything you own and will earn from this point foward." What choice does he have. Now, that Wang lives in America, he is taking advantage of the freedom that most Americans take for granted everyday which is the freedom to tell the CBA to screw themselves. I just wish Yao Ming was over here so he could do the same.
And who exactly are you trying to argue with? Last time I checked, no one in this thread said what China has done to Yao is right. I'm arguing all along that Wang should be blamed too, as his action directly caused the knee jerk reaction of the Chinese Bball officials on Yao. Get a grip.
If we made two list, one that gives every reason to draft Ming with the number one, and the other gives every reason not to draft Ming with the number one, at the top of the "no" list would the the fact that the Chinese government can yank our chain any time they fill like it, and for any reason. Any time there is a dispute of any kind between China and the US, China can always threaten to take their Ming and go home, and Ming would probably never defect out of fear that his family back home might suffer because of it. We might as well get use to this crap, because it will probably continue throughout Mings career. Something else to consider, the Chinese government forcing Ming to sign with NY as a free agent, even if it means for less money, because they feel they can better use Ming for pr if he plays in the media capital of the world. Raven
Idiotic. This is just. so. idiotic. The CBA is the Chinese equivalent of USA Basketball + NBA mixed up in one. Talking about "separation of powers" shows how little understanding you have of the situation. The idea that *political* powers in China have any relevance or bearing on this situation is IDIOTIC. Is USA basketball "separate" from the Bush administration? The question is so idiotic I wouldn't even know how to answer it. Yao Ming has a Chinese passport that gives him the right to leave the country. No government security forces are at his door preparing to arrest him. Yao Ming most likely has a multi-entry visa to the United States in his passport, and he's allowed to enter the United States. Let's drop this politics bull-crap. If the contracts with the players permitted it, Mark Cuban would also grind every bit of value out of the players that he owns the rights to. The CBA/Chinese Basketball are trying to do the same, and all your conservative little minds can grasp onto is the fact that the government is "communist". Next time Wang Zhizhi gets benched because he can't play defense, I'll remind the Chinese to blame it on the capitalist-imperialist hegemonic government of the United States... maybe that'll remind you how idiotic your "analysis" is.
To my understanding, just like to any league and to any player, when a player wants a contract buyout or rights transfer, they are subject to the conditions of their original clubs. Take it or leave it. Tell me why it's wrong if the Rockets wants 35K compensation and participation in summer league if Barcelona wants Francis' service and Francis is willing to go? Simple business. This is not some slave program we're talking about, you do realize that CBA don't force people to play in it and it's a strict business entity do you?
Poor Panda, wandering in the forest. A wind blows. The branches groan. He reaches for a branch. It whispers "Separate... two separate people." He stands on his toes, straining to reach the branch and he can't... get... a grip.
I am waiting to see your take on heech's post before you act like you know China/Wang/Yao situation, 'cuz so far you didn't show anything.
Separation of two entities? Separation of two entities is absurd in this situation. A man is divorced, he agreed to pay the alimony as a condition for divorce. He didn't keep his word as that agreement was based on only goodwill. Now the government sees this, it wants to make sure that when the next man wants to divorce, the alimony will be definitely paid. And before such reinforcement of agreement is found, it's temporarily withholding such dirvorce. I don't agree on this as I'm a rockets fan and Yao fan, but separation of entity has nothing to do in this situation. Get a grip.
When a man is blamed for pursuing his basic freedoms, it points to a flaw in the system. It's kinda like when Black slaves used to escape to the North. Yeah, sure by escaping they made life harder and chances for escape slimmer for the slaves remaining in the South (authorities clamp down, etc.), but far be it for anyone to call escaping slavery a sin. Were they under contract? Yes. Did they wish to be? No. I'm not calling military service or playing for your national team slavery per se. But when this becomes a "responsibility" which hinders people's full development against their will, it is getting pretty damn close to the definition... During the Vietnam War, thousands of youths also fought against the draft (including our former president Clinton and current president Bush). And it is still an open debate whether they had the right... If Wang thought he could get better prepared for the NT by playing in the summer leagues instead of practising with lame-ass players and coaches back home, then let him! (And he seems to have been correct on this point...) What's the sin in that? When the CBA gets into a grudge match with Wang, insisting that everything has to be done THEIR misformed way... When Wang OFFERS to play for the team even after the CBA has publically insulted him... When the CBA sets impossible conditions for Wang's return... I think you ought to be lamenting the CBA's pigheadedness rather than Wang's lack of patriotic zeal.
And these words are from a Taiwanese Independants who thinks that the Japanese colonization in Taiwan which promoted cultural extinction and under which the Taiwanese lived as secondary citizens - under his own admittance - is benevolent, progressive and should be thanked. Need evidance? Go to the following thread. http://bbs.clutchcity.net/showthread.php?threadid=38215&perpage=30&pagenumber=1 About military draft, Taiwan is forcing people to join the army regardless of their willingness. In fact, their own president escapes such draft to show his Taiwan "patriotism". Guess we have different definition of freedom, and different views on beating a drowning dog, lil. You really have an appropriate name. I'm not gonna argue with a petty man, or drag this thread into a political one when it's just simple business and sports affair.
for your information, wang has already led the army team to countless championships and anchored the chinese nt in the past decade. how long must he serve? his entire life? when can he finally develop his skills? when he's too old to play? read the opening lines of the US Constitution if you want to know why is it that most Americans on this board simply cannot understand you... no politics in my post. just common sense.
Why don't guys that view Wang's real motive as pursuing freedom tell me why Wang said he's not going to defect or immigrate so that he can enjoy freedom in America as long as he wants, or at least working on it since his refusal to go back? He can get it easily if he wants to. He's not pursuing freedom, nope, don't believe so for a second. He's after this: $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$!!! Sorry, just want to emphasize.
He has to serve as long as he's under contract with CBA. Geez. Ok Hakeem's won two championships, now let's let him do whatever he wants to. If not he's been treated as a slave. Your attempt at dragging everything into freedom match against China is boring and pathetic. You know nothing about the American constitution. As it doesn't say people can pursue freedom at the expense of other's pain or at the sacrifice of one's own responsiblity.
and if i'm not mistaken, a person who joins the armed services of the USA can resign his commission at any time. there might be a fine. it might be kinda embarrassing. but the person isn't called a traitor in the public media. and he certainly won't face possible detention the next time he returns to the country... that is the dilemma the CBA has wisely created for itself. it's basically telling all Chinese basketball players that if you ever want to disobey us in any way, you had better cut all ties with China ASAP cuz we won't ever forgive you. why couldn't they just have said "we respect the player's decision, and hope that he can join us at the earliest future time.." what is so hard about that? instead they go and spite every other Chinese basketball player and blames it on Wang... pathetic.
You need to scroll back to read, Wang is the one that creates barrier to go back to China, Chinese basketball officials is reported to be still in USA to "persuade" him to change his mind. Why doesn't Wang say "I respect my OWN words and Yao Ming's NBA future, and the emotion of millions of Chinese basketball fans that stood behind me all these years!"? What is so hard about that? Hello, isn't Olympics hard to pass up?! Why don't you admit your point that, CBA, unlike NBA, has not legit rights whatsoever to its players and it's a slavery camp to torture poor souls like Yao Ming and Wang Zhizhi? Tell Yao Ming he's a slave playing for the NT and I guarentee he'll slap you around like a gyroscope.
Panda, Having the right to go after $$$ is part of freedom. Whatever floats your boat is what you can go after, that is in fact the whole point of freedom. Attempting to have a nice life for yourself is nothing to be ashamed of, seems many people think if you pursue money for any reason, then you're scum, or if you are a success and make money for being great at something, then you must also be a scum. By the way, Wang doing things that you don't agree with - that is part of freedom too.
Sad, Panda. Sad indeed. So Lil is a "petty man", a "lil" man... for expressing an opinion. I'm sure that Freud would find it all fascinating, but I'm not sure if he was a basketball fan.
Yes, I agree with that money is part of freedom, but whether one should pursue it is not always about freedom. I don't think people should disregard their social responsibilities pursuing freedom, that's like encouraging the drug dealer and smugglers to pursue "freedom". I'm tired of this endless argument, I've presented my stance and I'm gonna call it a day. I've got only one word for you, patience. Whether you like it or not it's the only way to go now. I believe the more we go through, the more reward will there be. The world is not over, the sky isn't collapsing. Things will be different tommorrow. No way I'll defend CBA/China if they back out of this deal, but now there's no sign that they will. Until the sky falls down it's better to just be, patient.
