Why Fans Are Frustrated

Ok, now there's something I don't quite get when criticizing Yao. You call him gifted in athletisim and IQ. Yet plenty of critics stating to NOT be uhm.. "Yao Haters"say he lacks both.

However all the while agree with you in that he possess that body and physique meant to display "brute force". BUT, include those two things they say he lacks as reasons for him to be nothing but "brute", and burry him in the low post. Some go as far as to conceive Yao as nothing but a walking stiff ONLY capable of being a low post threat, a brute in body to body aggressiveness and rebounding, pointing at his height as his only "gift". So, in that logic, if he fails to prevail and make best of his one and only gift as they claim it, he's good for nothing else but trade bait.

It's a bit of a contradiction I've noticed in the criticizing of Yao. If he is athletic while sustainable of a good BB IQ, why only keep him in ONE position required of little athleticism and little creativity and force him to fail or succeed in it? Or make it the focal point to our criticizing of Yao? I mean, if he is indeed gifted in athleticism and IQ and also possessing of a "brute" like body and height, why the lack of emphasis on the prior and the fixation on the latter in the critique of Yao?

You are the first one to not come off as a "yao hater" and include "athletic" and "IQ" in analyzing Yao as a player and talents. What I'm asking is, from all those that criticize Yao, why such a shun on Yao's other talents and praise and stoning on the other?

I do agree with most, that he lacks assertiveness in his play and that desire and flame he displayed in the olympics, but why must it always be focused on one side of his game and not the rest? I'm sure it's brought up before by few others, to have a mixture of all his talents, and infuse said aggressiveness into both sides of Yao. It's always been like two sides. One, which he was scouted as being gifted in, and serviceable, passing, shooting etc. The other, which is what we fans and coaches that have come and gone tried to mold Yao into.

The one, has been discarded by those that focus on his height and "brute" build, as false scouting or yet to be seen. Shrugging off the glimpses of those scouted talents seen in his rookie year as mere "glimpses". But, what else can a rookie show, especially one from another nation, than glimpses? When in his next year, those glimpses are kept untouched by a new system and coach to the point of being written off completely?

The other has been majorily accepted and embraced by the fans and coaches, because it is as I put it, what we fans and coaches have prefered in the molding of Yao's talents. The reason given was that he was weak in these areas and needed to work on them. Which I agree with, keeping a franchise capable and touted player from becoming one dimensional is always great for his career and for his team's career. But, ever since his second year, that reason has come and faded, the low post "brute" style and focus has remained with concrete conviction and has become in the eyes of the majority his one and only service and so-called "only gift". To which we mostly use to criticize Yao.

What I'm simply asking is, why has this become the case since his second year and remained the case with us fans? I can understand the coach, being taught a system which was secured by a low post threat, where the center played a one dimensional role. But, why in the fan's critique of Yao? I mean, to the point where many are now convinced, he never had any athleticism, he was always a big stiff only gifted with height and strong build recently, and his rookie year never happened and his scouting was all for not?

As our frustration mounds against Yao and with Yao and his lack to assert himself on the team, why still share that with the frustration on his low post play? Maybe that's as best as he's capable of playing in the molding of his low post play? Maybe his lack of desire is his lack of freedom to display desire? Maybe it's a little difficult to display fire when doused with the waters of restrain and restriction? Why not start to re-visit rookie Yao and the talents and gifts he was scouted and showed glimpses of possessing in that first year to this new land and new level of basketball? Why not mix rookie Yao and his creativity with the new molded "brute" side of Yao?

As one devoted to an area that requires both fire and inspiration, I know it's pretty damn difficult to express either when your creative freedom is inflicted with restraints. Such as doing things ONE way or NO way at all. Especially being told to do things someone else's way or no way.

I mean surely we must all consider this when it comes to Yao. Afterall, he is being told to do things a certain way or none at all, by those that control his future with the team, his time with the team and his style on the team and pay him for his services and same were your father figures in bringing you from your natural custom to a whole new one. Which you're trying your damn best to still get accustomed to as your surroundings keep constantly changing. ie (the constant trading of teammates, two coaches in two years). Not so easy to just rebel through all that. Fire leads rebellion, and his fire is being stifled.

 

Damn I need to learn to be more effecient in posting.

 

Most Yao only fans, such as me, did not expect Yao to become a solid all star center in 2 years. Actually back to 2002, the majority of chinese fans didn't even know could Yao have a better career than Wang Zhizhiin the league. Right now we are more than proud to know Yao's current 19 pts, 9 rebs. We think Yao have done enough to please everyone, though probably Amare is the better, you can not call Yao a bad 1st pick after all. People should be happy, they should stop saying "Yao suck" "Damn Yao" "Yao stupid", words like that are annoying.

 

Great thread.

The fact that Yao rarely wins the jump ball should be a clue. There'a a reason why there have been no real NBA superstars who are 7' 4" +. The physical tradeoff is lack of quickness, slow reaction time, having to "gather themselves", poor foot speed, lack of stamina.

That being said, Yao is the best really tall player to come into this league I can remember. I'm not talking about 7' or 7'1". Consider Mark Eaton, Stick Bradley, and all the rest. He's a good shooter and passer. His bball background allowed him to dominate by just being tall, but he wasn't used to being bullied, and his lack of quickness did not hamstring him like it does now. For all his intelligence, he hasn't mastered NBA figure-out-the-officials 101. Witness his puzzled, exasperated look every time he gets called for blocking after the offense initiates contact. Like many posters have stated, the aggressor gets the calls and Yao is a weenie. This makes me wonder what the hell Patrick Ewing is here for.

Yao isn't going anywhere. A small ray of hope emerged last nite in seeing how he was used in the 2nd half. I liked the adjustments. Not only did he score, but he didn't expend all his energy trying to outmuscle the masses. This team lacks an emotional leader: Yao can't, TMac should be but isn't (at least not yet).

It's going to be a long season, but I'm not going anywhere either!

D R

 

Nice Thread....

Personally i think Yao is the Missing piece to the championship.
Put yao in Pacers, they immediately become the TITLE Contender,
Put yao in lakers, they immediately become the TITLE Contender,
Put yao in kings, they immediately become the TITLE Contender,
Pet yao in Mavs, they immediately become the TITLE Contender,
blah blah blah.... just like rik smiths... sad but true!!!
But yao as a franchise player with max contract... hmmmm... yao will prove me wrong...

 

All I know is that if Yao continues to show slowed signs of progress, Les better not just hand over a max contract to our soft, 7'6" jump shooter. Yao had unlimited potential coming into the league. After 2 1/3 years in the NBA, that potential has really come into focus where I think he isn't going to improve all that much more. He may become a little better as a defender and scorer, but as a 7'6" center, his rebounding must improve. I just don't see it ever happening. He's like a 7'6" Mo Taylor, except for he scores more because he's so damn close to the basket. I just don't ever see his game attitude shifting from pansy to powerplayer. People need to see him for what he is, a finesse player that lacks quickness and the desire to dominate.

I really hope Les places winning over marketing and makes the right decision for the team.

 

Why people are complaining about Yao's "passive" play is beyond anyone with basketball knowledge or eyes that work. Here is a guy that is playing as aggressive as humanly possible. However, his aggressiveness doesn't play huge dividends most of the time because THE DUDE IS HACKED AT LEAST TWICE EACH TIME HE PUTS UP A SHOT! If I was getting hacked several times each possession without getting a call, thus making a bad shot, turnover, or even more astounding, an offensive foul, and I had Yao's incredibly high IQ coupled with a team-first attitude, then it makes him a pretty smart player to look for his teammates more often. What we have to understand is that Hakeem didn't ever get any calls when he first came in the league either. Then again, Olajuwon wanted to fight the opposing team also. When Yao starts getting the benefit of getting fouls called in his favor, his aggressiveness will become more profound.

You people can certainly realize this. We all watch the same games and I'm sure at least some of you have played basketball to see what the rest of us see. Once Yao starts getting his fair share of calls in his favor, his play will be exponentially better.

 

Jeff, great thread.

I think what makes it difficult and makes it frustrating for the fans is that we HAVE seen Yao play VERY well in many games. Sometimes it is just one half, sometimes it is a full game. But what we normally see is Yao's inconsistancies are very consistant, especially this year.

We SEE the greatness in him at times, and at other times we dont. He either looks pretty good or looks terrible. Case in point is the two halves last night in the Lakers game.

Ultimately it is all going to come down to Yao. It is all about motivation at this point. Right now, Yao only "turns it on" when he 1) gains EARLY confidence because of positive results of his early play or 2) he gets angry when he gets embarrised by stiffs dunking on him. The first situation is the best of course as it is "positive reinforcement". He sees good things and gains confidence throughout the game. That's why on nights when Yao starts off well, he ususally has a great game. On night's when Yao doesnt start off well, his confidence drops and thus his prodution drops. On the second point, when he gets angry after being embarrised, that will only give Yao "spurts" of good play and that is what happened last night with only putting a half of good play together.

I am not sure the answers in terms of Yao, but much of it lies WITHIN Yao and his confidence and WILLINGNESS to want to be great. What will motivate Yao? How do we go about doing it? Is JVG the right coach to motivate Yao or would someone like Phil Jackson do a better job? Perhaps when we answer those questions is when we see Yao's play taken to the next level.

EDIT: As an aside, all this BS talk about not giving Yao a max contract or trading him etc, LOL. 1) Yao is not going to be traded. Forget even talking about it. He is a HUGE boon to this franchise, especially off the court. Yao is the leading vote getting in the NBA All Star game now. What does that tell you? Cant you see the dollar signs in Les' eyes??
and 2) Yao is going to get the MAX! Keep in mind that the Max has little to do with "on court play" and more to do with "what the market will bear." In "theory" if it had to do ONLY with "on court play" then only a handful of NBA players would get Max deals. Garnett, Duncan, Shaq, Kobe, Tmac etc. But keep in mind just about EVERY team in the NBA has a Max contract, guys like Finley, Jamison, SAR, Walker etc. Keep in mind those players when you gripe about Yao getting the Max.

 

As much as some of us may bemoan the fact that Yao isn't an NBA-ready product, the fact is that he is one of the most unique talents the league has ever seen. Never in NBA history has there been a player so big AND so skilled.

All that promise comes with a caveat, though: For a number of reasons, some of which are known only to Yao, it is going to take a patient, encouraging coach to bring it out. Someone who understands him and works with him to maximize his effectiveness on both ends of the court. None of us know what goes on during Rockets practice sessions, but we can all see on the court that the current coaching staff has completely and utterly failed to bring out the best of Yao.

Sure, Yao is partly to blame for this. In a perfect world, he would dig down and find the strength to be great no matter who's in charge. At this point, though, it doesn't look like he's ready to do that.

Which brings us to this: We have a player with the skill to be dominating on a nightly basis, especially when combined with another player who must be double-teamed. As a Rockets fan, I want a coach who will find a way to exploit such an advantage. JVG has had a year and a half to work with Yao, and the results have ranged from mediocre to downright dismal.

I don't think the situation is entirely JVG's fault, but the bottom line is that a championship-caliber coach would have figured out a way to bring out the beast in Yao on a regular basis -- even if it's a hook-shot/Shanghai-shake/no-look-pass beast instead of a dunking-Amare beast. JVG has proven that he is not capable of getting the job done.

 

It is Yao's fault that this is happening to him. Just like JVG hasn't been able to develop a young player, is it different with Yao? Yao has regressed skill-wise, and Yao is a fool if he doesn't recognize this. Ironically, he has the greatest opportunity to rectify this by being able to control his future come this offseason. Either he can be a pliant soldier and just take was is given to him or he will grab the opportunity to wrest power away from the undeserved.

 

Yao is not playing himself, he is not playing the way he wants to, he just playing the way somebody told him, somebody just force him turn into another person he like, Yao just blow the assignment, at this point you can said it's Yao's fault.

 

This is a free country in the United States. If it really is his supervisor JVG that is causing him to regress as an employee, he should find another job. That is the American way. The un-American way is to labor at your current job unhappy and discontent.

 

you are off topic man, Yao couldn't feel any free about his so called "JOb". nobody will argue your nonsense amercian way or Your labor job.

 

Did anyone see this (from GM Houston board)?

Yao certainly needs to change his mentality.

Jon Barry, a close friend of a local radio sports talk host, was on his ESPN radio program in LA; "The Big Show", with Steve Mason / John Irland, KSPN 710, 1-4pm pst. Barry confided that:
Yao's handicap is that he does not have a mean streak
Yao is overly nice. case in point, Yao spent 1+ hr in CD's office, after Lue was traded, defending Lue. Yao effectively said that it was his fault that Lue could not consistently make entry passes to the post.
Yao knows the correct way to protect the ball to fend off double teams, which is to raise the ball above head and rotate body, using footwork to gain an opening, to get a better view of the court. But, Yao is reluctant to do so, cos he is afraid that he may elbow defenders, which he did against Magette last year.
In this last team viewing of the previous game against the Suns.
JVG pointed out to Yao that Marion was guarding him single in 2H, and his mates did not pass to him. JVG
emphatically said "you need to call time, and grab me in the throat to demand that they pass the ball to you."
while the self-proclaimed BB writers from sina.com would have his readers to believe that Yao's handicaps are big buttock and short wing span, which are false, a real NBA player, who actually have played the game for over 10 years, says that it is his lack of a mean streak. the absence of which keeps Yao from playing at MVP-caliber level

Honestly, I'm quite disappointed he is like this. Seriously, you cannot be dominant unless you are willing to punish defenders.

 

Jeff, I understand where you're coming from. Frustration does not equal to hate.

Here's several points I want to make:
1. If T-Mac gets a max contract, so should Yao. With these two, we're set, we just need to fill our roster with younger better role players.

2. You guys place too much expectation on Yao. Just for a second, assuming Yao turned out to be very aggressive and play as dominant as you guys would like, are we going to beat some of these good teams with damn good premeter shooting? The roster as of right now, it's not going to get it done. We need someone like Rip Hamilton or Chauncy Billup. We also desperately need a defense presence from PF spot who can be good spot up shooter that create a threat.

Give it time, and let our roster fall into place. The important thing is keep both TMac and Yao.

 

Yao will definately get a max deal. If the Rox don't offer it, somebody else will. You've got 32 teams. How many of them have power forwards playing the 5? Supply is low of legit 5s. So demand will be high for Yao. No question about it. Yao will be offered a max deal.

I do wonder if the Rox retain Yao, that we will be doomed for mediocricy. The problem is, who do you trade him for that is a true upgrade? If you can't pull it off, don't do it. But I would start entertaining offers now so to see what other teams are willing to offer.

The Timberpups might be willing to exchange KG for Yao now that their season is turning into a disaster...yet again. They've tried everything to surround KG but he just can't get it done over there. If you were them and could cut bait and pick up a new young superstar in the making, you could remain competative for years. Probably not KG but who else is worth it? Lebron ain't going nowhere plus we have TMac.

 

i''m not presumptuous enough to speak for "fans". thats the thread starter's divine, no divine aint right ... well, free speech is cherished, however challenged the speaker's limitations.

we have a problem Houston, and it aint (only) Yao Ming. exclusive from a fan outside the original poster's concept.

My most frustrating experience as a Rocket fan, is the failure to blend our obvious talent to anything resembling a system.

1. Players question open shots.
2. JVG admits the team he developed lacks the spirit of the the team he inherited.(Steve haters unbunch thy undergarments, its about spirit not trade)
3. our game plan so often seems askew, eg: keep covering the post, even if our opponent (Suns) are shooting lights out from the arc.
4. at what point do yah admit that the players you have NOW! are more valuable than some "ideal system" (system is always used loosely in the case of ole man grumpy) if the NBA aspires to be the best BB on the planet ... JVG is surely the anti-NBA.

 

I think what is the most frustrating about this season of Yao is that during his first two years, he showed some steady, albeit slow, progression. He would leave his feet less and less on defense, leading to fewer silly fouls. He protected the ball better over time, added moves to his repetoire, and generally showed improvement in most facets of his game.

But this year, all that has gone down the crapper. He's tentative, indecisive, seeming to back down from even the smallest of guards even when he is jumping into them to contend their shots. Anytime a guard gets penetration into the lane, and Yao is our current center, I pretty much brace myself for Yao to either get embarassed by being scored on, or get called for a foul. His subsequent facial expressions only further exasperate me, because he is intelligent enough to understand why he gets picked on by the refs.

I'm like Clutch. He'll put it together for a short stretch here in a little bit, and most fans will be happy again. But I don't personally think he will ever learn to be consistent for this team. And now that I type that out and realize how true it is...I'm really, really depressed.

 

Horrible coaches.

Endless trades that shake our gentle giant's confidence even more as those horrible coaches try to turn a younger, healthier Arvydas Sabonis (where are Yao's great passes?) into Patrick Ewing.

Stay-Puft Marshmallow power forwards.

No real point guard.

With luck, JVG will coach himself out of a job; with luck, that change won't further demoralize Yao; but I see a lot of hell behind and a lot of hell ahead.