Right, nice way to put the other side on the defense: Viiiiiiiiitual woooooorld. Of course it's a little hard for you to get a grip of.
Only in someone's dream. Let's forget those US multinational corporations making tons of money in China. GM. Google it if you don't know.
Then why are you even posting those "critical" comments here, you don't have better things to do in your life? or it's only showing you empty arrogance?
And yet clean energy depends on these toxic mining operations. This isn't a gusher waiting to happen. There are risks and consequences. I never said I was against off shore drilling or never claimed to be an environmentalist. I think a balance has to be struck between environment and economics. Minimal impact, but there are necessary evils.
Great post. And I get the feeling that if a lot of the liberals on this board were Chinese citizens, they would be against cheap REE exports to foreign countries that added little added value to the economy and harmed the Chinese environment and Chinese workers. If there was going to be such a high cost, I'm sure they'd want something more in return (ie. development of higher tech industries, higher REE prices and wages, etc.)
China has been bullying US for years by putting trillion worth stuff on boat in exchange for pieces of paper worth less and less, i.e. dollars. Worse, as this goods for paper cycle goes on, China plays even meaner and harder by sending more and more goods for more paper. You gotta be kidding me. Where is the thank-you note to China?
Yeah China, thanks for flooding our markets with cheap goods driving our industries our of business and using the money to secure resources of productions in Africa and around the world. Your welcome for your 9% growth while we are slugging it along without job growth. Thanks for dealing us our crack.
Outside of lessening the rare earth monopoly in 3 or so years, which the greenies and green-in-name-only NIMBYers will hate in 5 years and drive costs up further (minimal impact= $$$$ per ounce), what's your game plan for a trade war? Make things more expensive for 2011, 2012 and beyond? Obama will love that, let alone the Wal-Mart/Target crowd. We have limited options in terms of aggressive tactics, which is why Geitner and Helicopter Ben are musing QE2, a risky and potentially disastrous double or nothing bet. No time for cherry picking. What's your game plan?
I think you have pretty much made the case for a political angle to the stop of shipments of REM to Japan. I agree with most of what you are saying but my only point was that there was a specific political motive for the sudden cessation of shipments to Japan in regard to the trawler incident.
Honestly those are some pretty stupid examples and don't help your argument at all. As I said before on a related topic throwing out the Opium war is a real disservice to history. Seriously if every time non-Chinese criticizes the PRC people like you are going to throw out the Opium War any rhetorical value to it is going to be totally loss. Its like Al Sharpton crying "Racism!" anytime an incident involves a white and a black happens. Al Sharpton might actually be right in some cases but given how much he throws that out most of his credibility is lost. Really you are going to bring up WWII? You do know what the Japanese were doing to the Chinese then?
Sweet Lou you have previously criticized the PRC defenders as being overly nationalistic but your posts in this thread strike me as being overly nationalistic and veering towards the "yellow peril" rhetoric of the 1950's. The US and the PRC will act in ways that seek to maximize their advantages but in the global economy and geopolitically they need each other and any serious moves to destroy the other, economically or other wise, will greatly harm both.
We're printing money like crazy to trash the dollar so as not to get flooded with Chinese goods that will destroy the last semblance of manufacturing and concentrate it all in the hands of a nation that's not so friendly to us. Here's the game plan: 1. Take all of the violations across every industry China is commiting to keep American exports uncompetitive in China to the WTO. Declare China a currency manipulator. Also go after China for putting tariffs on many American goods but allowing pirated versions to sell in china tax free and with the gov't blessing. Get approval from Congress to impose far reaching tariffs (but don't actually impose them yet). Let's see if that's enough to move China. 2. Meanwhile, the U.S. needs to provide massive subsidies and incentives to restart Rare Earths and other areas that have been wiped out through Chinese market dumping. Partner with Austrailia and Canada to start-up production. Create a fast trak program to get Rare earth production flowing. 3. Offer companies that are high risk to move to China 0% tax rate for 3 years if they do not move. enough time to sort out the WTO issue and prevent further loss of jobs. Stop the bleeding as a stop gap measure. 4. Provide incentives to the rest of the world to import goods and compete with Chinese imports. There is no reason why Mexico, India, Indonesia, and Africa can not produce relatively cheap good for Walmart. 5. Once all these steps are taken, give China a 2 year window to redress the currency issues and remove protectionist tarrifs and business practices blocking American imports. Also, build in plans to save industries susceptible to Chinese market dumping. Now, at this point it's timing. Industry will put a huge pressure not to start a trade war with China. But at least they know it's coming and can prepare. Walmart can look for other options if it's knows it's supplies will be cut off. While a trade war with China will be inflationary, we are in a near deflationary period. We can tighten the money supply once we start hitting Chinese imports. But when we start, we have to hit China hard. Across the board. Start with a 10% tariff and see what it does. Increase from there. Other developing nations will support us since it will help them tremendously. I think China will be indignant at first at least outwardly. But secretly they will be pooping in their pants and I doubt we'll actually even have to put a single tariff down. But we have to be ready. Because China could respond with tariffs against us and embargos. If that happens, we have to reply in kind. People don't realize this, but we are already in a trade war. China has been hitting us for year with tariffs and it's currency to create the trade imbalance. We have done nothing but complain and be weak. All I suggest is we now hit them back. If that's such a terrible thing...then I guess we should just roll over and die.
It's funny that you mentioned WTO so many times, while every single piece of your great "plan" is a blatant violation of WTO rules. The funnier thing is, you are even serious about it. No, that doesn't qualify you as a politician. Although politicians do exactly the opposite of what they say, most of the time, they also pretend, at least. So, some people too lazy to think for themselves can buy that. Let me not curb your enthusiasm, good luck to amass a group of supporters for your genius plan on this board.
I don't think I am going anywhere that far. I am not demonizing the PRC, I am only saying they have violated fair trade for long enough and if they aren't going to correct it after a lot of discussion than you have to take a strong stance. The market manipulations and restrictions are hurting jobs here while China enjoys a 9% growth. I don't think I am being overly nationalistic in calling for our gov't to stand up for it's people and not give in to corporate interests. How much of our jobs and industries must go oversees? It's one thing if it was done fairly, but that's not the case. This isn't about pride in America or seeing ourselves as better. This is about the fact we're getting screwed and we're paying a really heavy price, and if we don't have the courage and strength to act now it may be too late in 10 years. This isn't about U.S. domination. It is about U.S. prosperity.
If China doesn't honor her agreements than there is no agreement and it's a free for all. I don't need to amass a group of supporters, it's already amassing. Krugman is far more powerful of a voice than me. I think you underestimate how serious of an issue this is for most Americans.
How serious? Election rhetoric, that's how serious it was, it is, and it will be. CCP always does a piss poor job against bullies in the world, while they are bullying their own people domestically. Every time there is an election going on in US, any random politician can waive an anti-China flag to gain some supporters. Once the election is over, they can go on with Chinese business as well. Instead of those empty unhappy statements, Chinese government should do something about it. If you want to curse me, I will curse back. As simple as that. Chinese government REALLY should treat own citizen better, than those foreigners. But, most of those officials have family member in bed with those foreign corporations. As for your plan, again, good luck with it. I really hope US can start mass Rare Earth mining or oil drilling or whatever major production to use some of their own resources. I don't have a problem with it. If China's GDP growth rate drops, so be it, if China can start to save the environment for younger generations. In this world, being nice alone won't gain your any friend or respect. Only if you show your willingness and ability to be mean, and ONLY THEN, when you are nice, people will start to appreciate.
I think China would look better if the US started a trade war. QE2 will still go on regardless of the outcome.
No one is cursing China...although I do see some cursing going the other direction. No one asked China to trash it's environment for rare earths or anything. China did it to seize the market. Good for her and a smart thing to do. She poisoned her environment for an economic advantage. Was this a boon to U.S.? It helped U.S. consumers in the short run, but in the long haul, it will hurt because employment in this country is down now. This is not an internal political issue. It's not an election issue. It's bipartisan. Both parties know we are getting hurt....badly. I think it would be great if China treated her citizens better. It doesn't help us any. And if China opens her markets up to us, it doesn't hurt the Chinese people, it's gives them more choice of what to buy. This won't end in Nov, it will only intensify.
Krugman has never written a single positive word on China, someone should write an article about that.....
