That has happened but honestly he even said he played terrible. He is who he is. He's inverse Jamal Murray. You get a lot of him at the beginning of games and the season. You get a below average version of himself in playoffs and clutch time. The thing is the media has created a narrative and now it must be pursued. In reality, like me, you should have given up on Harden becoming that a long time ago and start looking at him as a player that can help your team get regular season wins which means your other stars don't exhaust themselves before the playoffs. He should be paired with a clutch player who has an extra gear in the playoffs. We always should have paired him with a Jimmy Butler. We kept pairing him with other players who were criticized for shrinking in important games (Howard, Paul, Westbrook) and Sixers did same with Joel being heavily criticized for the same thing and especially against the Celtics. He was right to bail on us and Nets imo. These were bad situations with bad owners and bad coaches (Nash + Silas). MDA, Morey and Harden all lied to get out so it must have been a really toxic situation. I don't care about all that. All I care about is what would we be getting if we signed him. What we'd be getting is HoF-calibre regular season floor general. Could win you a game or two in the first couple rounds of the playoffs but will almost certainly have 1 or 2 terrible games in each series (highly inconsistent in the playoffs, most I've ever seen). There is value in getting that on our team, but only if it's a contract which fully protects the team from overpaying him relative to his on court impact and which takes into account his likely decline between the ages of 34 and 38.
Because I like ("liked" i dont know) Harden. Fandom is weird. Harden's embarrassments were mine. I had to adopt the - "remember guys none of this matters" because of the amount of times I was embarrassed watching Harden embarrass himself. Harden will make us better, I agree. but we know what "better" means when it comes to harden. That means Harden with the ball throwing it to someone in the corner when he draws a double. We have seen that work in the regular season and fail MISERBLY in the playoffs because harden doesn't want to do anything else. Harden will wilt under the pressure and we do it all over again. Let me see what Bari, Jalen and Sengun can mature into. I know it's tough because Houston sports has been on top for so long, but I think the Rockets can get back there - eventually.
There’s no current big name player in the NBA who would sign here this summer even if they were a free agent with the exception of Harden.
Naw im out on Harden. Just too many people caping for him bringing up old memories of playoff flameouts....and the excuses that followed. I aint trying to see that **** again.
when u are worst in the league for 3 years, the next logical goal is to improve to being a playoff team the way some of y’all talk, Harden is about to sign some 8 year deal…by the time a 3 or 4 year Harden contract is over, none of these young players like Green, Bari, Sengun, and Wemby who I’m speaking into existence will have even reached their prime How is Harden stopping u from building a contending team in the future? How is signing Harden for sure closing some mythical championship window that hasn’t even come close to opening yet? Please elaborate. Can you also explain why Harden will kill the kid’s development? Let y’all tell it, no young player or guy who isn’t a spot up shooter/lob big can flourish next to Harden. I would rather they be bad a few more years and learn to win their way while adding players who will fit into a style of play Udoka wants to run. this sounds crazy to me What if Ime Udoka wants an actual PG to run an offense instead of the same trash the Rockets have been trotting out at the position? You’re in Ime’s head and know he doesn’t want James Harden? As much as I love Ime, he was coaching a bunch of vets who have a brain down in Boston, not a bunch of young clueless dummies.
We also had the worst coach in the history of sports in Silas, truly awful. Yall think we suck so horrendously because he was so bad. Also Failure comes when your best players and front office brain trust leave the franchise. You think ninjas just going to bounce back a year later after everything has been gutted? That's the context you need. 'm telling you. Rockets have the talent; I've been saying that. We have also had great luck in the draft, I hope that continues #prayforvictor. Rockets are going to be back up Franchises have been languishing for decades rockets have been bad for just 3 years.
Folks, I'm not saying that I think Har-God threw the last 2 games to speed up his return. I'm saying that I know that that's what happened.
Even though I don't want Harden back, I definitely get some of the appeal if we are talking immediate impact. Even a quick and dirty look at his impact would get a person excited... Does anyone think he is going to play more than 60 games next season? Last 4 seasons he has averaged 58.8 games (and yes, that directly matches his partying lifestyle). If he plays 65 games is that enough to get the Rockets into the play-in? Last year we won .268 of our games (22 wins). I'd estimate we win at least 5-10 more games just by adding Ime + another year of experience so that's 27-32 wins. Harden averaged 25/10/8 without Durant and Irving for the Nets in 45 games and with an impressive .644 win percentage He averaged 20.6/9.4/6.7 without Embiid in 7 games with an even more impressive .714 win percentage. We're talking an impressive ~ 55 wins with the Nets/Sixes without their star players if Harden never got injured. He's available about 72% of the time the last few seasons so that would be 40 wins with Harden and who knows what would've happen to those teams without their stars + Harden. So let's just assume Harden by himself would add another 10-20 wins to this team, which would probably get us from 22 wins to 40+ wins just between Ime, experience and Harden. After that you add on some vets. I get it,... it's exciting. On paper it seems like a no brainer... elite passer who could get us to the play-in. Where I disagree are things that I really don't think I'll be able to convince those who do want Harden which is cool we're all here shooting the **** anyways. We'll, at least some of us are...
… With the current version of the Rockets, on most nights he would be the wise, old playmaker, somewhat ironically like Chris Paul was in his one season with the Thunder after the Rockets traded him (when he was one year older than Harden will be next season) and in his initial seasons with the Suns. That’s not how Ime Udoka’s Celtics played, with an offense that relied on much more passing and much fewer high pick-and-rolls than typical Harden-driven teams. That could be because of the talent on hand at the time rather than a philosophical preference. But that is the only way Harden will excel and the only reason a team would sign him to the sort of contract it would take. If you sign Harden, you commit to putting him in position to do what he does best. It is also worth noting that a lineup with Harden, Green and Sengun would also be hard-pressed to defend as Udoka will want. … Harden said Sunday that he has not thought about his future but offered “I just want to compete, obviously.” He did not say what he wanted to compete for. He could believe that the Rockets can compete for something if they have him. The ego it takes to be a superstar usually leads to that sort of confidence. But he hopped around from Houston to Brooklyn to Philadelphia looking for a winner. He sacrificed a sizable chunk of salary to help make that happen with the Sixers. Philadelphia president Daryl Morey is still likely to reward that. The NBA’s over-38 rule limits what Philadelphia can offer in the season he would begin at 38 (which otherwise could be worth $61.9 million.) That means the Sixers can offer $210.1 million for four years; the Rockets $201.7 million over four seasons. The Rockets would be hard-pressed to offer that much for the mid-30s version of Harden. He remains a marvelous point guard and a fine scorer for such a superb facilitator. He also would immediately lift a team with the worst three-year run in the NBA since he left into playoff contention. The Rockets, however, went through three seasons of painful losing, rather than bring in short-term veteran help, to build something more than a team able to contend for a playoff spot. They resisted the urge to seek a shortcut. At the full maximum contract price, Harden would feel like a desperate, short-term boost that could be troublesome at the end of his career. The Rockets are not a team that by adding Harden can chase a championship in the first seasons of his contract, making it worth spending so heavily at the end of his contract. The Sixers still could think of themselves as that sort of contending team. With a shorter or more modest contract that better matches with his role and where he is in his career, Harden could be what the Rockets need — a significant, veteran building block. He would not complete the rebuild. He would not transform them as he did in 2012 when he was traded to the Rockets and his life and theirs changed. But he would make them a significantly better team, which at this point, is the idea. What makes sense for Harden could be about more than basketball. What works for the Rockets is about matching cost with benefits, as it is for most players. At this stage of his career, he is not the kind of superstar that is worth any cost it takes to get him. He could be, of all things, part of the process, as long as they and he know what he is compared to what he was.
I would be fine with harden coming back to Houston if he was a CP3 type I'm-just-going-to-fit-in kind of player. The problem with Harden is he takes over the whole offense when he has the ball. He doesn't just fit in. I guess as long as he's not getting the max it would fine.
1. If we land in a good position to get Scoot Henderson tomorrow, or if the team is confident they can trade up to get him, you pick Scoot and hand him the keys to the offense and tell James "love you man, but we're good" and let him stay in Philly. 2. If we do sign him, he should get no more than three years guaranteed (unless he's well below max money). 3. Udoka needs to meet with him and they need to have a very blunt discussion about what Harden's expectations are and what the team's expectations will be from him. If you actually watched Philly play this year, much of the time Harden played far more within the offense than you might remember from his time here--more pick-and-roll, more ball movement from the entire team, fewer shots from Harden. Sometimes he would revert to ISO hero ball, and it usually turned out poorly. It needs to be clear that if he's here, it will be about building a team offense, not just the Harden Show. If he isn't 100% onboard with that or if there's any hesitation, no thanks.
But, again, what if bringing in a guy who thrives in a certain style of play hinders the development of the young guys? Like I can't imagine it hurting someone like Bari, who thrives in catch and shoot situations and needs a PG to get him open looks. But what if that's not the case for Green, Sengun and the top pick from this draft? It it that unfathomable to think bringing him on to play his brand of basketball might not be the best method for helping all of these guys develop? See comments above. Some guys thrive with the ball in their hands. Some don't. Green and Sengun both are guys I'd like to give more possessions to, not less. And, look, I'm not a fortune teller. I can't predict the future and the impact that bringing on Harden will have on this young core, but is it really THAT insane for some of us to have our doubts that he's the best mentor for these kids? What in Harden's past and his prior experience in Houston tells you that he's some incredible leader who will help young players thrive and become superstars in this league? He 100% does need a point guard to run his offense. I'm not disagreeing with you there. But why does that PG have to be Harden? I would much rather they draft someone and/or bring on a veteran PG who doesn't make $40 million a year. Again, I'm not saying there's not merit to the idea of bringing Harden back. As I've said in other threads, I'm a huge fan of the guy and would love for him to bring winning basketball back to Houston. But he's burned us all enough times for me not to have 100% faith in him like I used to, and it's completely reasonable for fans to have doubts that he's the best answer to the Rockets problems.
Rockets weren’t just bad, they were historically awful Rockets have some talent, but Ime will have his work cut out for him…he doesn’t just have to bring some X’s and O’s and some leadership, he has to teach these players the most basic elements of basketball I doubt most of the roster could digest a scouting report that doesn’t look like it was written by a 3 year old in crayon…Rockets probably the dumbest and most clueless team in the league the past 3 years
Yeah that wouldn't be good if he's just dominating the ball the same way KPJ did, even if the results were good that would hinder our development and there's no point Harden playing well if it means the others get fewer touches or don't play well. I dislike CP3 but he certainly fits better as a mentor even if his on court impact is half that of Harden's. I'm against bringing Harden back except if it's $90m/3yrs which I think is extremely unlikely. I don't think it's realistic it's the best offer he'll receive in the market because the Sixers will happily facilitate a trade for him to a team that's already winning and doesn't mind paying him more. So if another team offers $110m total guaranteed he would choose them over Houston. I really believe all this narrative is just a backup plan or leverage play for Harden because having ONE team with cap space interested in him makes it possible for him to be traded practically anywhere he wants other than a rival.
Lol… Harden didn’t score well before the 4th quarter either in games 5,6, and 7…… you think that helped the overall game before it became a blow out? What is it you have in your mind that Harden will be doing on the Rockets? Is there an expectation that Harden is going to change his game or will all of our guys be required to learn to play around Harden?
I have no idea if he’ll take less than the max, but I don’t want to sign him for max money. The other alternatives would start to look better if we are talking bringing back Harden for max money given where we are in our rebuild and given where he is in his career.
