Are you guys telling that without Cato we'll never win a championship (assuming the Lakers remain intact and play us in the postseason)? Oh, please! Cato blocked Shaq twice and suddenly people are saying that he's the only guy who can defend Shaq up front? Quit kidding yourselves. No one can defend Shaq. Cato can't defend Shaq any better than other centers in the league. How does Cato ever score his points? Off of great dishes from our guards for the easy dunk. Are you telling me that we can't have Pig Miller doing that? The man doesn't even play like a center. He has no post up game and he's not very tough. A center must have that toughness...if you don't have it you won't succeed. He can't even rebound, for God's sake! That's what crappy centers are usually good for. Most of them just stand around and get at least 8 boards a game. Some say that Cato is going to turn around. After all, he says so himself. Well, I think he's had plenty of time. This is his first chance to get some quality minutes, and he blows it with his heartless play. He doesn't even try. He probably thinks he's good enough already, seeing that he has his starting job and his money. Thing is, Cato should be at the point where he's fighting for every loose ball, battling for position to get the rebound, and working on his game every damn day. Sure, he has potential. That makes him a hot commodity. But, will he ever achieve that which he is capable of? How can he if he just stands around doing nothing? I'd say he plays with less heart than Dream does today. I think our backcourt is good enough to carry us to the promised land. But how will we keep them happy if we have a no good center making tons more than they are? The only thing Cato will bring is jealousy. I'd rather have a guy like Pig Miller, who is thankful for what he's got, plays his heart out every game, and doesn't earn alot of money. Jeesh, we already have Cuttino Mobley comparing his salary to Cato's. Steve Francis talks about how Mobley "deserves more." Despite all this, however, what should we do with Cato? Hmmm...trade him for Duncan? Yeah right. But..we might be able to swing a trade to get us another big man who is decent. Maybe we could package him with Drew or the Wizard. Who knows? However, I just don't see it happening. We read the Boston newspapers and they're talking about a trade for Potapenko. That's just scary. Fact is, most centers are overpaid scrubs. At least our Cato still has some skills. We'll always have that potential and maybe he'll realize it someday. He'll always be a decent player and as long as we have our backcourt Cato will be adequate for our team. So, in conclusion, I say keep Cato. Heck, we can't do better. No one will ever trade a good center like Zo or Duncan away. These players are just too damn rare. I guess my post seems to be contradicting. Thing is, I feel that Cato will never realize his potential. I see how lazy he is on the court, how he never tries. This just ticks me off. However, I do know that Cato might be the best thing for us right now...at least better than Potapenko. I think that I'll always be complaining about Cato's performance, yet I don't think I'll ever want to actually trade him (I just can't over that article hinting a trade with Boston- ugh!). We have most of our positions covered, and we won't be able to get a good center out of a trade, so why bother? I can see Cato leaving, though. Rudy T. just can't stand a player who doesn't come to play on(just so you don't come with the CB argument- he bring everything he's got whenever he steps on the floor) the court. ------------------ Nederland 2000 NBA+stupidity=Brand ROY NBA+common sense=Franchise MVP Houston Rockets Space Center- Not just another ClutchCity.NET clone. We're that and more!
NO. The difference between Miller and Cato is after the dish from our guards pentration, Cato finishes his dunk, while Miller gets blocked. ------------------ Check out the best source for draft info. Draftsource.net
I think I've heard this "But Cato blocked Shaq!" line before...it was when Rodrick Rhodes stole the ball from Jordan. ------------------ "Okay KG, next time down, you give Cousin Billy his turn, then he'll give Uncle Joe his turn, then we'll give Shaq a turn." -Rudy T, in the Dream Team 2000 huddle
TheFreak...LOL! RF34, Hmm, you have a point. I guess I was so keen on bashing Cato that I didn't think. Cato basically fits into what we're trying to do, I guess. I don't care much for his play or desire, but he'll do as long as we have our guards. Hopefully, he won't be the reason for one of our guards bolting after this season. ------------------ Nederland 2000 NBA+stupidity=Brand ROY NBA+common sense=Franchise MVP Houston Rockets Space Center- Not just another ClutchCity.NET clone. We're that and more!
The thing that I just can't understand is how a professional basketball player, with professional trainers, who has 24 hours every day to work on his game, and gets paid a king's ransom to play the game has no minute resemblance of a decent offensive game. I just cannot understand that. I haven't even seen a coordinated jump hook from this guy. How in the hell can you be 26, and have played basketball in high school, college, and for 3 years at the pro-level and not have a basic pivot step?! Trade his ass. Sir Scarv, the difference between Cato and the guys you included in your list is that Cato is still very tradeable. Those guys are all 10's on the chumpter scale, and GM's know that their potential will never be realized. Cato has athleticism, and someone will take a chance on him. Get out while you still can. Heart is something that you have to have from the beginning...you don't miraculously acquire it over the offseason. ------------------ $42million. 7 years.
Remember: 1) Horry will be the next Pippen 2) Rhodes steal of Jordan illustrates great defensive ability. 3) Harold Miner is baby Jordan!! 4) If Vernon Maxwell had any dedication or sense, he would be mentioned as one of the greatest guards of the 1990s. 5) Cato's great rebounding and defense 6) The Twin Towers (Sampson/Dream) will bring multiple championships to Houston 7) Pippen is one of the 50 greatest players in NBA History. Okay, I just had to take a swipe at Pip. However, what happened to our great expectations and potential? We need more from/than Cato in the pivot. Besides Detroit and Chicago, guard oriented teams are entertaining but never win championships. Your half court game is what separates pretenders from contenders. We need a serviceable center 12-15 pts 11-9 rebounds a night. This crap about getting 7 rebounds in 5 games is disturbing!!! Remember the Golden State teams with Hardaway, Mullins and Richmond? What did they do in the playoffs? ------------------ Respect Hakeem's legacy. A championship in the hand is worth two in the bush!!
ThaCabbage, Exactly my thoughts. Cato is at the point where people still think he might realize his potential. We just need to find a team that has been longing for a big man for a very long time. To them, Cato might be quite a catch. The guy has no heart, no desire. I just can't stand a guy who doesn't give it his all on the basketball floor. He always talks about how he needs to improve, how he's going to "work during the offseason." I don't buy it any longer. He's full of it, in my opinion. As I said, he doesn't even play like a real center. Height is valuable for a few things, one of them being to be able to at least stand and get a few boards. Cato can't even do that. We have guys like Steve Francis getting more boards than he does on many occasions. And that's when he was starting, not when we had Dream taking up a lot of the minutes. He has no inside game at all. At all. He can't shoot the hook, he can't do squat. Block shots? Half of the time he fouls. What good is that. On top of that, he ticks referees off with his constant whining. Rather than gathering himself to be able to prove himself later on, he acts as if he's being cheated. He blames it on others, not himself. The only thing that keeps me in doubt is the fact that we might not be able to get anything good for him. ------------------ Nederland 2000 NBA+stupidity=Brand ROY NBA+common sense=Franchise MVP Houston Rockets Space Center- Not just another ClutchCity.NET clone. We're that and more!
Do I regret signing Cato? No. Do I regret signing him to a 7 year contract for 6 million per season? Maybe. I like Cato and what he can bring to the floor. The Rockets don't need him to score 20 points a game, they need him for his defense and rebounding. Cato is young, quick and athletic. He has alot going for him in this league and will be a better basketball player in the years to come. Let's hope those years aren't far off and they are with the Rockets. ------------------ The lottery sucks!
"who has 24 hours every day to work on his game"? LOL! NBA players get paid too much to sleep! But I agree that he definitely needs to spend this entire offseason working on his offensive game (maybe develop a 15' shooting range; hey, I can dream! ) and do a little soul-searching to find his intensity which he misplaced in the preseason. Woah, hold on . . . don't trade too fast. If a sweet deal comes along (e.g. Duncan), then heck ya! I'll drive over from Florida to help him pack his bags But I don't think he needs to be actively shopped. This is really the first season that he's played a significant role on a team. It's like his pseudo-rookie year. Give him one more season, or at least to the trading deadline next season, before you ship him and see if he develops. After all, if we still don't like him, he'll still be a defensive 6'11" athletic shotblocking center that'll be an attractive commodity to a lot of teams. Besides that, it really sucks always getting torched by ex-Rockets playing on new teams ------------------
Everyone keeps saying to give Cato some time. I think that might be a luxury we can't afford. Giving Cato more time simply means giving other teams the chance to see how much the guy actually sucks and how he didn't develop in the offseason. If we want to trade him, now is the time. We either trade him this offseason or we keep him and his fat contract. ------------------ Nederland 2000 NBA+stupidity=Brand ROY NBA+common sense=Franchise MVP Houston Rockets Space Center- Not just another ClutchCity.NET clone. We're that and more!
While I've made arguments for keeping Cato, I don't think he's going to necessarily realize all this supposed potential and become anything on offense. I have to agree that if he hasn't found any offense by now, I think he probably has just a slight better chance than Thomas Hamilton had in developing an offensive game. His defense is what he brings to the table though. My argument was just that he seemed to play Shaq well and that he could be an important part of our getting past LA in the playoffs as the supposedly overpaid, undermotivated Greg Ostertag did for Utah. Also, his 3 blocks a game (at 35 mins/game) isn't that easy to find from a guy who has the bulk to play the bigger guys at the position (Ratliff, Camby, etc. are all real light). What I really dislike is his inconsistency in rebounding, but he would still have 9/game if he averaged 35 mins/game at his current pace. Basically, I say trade him only if we're getting something valuable in return and we have some other guy lined up for center. ------------------
launchpad: You say to give Cato more minutes. my question is if you had an opportunity to play for the first time in 3 years wouldn't you at the minimum be excited when you were in the game. As mentioned by many other Cato shows as much heart sitting on the bench as he does on the court, none. He had an opportunity this year to finally get significant minutes and he blew it. I would think differently if he came in and was at least excited to be in the game. Cato didn't make rookie mistakes, he just showed no effort. Trade him ------------------
4 blocks, 3 rebounds 12 points on 6 of 7 shooting, and only 1 turnover. Plus most of his shots were mid range jumpers. Sounds like his game is developing to me, and it looked like it too. ROCKS ------------------ [This message has been edited by Houston Rocks (edited April 20, 2000).]
I might be excited . . . or I might be nervous. Either way, given enough time, I would eventually find my role and become a major contributor. Anyway, if showing excitement is the way you gauge players, then you probably don't want Tim Duncan, as he rarely shows any emotion on the court (*Mr. Rogers' voice* Can you say "stoic"? I knew you could ). Besides, I am not opposed to trading Cato in a package for anyone that will be an overall upgrade to the team. I am, however, opposed to forcing a trade just to get rid of the guy without getting anything better in return. ------------------
Cato hit some jumpers last night? (didn't see the game) That's really a good sign. Also, maybe Cato's got depression like Vin Baker. I know all that money and playing a game for a job would certainly depress me. ------------------
You simply must have some interior defense on the team, and right now Cato is our best hope to solidify this part of our team. I am not against traing Cato, but I would want ideally a Kandi, Ratliff, Camby or McGrady as part of it (say if we thrown in Drew + picks). I put McGrady in there because like what Pippen could do when he was good--and even better than Horry, he is one of the few 3's that can make quite a presence in impacting a whole defense. Now we can wait until next year and move in he top 5 to get Woods, Haywood or Mihm, or maybe we can get K. Johnson or Thomas or Prybella to help some this year, but barring a trade, Cato--motivated or not--is just our best bet right now. I don't see us having many choices other than seeing how he turns out unless we can get an equivalent shotblocker in return. I think there is some hope, Ratliff's #'s through his first 3 years are no different than Cato's. I don't know much about Ratliff's work ethic though. ------------------
Cabbage said: "..... the thing that I just can't understand is how a professional basketball player, with professional trainers, who has 24 hours every day to work on his game, and gets paid a king's ransom to play the game has no minute resemblance of a decent offensive game. I just cannot understand that. I haven't even seen a coordinated jump hook from this guy. How in the hell can you be 26, and have played basketball in high school, college, and for 3 years at the pro-level and not have a basic pivot step?! Trade his ass. " Is it any wonder that Cab is my hero????? [This message has been edited by popeye (edited April 20, 2000).]
I agree with cabbage's statements, too. From what I'm reading, the majority of the complaints with Kelvin Cato can be divided into two separate catagories. The first one is Cato's lack of skill (offensively and, to some extent, defensively). The second type of criticism often directed at Cato is his lack of desire and work ethic. I see that some argue for Cato, stating that he's only in his 3rd year, didn't get PT, etc. Those are factors that may lead someone to conclude that he can get better. Those of you who choose to be so optimistic about him are free to do that. IMO, there's more reasons to be pessimistic about Cato than optimistic. Which leads to the second catagory, that being Kelvin's lack of heart. I can excuse a guy for being raw. I can't excuse a guy for not having heart. That's what makes me most pessimistic about him is that he doesn't have heart. Quit complaining to the refs and get your butt in gear! It takes heart to improve, not time. Not even good coaching can substitute for desire and passion. When I hear Cato's statements of his own plans to work hard this summer and get better, I laugh. What's going to happen when the offseason comes around? Is he all of sudden going to find the desire to get out of bed to work out, practice, get stronger? If a man can't show desire during the season, which is the premier showcase, how is he going to show it when no one is watching, when the rewards for that work are months away, even years away? It just doesn't work that way. Even last night, when Cato had a relatively good offensive game, he was still not hustling for rebounds, getting better defensive position, or battling for loose balls. His numbers may take away some of the sting of the charges against him, but being the last game of the season, I'd expect him to show some of the supposed fire that will supposedly mark his offseason work. Right... If the Rockets all of sudden found themselves playoff contenders, facing a matchup with the Lakers, I seriously doubt that Kelvin Cato will be the difference. Shop him around, trade him. ------------------
Well, this is pretty much what I've gotten by readin this thread. Cato's defense is good, and we need him to clog up the middle and erase people's mistakes. That's what will make us a really good defensive team. But at the same time, Cato has no offensive game and doesn't always show up to play. Well, the opinion that Cato has no offensive game can be refuted. Over the last 3 or 4 weeks, I've seen Cato hit some 15 foot jumpers. Even a fadeway, which by the way he hit again yesterday against the grizzlies. His offensive game is sorta coming around. But it's not really established yet, so he feels hesisitant to use it, as does Rudy T. Plus, with the whole summer to improve his game, I'm sure Cato will have at least a jump hook going for him + a more consistent jumper. The only problem with Cato is he has no heart. If he gets the ball, he'll start playing harder. so there u go. KEEP CATO. The only way I want to trade him is maybe in a deal involving Olowakandi or something, so we can get a big man in return. ------------------ treasurer of the moochie norris fan club
Diagnosis: Lanky, athletic Rockets center with good physical skills but an undeveloped game, a pouty temperament, and motivational problems. Prescription: Religion.
