It is an irrelevant distinction... Its not about positions in the NBA... it's about play style and skillset... Jalen Green has skills and attributes that translate well to the NBA game and it's a guard/wing driven league. Mobley has far many more question marks and that means he has the highest bust potential... To me his best case scenario is a Bam level player... That's not worth the risk of him being a bust imo.
Green has no point guard skills at all, that's why it's a relevant distinction. A guard or wing who can't run an offense is inherently less valuable than one who can. For all we know Green ends up a 6'6 Lou Williams, do we want to use the #2 pick on that?
We are seeing traditional SGs develop over time to become facilitators, it’s a skill that can be developed Look at Booker, LaVine, Mitchell
Sure, because their value is capped pretty low until they develop those skills. Could Green do so one day? Sure, but it's far from a sure thing, most don't.
I think most premier scoring guards are capable and all do develop facilitating (in today’s league). So the question is does he have what it takes to a be a next level premier scoring guard? If he does Id assume he’ll be capable of developing into a facilitator like all other 25 ppg scoring guards are He has shown flashes of pretty good vision on some passes when driving. He’s not any less capable then where Booker was at coming out of college, who averaged 1.1 assist
Green is significantly more explosive, more athletic, and even more skilled than Lou coming out... Beal was even less of a passer than Green coming out and Green's upside has the potential to be better than him imo.... Would you rather have a Beal type player or a Bam type player? Would you rather have a Tatum type player or a Bam level player?
6'6 Lou Williams would be a multiple time all star. If that's his floor then everyone would be real happy.
You are guaranteed potential stars on low contracts for at least couple of years. Harden's, CP3's or Russ' contracts made it very difficult to get the 3rd star. At least 2 or 3 yrs of tanking though. The Suns, the Bucks and the Hawks all did go through the draft for their star or superstar. Only the Clippers were entirely assembled with money.
I agree with you 100% but a lot of these guys on this board would have turned MJ Michael Jordan to the other MJ Mark Jackson if he was in this draft and available at the #2 pick for us this year. They don't understand that there is a reason why guys who can score over 25 PPG get max contracts and why pass first defensive oriented guys like Pat Bev and the Tony Allen's of the world only get nominal contracts. It's because scoring is the most coveted skill in all of basketball. Not saying there is not a place for the guys I mentioned above in the NBA, but at the #2 pick in a "deep draft" you need to grab someone that can get buckets.
I understand. I'm not really arguing against Jalen Green the prospect but Green the pick. I do think there are legit reasons to get Green at 2, if the rockets do that I won't be mad. I'll only be a little worried should they draft Suggs... But I do think as a Team Mobley guy people are really selling him short. You have people that just don't want him purely because of his position for instance then you have people acting like he's Gobert on offense. The appeal of Mobley should be that he's going to be a defensive monster for years and years. Am I worried about his size? Not really. Giannis entered the NBA at like 205...Day 1 the rockets staff will get him bulking up. He won't have college classes to worry about, this will be his job, he'll have professional dieticians and people to work with. He'll bulk up. I think once he does that he's going to be such a defensive presence that anything he does on offense will be a huge bonus...and speaking of offense, he can put the ball on the floor, a very good passer, and has a soft touch around the rim. If he further refines his footwoork and works on the baby hook he has shown in college he could become a great two way player. Will he? Not saying he will definitely, of course no one knows that, but just trying to argue the appeal of Mobley isn't just some defensive big...that is merely his floor.
Fair points, Mobley is an intriguing prospect I will admit that. I miss the old days (80's) when guys stayed in school for 3 years at the bare minimum and you really got a chance to get a better idea how said player would turn out. But I'll trust the scouts and the Rocket's FO to make the right choice between Mobley, Green, Cunningham (if he falls to #2).
You guys are funny Well I'm not going to persuade anybody but here it goes Mobley wants to be a doctor he does not have that killer instinct to kill people on the NBA floor he would rather be a damn Dr Green other hand is taking it personal that people are ranking Cade above him.. he's going to come out he's going to win Rookie of the Year and he is out for blood that is what you want to win a championship you need players that have that thuggish killer instinct inside of them Mobley does not I understand Mobley has some rare skills for a 7-footer but he doesn't have the mental makeup this is all irrelevant completely even my post is irrelevant because we are drafting Cunningham because the idiot Detroit Pistons are most likely going to draft the bad boy green because of their background and I believe Cunningham is a Texas boy born and raised in Texas I believe I could be wrong, so I think they will pass him onto us at number two so all this is irrelevant about green versus Mobley we are drafting cade Cunningham
ya'll keep saying that it's impossible for green to replicate his efficiency in the NBA but then mutter that Mobley can guard 1-5. you really think Mobley is covering Curry one night then guarding Jokic the next? Comon..
It is really damn hard for me to overlook the mentality of Dr. Mobley, because Jalen Green seems like a damn dog cut from HOF cloth. His basketball intelligence and love of the game resonates in his interviews and video breakdowns of himself. I confess I'd have to take Jalen Green for that reason, but would be excited to get Mobley as well. Rafael is in a toughhh spot.
So who are all of these scorers who were uber efficient prior to the NBA but didn't maintain their efficiency? You seem to be assuming that all big time college scorers are efficient, that's completely incorrect. Green made the jump from HS to a pro league and he was still over 60% TS%, who else does that? That's the entire point, it's unusual to have a prep/college scorer who's extremely efficient. You keep saying that "you can always find guards that can score" but you're totally ignoring the "efficiency" part. It's extremely difficult to find guards who can score lots of point AND do it efficiently. Is that efficiency guarenteed to carry over to the NBA for Green? No, but the fact that he was able to make the jump from HS all the way to a pro league and still maintain efficiency is a good indication that he's got a very good chance. Go take a look at the efficiency of most high scoring college players. 60% for a guard/wing is rare. Here's a quick sample: Trae Young, Beal, Durant, Lavine, D. Mitchell, Kawhi, Tatum , P. George, Middleton - None of them had a 60% TS% in any college season. I keep seing the comparision of Green to Jamal Crawford who was very inefficient (.507) at Michigan. Sixth man of the year, Jordan Clarkson also didn't have a 60% TS% in college. Here's the guys that did: Curry, Harden, Lillard and Booker. Are those the guys that you can easily go out and get as you keep saying? You said "Nearly every top SG prospect that comes into the league looks efficient in college or Europe". Ok, let's take a look at some of the top 4 picks: Anthony Edwards, Fulz, Wiggins, Wall, Otto Porter JR., Mayo, Tyreke Evans, Dion Waiters and Mike Conely were all top 4 picks and none of them ever had a 60% TS% season in college. Who are all of these guys who are super efficient in college that don't end up efficient in the NBA? Give me some names. Bottom line is that Mobley currently doesn't have an outside shot, doesn't have a post game, gets pushed around on the interior, isn't a great rebounder and there's concerns about his passion for the game and he doesn't have a high motor. It's far from a sure thing to assume that he's going to be a great NBA player. You have to do a whole lot of projecting of him developing things that he currently doesn't do. Green is already an efficient scorer. Is seems much easier to believe that Green could continue to do what he's already doing when moving up another level than it does to believe that Mobley will develop skills that he doesn't currently possess while also moving up in level. Also, lets stop with the Mobley can guard positions 1 to 5 stuff. If Mobley gets switched to the better NBA point guards or shooting guards he will get torched. The Simmons and Holiday's of the world can't stop those guys, let alone a big like Mobley. IMO, if you're investing the #2 overall pick in a guy with the hope that he can shutdown the Huerter's of the league then you are wasting the pick.
And is a defensive big worth a #2 in 2021? Is it a given the Mobley adds significant strength to overcome his high center of gravity to be a #2? For me.... I just don't know if Mobley can do what his calling card is (defense) against NBA competition and that's a big risky at #2. The competition USC played vs the G League is pretty significant. I just don't know which is why he has so much variance.
You do acknowledge that Cunningham is considered a franchise PG, right? I'm assuming that you know that Cunningham is the consensus top pick? Even if you haven't looked at Cunningham closely, don't you find it strange to say that Green doesn't have PG skills when he averages less than an assist less than Cunningham the franchise PG while handling the ball much less and having an better ast/to ratio? Did you watch Green closely in the G-League playoffs? 30 pts, 7 assists ( one less than Cunningham's career high) , 5 reb and 3 steals on 65%TS%? He doesn't have any PG skills?
I like Green as our pick, but the rationale for not picking him being KPJ is perplexing to me. I don’t think we have anyone on the roster that we can guarantee is a long term building block, KPJ included. But if he can’t play with Green in the back court, maybe he’s not a good as people think he is. I don’t see a KPJ-Green backcourt as a problem. If it doesn’t work out you can always trade KPJ.
I'm comparing Green to his peers in the G league last year and those in the NBA, not to Cade Cunningham. If Cunningham also needs to work on his passing, what does that have to do with Green having no PG skills? I'm also not that impressed with single game G league stats because I've watched A LOT of G league games over the past decade....I'm old enough to remember Chris Clemons averaging 24/6 in the G league or Isaiah Taylor averaging 21/10. When I watch Green, I see KMJ with better handles who doesn't know how to play defense at all. Is that worth passing on Mobley for a team that already has a young KMJ and KPJ? I just can't see how it is. If I was in the camp that thought Green would be a 30 points per game scorer one day, that would probably be different, but I just don't see him being that special a player. That said, I've certainly been wrong before, time will tell.
