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Without radical change, stick a fork in this team

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Sweet Lou 4 2, Feb 10, 2009.

  1. jump shooter

    jump shooter Contributing Member

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    I have 10,000,000 reasons why its wrong.
     
  2. emjohn

    emjohn Contributing Member

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    Agreed with the initial premise.

    We're seeing a locker room turning toxic, with no leader on the team willful enough to get things in line. We've got as much talent, if not more, than any of the elite teams in the league, but we've got two players that refuse guidance and instruction and want to play the way they see fit. We've got a handful of "good guys" that play the right way and want everyone to join them, only they are passive and avoid confrontation; allowing the others to ignore them if they so choose. We've got a "player's coach" that lightly scolds the two knuckleheads instead of taking them behind the woodshed like they deserve.

    JVG is the only leader this franchise has seen since Olajuwon circa 1997. Now, don't take that as my saying he should have never left - we almost certainly wouldn't see a team this loaded had he continued to have a say in personnel. Just more 35 y/o half-dead stiffs that play Gundy ball.

    I don't know what leaders are out there to be had.

    I know that the going notion is that we need to keep McGrady and trade Artest. I think that's the easy path, but I don't think it's necessarily the right one. At least Artest works hard on the court. How long do we give McGrady? Even if healthy, do we have any reason to believe that he's going to buy into the team concept? Or are we seeing in him the same things Detroit is seeing in Allen Iverson right now?

    Every game we have like we had last night, we increase the risk that this team will completely fall apart.

    S.T.A.Y.A.W.A.Y.

    Actually not quite - there was one other team in his career that Rafer was talking to the media like this. Toronto, the year Vince pulled the ultimate quit job on a franchise.
     
  3. 24 in a roll

    24 in a roll Member

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    i don't think kirk hinrich has the abilities or personality to change the dynamics of this team for the better.
     
  4. 24 in a roll

    24 in a roll Member

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  5. emjohn

    emjohn Contributing Member

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    No, he's really not. Kirk Hinrich, in the most optimistic tinted glasses evaluation has defense that is just about on par with Rafer. He is a better shooter from distance, but he's not a very good shooter from distance, he's average. Maybe that improves with the space that Yao would provide. He's got a nice PG mentality and a good A/TO ratio, but neither qualities exceed Rafer's. The only major plus is that he doesn't tend to go on brick sprees like Rafer does.

    Slightly better offense, slightly worse defense. Not enough of an upgrade that he would change the Rockets appreciably. Plus, you have to bear in mind that as long as McGrady is around, you are going to significantly damper any PG's ability to facilitate the team offense. McGrady takes the ball out of their hands and turns them into standstill shooters. Maybe that helps Kirk's game, but I doubt it - look at how Rose has made him all but worthless in Chicago.

    Get rid of McGrady, and I think you can re-evaluate the 1 position, including taking a second look at what Alston gives you. Maybe it was a fluke, but Alston looked pretty good when McGrady was out in January. Kirk probably would have looked just as nice.

    But if McGrady is here, and Adelman continues to permit McGrady to hijack possessions, you need more of a in-his-prime Derek Fisher or Ron Harper. Triangle Offense prototype PG: tallish sniper that can bear down on defense.

    Evan
     
  6. emjohn

    emjohn Contributing Member

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  7. Sweet Lou 4 2

    Sweet Lou 4 2 Contributing Member
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    I think Wafer should start over T-mac for sure. Wafer's D can't be worse than T-mac's.

    If T-mac is injured, then let him play less minutes while he heals. If t-mac has confidence issues, let him deal with them at the end of the bench. And if he has motivational issues, let him get motivated by losing his starting job.

    I think Hayes should start. I think Hayes has no business as an NBA starter, but at least the guy hustles. Right now, he gives more than Shane Battier. Start hayes next to Scola.

    Starting 5:

    Yao
    Scola
    Hayes
    Alston
    Wafer

    Will we win with this line-up? No less than now is for sure. And maybe it will give this team a kick in the butt. People losing starting jobs helps.

    And frankly, Artest shouldn't get more than 5 minutes of court time until he plays the game right and shuts up.
     
  8. 24 in a roll

    24 in a roll Member

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  9. jump shooter

    jump shooter Contributing Member

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    Good post. I will go out on a limb right now and say T-Mac will probably not be in Houston after the trade deadline. I think management has had it with him. If they could possibly get multiple pieces for him like a big and another part I think the rockets will not hesitate in pulling the trigger. I think T-mac is a cancer to the team and he doesn't even know it. Could be a big big move coming.
     
  10. rocketsmetalspd

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    But in the end of the 19th day of February he may still be our cancer for another season. Damn!!
     
  11. Hayesfan

    Hayesfan Contributing Member

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    Oh Lou... Even I think that's a bad idea. Let Carl start at the 3, at least he can spread the court a little bit. Chuck can be the 6th man ;)
     
  12. rocketsmetalspd

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    The only sign that can lead you to believe the Rockets are seriously looking to deal TMac will be if they don't play him in the next two games or he plays limited minutes like 12 minutes.
     
  13. jump shooter

    jump shooter Contributing Member

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    I don't think they will tip there hand and I think the rockets will only trade him if they get veteran talent back. Something like Rasheed Wallace and parts.
     
  14. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    Ron + Luther.

    That declines every year, unlike other contracts.

    DD
     
  15. SmoothOperator

    SmoothOperator Contributing Member

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    Don't you know?

    DD is the wannabe White Chocolate point at the gym - hence the fascination.

     
  16. Dallas Rocket

    Dallas Rocket Contributing Member

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    Last night was truly embarrassing and is emblematic of what this team is becoming. It's one thing to play hard and then lose...no one has a problem with that. What is becoming this team's signature is "mailing it in" over and over again. Where is the pride, the professionalism, the guts, the leadership?

    A few observations:

    - We'll only go as far as our stars take us...and right now that is nowhere. That's the way it is in the NBA. From his body language it's obvious that TMac doesn't really give a s***, despite his protestations to the contrary. No question that's he's past his prime, but that doesn't excuse his pseudo-rehab work ethic and unwillingness to hold himself accountable. Would someone please explain what we're getting for our $21 million this year?

    - Yao is in his prime, but for whatever reasons, has not become a leader. He allows himself to get pushed and taken out of games, and get beaten down by bad calls and "bad matchups." Unfortunately he must depend on his teammates to get him the ball where and when he should, and too many times that doesn't happen. He must always demand the rock...he doesn't. At 7'6" he can only become dominant by becoming a bully, a la Shaq. I have no problem with his physical effort night and and night out, but he's not consistently mentally strong enough at this point. We'll see.

    - Battier is now a total offensive liability and less-than-elite defender. He has lost a step and is not a good fit with our other athletically challenged starters. Is it time for a "Chuck Hayes" move to the bench?

    - Scola is a gem. Let him grow and continue to set the "effort tone" for his teammates.

    - Our best athletes (Landry, Brooks, Wafer) start every game on the bench. Sure, they have defensive deficiencies but that can be taught with game experience and practice reps. You can't teach athleticism. Time to put at least Brooks, and maybe also Wafer, in the starting lineup and let them learn.

    - Rafer has no upside. There's a reason he came readily via trade. We know what we've got with him...and it's not enough.

    - Artest is not the "third cog" I thought he could be. I am really disappointed. He has seriously slowed down. Too many times he is the ball-stopper on offense - how demoralizing for teammates. He's not a good fit and not part of our future. Let's move him before the deadline to a contender for an younger athlete with an upside or high draft pick.

    - In the absence of leadership from the players, it's on Adelman to lead. Nuf said.

    Right now the Rockets are (I hate to say it) the Dallas Cowboys of the NBA.

    The Emperor has no clothes.

    My two cents...

    D R
     
  17. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    Ah, I take my little follower off ignore for a bit and look how he is still obsessed.

    Why not go challenge a preschooler to a game of hoops for charity, and you can show your mock bravado, and how none of that has to do a lick with discussing basketball.

    Which you fail to consistently do, maybe you should actually contribute to the board and talk about the Rockets instead of just follow me around like a lost puppy.

    DD
     
  18. 24 in a roll

    24 in a roll Member

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    reasonable.
     
  19. DaDakota

    DaDakota If you want to know, just ask!

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    Actually, I think this team has been desperate for a point guard for years....and believe in today's NBA with the no touch on the perimeter rules in place a good penetrating PG is a huge plus.

    Players I would love to have on the Rockets that fit this mold.

    1. B-Diddy
    2. Hinrich
    3. A. Miller

    Just to name a few.

    DD
     
  20. ibm

    ibm Member

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    excellent post. i enjoyed reading it.
     

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