Woj: Frank Vogel "very much in the mix" to be next Rockets coach

I think you're right that he's not a terrible choice. I don't think he's the best choice, but he's not terrible. My larger issue stems from what the process seems to have been, if Vogel is, indeed, the hire. It's another red flag that this organization is mismanaged.

 

frankly, Glenn is no Doc, seriously overrated. He and Cs ‘Big 3’ were a one-off perfect meld. And since???

 

what is that, some kind of cement-shoes, dump-his-body-in-the-river reference if he gets it wrong???

 

You're entitled to your fan perspective. Regardless of who's coach next season if these kids play up to expectation all the teeth gnashing and pearl clutching will look pretty silly.

 

Who's Glenn? Who's Doc?

 

The big question is, what expectation was set for each of these guys as individuals and what's the expectation as a team? All Stone ever said was he wants to see improvement. What numbers is anyone expecting to see from Jalen, Jabari, Alpi, Tari, KPJ, KMJ, etc. I'll say from a general perspective the only 2 players that played better last year than I had expected them to based on their draft rank were Alpi and KMJ. Outside of that, everyone else fell a little or a lot short.

 

The Rockets are currently incompetent. A bridge coach is fine because they need competence.

 

It sounds like the majority here want a piss and vinegar coach. Not sure I agree that its the best way to instruct. Mutual respect and appropriate accountability should be a requisite for anyone who coaches this team. Boundaries will be important. A good leader of men will go a long way for these young players. Each player has plenty of bullet points to address next season, but from the candidates that seem to be favored they all better bust ass on defense.

 

I think if we get Vogel, we will have much of the same frustrations offensively we had with Silas.

 

Missing wide open shots?

 

I did think about that. You can't put people in wide open positions and then be blamed when they miss the shot.

 

You would think! (Silas WAS a bad coach for varying reasons, but his offense produced the looks).

 

My god your Terry Stotts reference is spot on.

There is a segment of fans (particularly White fans) who believe that young players need a disciplinarian to get them in line. Since that never works, those coaches inevitably are fired. Just ask Rick Carlisle.

Now, I don't believe that Vogel is actually that kind of coach; he is not a piss and vinegar coach in the vein of say, JVG, SVG or even Riley. He is actually more like Rick Adelman or Doc than Thibo-dumb or the Van Grumpy bros. I am just not sure how effective he will be. In today's NBA, you have to consider the impact a coach will have on getting FAs. Here is why:

Let's say Harden and Brown both come to Houston. Rockets get off to slow start, players start complaining. Team does not do as well as it should. Who do you think will get blamed? The coach. So we fire the coach and have to hire a new one. Now you are paying two coaches. We all know that TF is no doing that.

Consider this - new coach knows that Harden and Brown are not the kinds of players to listen to a Vogel. So, Vogel speaks against signing them, mainly for self preservation. Team does poorly due to lack of veteran talent. Those two players go somewhere else. Their agents tell other players to avoid the Rockets because the team is run by idiots. This happens. Just ask the Hawks. Atlanta still has trouble signing players because of the dumbass old ownership and stupid overrated Duke bum Danny Ferry. That is why they overpay for guys like Joe Johnson, John Collins and Paul Milsap.

 

My god your Terry Stotts reference is spot on.

There is a segment of fans (particularly White fans) who believe that young players need a disciplinarian to get them in line. Since that never works, those coaches inevitably are fired. Just ask Rick Carlisle.

Now, I don't believe that Vogel is actually that kind of coach; he is not a piss and vinegar coach in the vein of say, JVG, SVG or even Riley. He is actually more like Rick Adelman or Doc than Thibo-dumb or the Van Grumpy bros. I am just not sure how effective he will be. In today's NBA, you have to consider the impact a coach will have on getting FAs. Here is why:

Let's say Harden and Brown both come to Houston. Rockets get off to slow start, players start complaining. Team does not do as well as it should. Who do you think will get blamed? The coach. So we fire the coach and have to hire a new one. Now you are paying two coaches. We all know that TF is no doing that.

Consider this - new coach knows that Harden and Brown are not the kinds of players to listen to a Vogel. So, Vogel speaks against signing them, mainly for self preservation. Team does poorly due to lack of veteran talent. Those two players go somewhere else. Their agents tell other players to avoid the Rockets because the team is run by idiots. This happens. Just ask the Hawks. Atlanta still has trouble signing players because of the dumbass old ownership and stupid overrated Duke bum Danny Ferry. That is why they overpay for guys like Joe Johnson, John Collins and Paul Milsap.

 

It's unbelievable to me that people are drawing ANY connections between Vogel and Silas. Give me a break.

Vogel: Champion who took another team to the conference finals twice.
Silas: Worst win percentage of any coach in history who has coached 200+ games.

Vogel may not be your #1 choice (he's not my #1 choice), but do not compare him, in any way, to Silas. Silas is arguably the worst coach of all time from a results perspective.

 

Im not touching the "white fans" thought. I think its misplaced and in bad taste no offense. Im also not concerned with 'what if's' and water cooler stuff about FAs and the such. Im more focused on what coach can extract the most from our young squad. Appeasing these "stars" is what got our franchise in the position that its in currently. I dont want to give players that type of power especially Harden in his twilight. Humoring your fantasy scenario I think Jaylen Brown would thrive in a Vogel system, but again that is no guarantee either. Tilman might be a closet racist for all we know, but Im going to hope he doesnt send out a mass email through the franchise voicing those thoughts ala Levenson. Even in that example ATL had great teams under Budenholzer after the fact. This is one hell of a dartboard.

 

well this doesn’t sound too good

“Good for them. We don’t deserve it,” center Roy Hibbert said in a home dressing room that was more demoralized than angry. “We’ll see, in the playoffs. But we’ve got to figure things out. Miami is a good team. They’ve had a couple hiccups themselves. But we don’t deserve that No. 1 seed.”

Indiana forward David West, who hinted at a variety of basketball and chemistry issues ailing his team now, said: “We’ve got to concede that we haven’t played basketball well enough to deserve the top spot. That’s pretty much it. We haven’t played well enough. We haven’t been a good-looking basketball team for quite some time now. That’s on the guys in this locker room.” […] “We’re probably the most downtrodden, 50-plus win team in the history of the game,” he said. “We watch film from a few months ago, we don’t even recognize ourselves.”

Said Hibbert: “We should all go to group therapy. … We’ve been spiraling. Now we’re splintering a little bit.”

I remember Lance Stephenson wreaking havoc…Didn’t he and Evan Turner beat each other’s ass in practice during the playoffs?

I remember they started out great that season then pretty much collapsed and limped their way to playoffs…beat the below .500 8th seed Hawks in 7, beat a mediocre Wizards team, then got slapped up by the Heat losing the 3 road games by a combined 49 points

not really impressed by that run, but the ECF run year before was impressive to me

 

Sounds like the Rockets when trying to overcome the Warriors.

 

KPJ and Green produced the looks....they were given the ball and said BEAT the other team.....terrible pressure, terrible offense.

DD