Just looked it up and I was wrong. Their first season without Shane was in 2006-2007. That season, they started 6-24 before Fratello got fired. Pau played 59/82 games that year and the team went 22-60. The year before, they were a 49-win team who went to the postseason. Now, how can you seriously believe that losing Shane did not impact the Grizzlies? They were a playoff team when they had Shane, they were one of the worst teams after they lost Shane. Pau was still there, Mike Miller was still there,
I wasn't arguing his point, I was arguing the example he use -Kevin Durant- and my point wasn't to trash Gay, but to effective answer his question- would I trade Battier for Durant? Of course in doing that I had to show how Durant > Gay, therefore not trading Battier for Gay != not trading Battier for Durant. Clearer? Also to your first point, Memphis started losing immediately after trading Battier, as in the season they still had Gasol. Even though Gasol was injured for the first part of the year, once he came back, the losing did not cease. And that was with their full squad, sans Battier. Clearerer?
In the 2005-06 season, the Grizzlies allowed the fewest points per game, at 88.5. In 2006-07, they cratered to 29th, allowing 106.7 points. The 2006-07 Grizzlies were also dead last in defensive rating (112.3 points allowed per 100 posessions), whereas the 2005-06 team was 2nd (101.6 per 100). Here's 82games' take on this.... 2005-06 Grizzlies: http://www.82games.com/0506/0506MEM3.HTM 2006-07 Grizzlies: http://www.82games.com/0607/0607MEM3.HTM Not having Shane Battier not only hurt the Grizzlies, it DECIMATED them on the defensive end.
What?! Whatever, defense is so overrated. And apparently so is winning. I'm sure they are very happy with Gay.
I don't believe Battier was the sole reason that Memphis crashed.... Pau Gasol isn't exactly um.... Dwight Howard defensively.
Actually, they went from a 22 win team to a 24 win team after the Gasol trade. It's definitely surprising that they were able to improve after the trade. 2006-07 22 Wins (Before Gasol trade) 2007-08 22 Wins (Gasol traded mid season) 2008-09 24 Wins
I want to say that CD was awesome. I don't know if he was truly responsible for getting Sam I AM since I think he was assistant coach at that time. But I will say he probably would have also made an awesome coach if it weren't for some ailments that he had. The man deserves to have his banner up there and will always be in my books one of the greatest people to ever be associated with the Houston Rockets.
AMEN. The saddest part is people will continue to say that Memphis raped us in the Gay deal. The facts suggest otherwise. Memphis was a good team (mainly on the defensive end) when they had Battier, they magically became a bad team (especially on the defensive end) after they lost him. Yet they still got the better end of the Gay deal. HOW DOES THAT MAKE SENSE TO ANYBODY WITH A BRAIN?
Memphis has crappy defensive coaches. Coaches Larry Brown and JVG have shown they can turn around teams from the bottom 10 to a top 10 defense, within 2 years. Rudy only needs a defensive-minded coach. However, even a great offensive coach like Adelman can't turn Shane into a stud scorer, after 2 years.
How many wins have the thunder had since durant been there? Did you mention how they had a vet team and was still losing? What about the other lotto pick in that same draft? You can pump durant up and i like him alot, but there is a huge bias. One guy is a loser and chucker on a sorry team and the other is a budding superstar. Fact is both are young and are on sorry teams. People look at losing shane in memphis as the reason they are losing. They traded shane, had already lost williams,posey to name a few and gasol missed 30 games to start the season. Coach gets fired, new no offense coach comes in and then he gets the can while they trade one of the best young pivots in the game. You tak gasol off memphis and put shane back on there, they win the same amount of games probably less.
Fratello was 6-24 for 30 games before getting fored. Guess how many pau missed in those first 30? 23.
Bravo, CD was great. Ask Hakeem and in his own words he went out there with a broom for years and taught Hakeem his offense and foot work. Hakeem learned his defense from the gun butts in other countries before he made it to the US. CD with Hakeem has 2 titles under his belt. What other Houston MAJOR team has that? Bashing on CD is like BASHING on Hakeem or Rudy in my eyes. Everyone makes errors, but he delivered 2 rings. Also, Hakeem does mention in his book there was a trade offered for Ralph Sampson for Clyde Drexler and Portlands 1st round pick in 84(M Jordan). But as many don't remember is Ralph was "going to be" the greatest NBA legend like Jabar or Wilt. 7'4, 3 point shootin, slammin, fast break runnin passing fool(the others were not proven). Him and Hakeem beat the Lakeres and pushed the Celtics in the finals. Twin towers rocked till Danny ******* Ainge purposly hurt Sampson kneeling under him as he was pushed. That is why Ainge was the most hated person in Rockets History!!!! And why the beloved!!!!! Robert Horry would not play for him. CD made his share of mistakes and Morey is doing great now....But men get old and the next generation come to fill. And CD brought something to Houston.... 2 F***** Championships..and case closed. Stop the revisionist history and read and talk to the players for some facts. Maybe its just picken fun, but CD gets way too much negative press on here.
The Battier/Gay trade is an oversimplification of the Grizzlies downward spiral. Gasol was injured prior to the season, and took him a little while to get back to his old self. The organization decided to go in a different direction, fired a good coach, and was pretty obviously in tanking mode for the Oden/Durant lottery.
The thing I liked the most about Dawson was his erudite, confident manner on camera - he really looked to be in control of the situation.
Yes, and the similarities end there. Which is why your comparison fails. You think anyone in their right mind even thinks about trading Durant for Gay? Lee, you are getting your facts twisted again. Williams and Posey weren't even on the 05/06 roster. They were traded the year before, and Memphis had no problem winning 49 games without them. And although Gasol missed the first 22 games of the season, what was their record with him back? 17-43. So they go from a 49 win team to 17-43, with the same exact roster, besides a swap of Gay and Battier. Yes there was a coaching change, but in a players league, do you really believe that was the sole cause of this huge decline? And you think they win less without Gasol and with Battier? Did you know they actually won MORE without Gasol the year after they traded him? And that was without Battier.
So i guess Gasol wasn't the reason why the Lakes became a championship contender and an eventual champion. And coaching makes a huge difference. Playing for someone you respect and playing for someone who knows how to optomize your talent can swing plenty of wins and losses. Otherwise, if coaching didn't mean squat, why would any organization would need to fire and hire new coaches? Hell, fire ALL Coaches and let the wardens run the show.
Once again I see sse have reading problems. If you read what I said, I said prior to gasol going down and battierbeing traded, posey and williams were already gone and eddie jones was also on his last legs. What makes Durant better? First before u answer, I want to ask, how many games have you watched of either? Durant shot over 100 more shots than Gay. So by you account, that makes him a chucker right? Next, how many games have the great durant teams won? I'm going to say the same amount or less than the teams gay has been on. Another thing is, the rockets never had a chance to get Durant. The extreme to which people go to defend battier or that trade is crazy. I think most would agree, it wasn't the fact the trade a lotto pick for a declining player, its the fact they didn't get enough for the lotto pick and it was Gay that had to be the player. Ronnie Brewer fits the mold of what they were looking for. He had the same intangible factor, very good defender froom day 1, good ball handler, slassher, athletic swing guy. That's the argument I always have about the trade. Not to mention, they couldn't even squeeze another future player out the deal. So we can go on and on and you can continue to fool yourself and talk about how bad a player gay is and being a loser, but you defend a guy like durant who is no closer to winning. All he is doing is averaging more and shooting more on a equally poor team.
They did unload a horrible contract in Stromile Swift. And Shane's impact has been huge. You can't argue that. Probably bigger than what Rudy Gay could have been for this team (if TMac were to be healthy)
