Why does everyone believe Ron Artest has good defense (now)?

I have to be up early, I'm heading to bed. I'll take your silence on the Stockton query as capitulation.

Learn some logic. It's good for you. Seriously. Then come back.

 

your logic has been grossly flawed the entire time

so horrible in fact that you have convinced yourself that pulling something completely out of your ass on an internet forum means it's a substantive, factual argument

 

this guy is trying to say that John Stockton wasn't an elite defender at the PG position

John Stockton has over 750 more steals than the next closest player on the ALL TIME list. You're telling me there were a whole lot more PG's in the NBA that deserved 2nd team all defense ALL THOSE YEARS Stockton was getting it? No way. The coaches got it right...you're just salty.

 

Artest is still a very good defender...and the sad part is now that he is in LA, the refs will really let him get away with everything under the sun (See Kobe or Fisher).

 

The Lakers signed Artest for one reason. So someone other than Bryant would guard Vince Carter and Lebron.

 

I can't think of any player, since the league ruled hand checking, that the refs allowed to be as rough on wing players as they were with Artest.

I can't remember any player that could that could play better defense on his man after being beaten off the dribble.

Artest was the ying to Battier's yang. He took offensive players out of their game by being a physical pest whereas Battier takes offensive players out of their comfort zone through positioning. I thought it was a perfect contrast in style.

I'll miss his defensive presence. I won't miss the many moments when he thought he could dominate offensively the way that a Kobe or Lebron can.

 

he's just a tough bulldog that no one on the opposing team would mess with.

yes, ill miss his presence.

 

Trash a player that appears to be leaving our team when we all loved him while he was here. Wow, who would've thunk it?

We're really coming off as bitter fans with threads like these.

 

They see a player that could possibly fill in for Ariza and Odom if they lose both players as cap casualties.

 

Seriously, this crap is embarrassing. People's opinions on players are decided on what they do relative to the Rockets. These stats don't tell the whole story, they're affected by team defense and pace, but since the OP's eyes have failed him:

http://www.82games.com/0809/ROLRTG3.HTM

 

Number 3 on that list kind of makes me question its validity.

 

Absolutely hilarious.

I can't decide what is more laughable - the fact that you somehow cite steals statistics as indicative of defensive ability or the fact that you just said John Stockton was an elite defender. I realize that since you probably just recently reached puberty, you never had the benefit of watching Stockton play. That's fine, just be aware that you are also committing yourself to the case that Allen Iverson is also an elite defender (due to his gaudy steals statistics) while Mario Elie was below par (due to his lack thereof).

you've proven that you are completely clueless. I'm not wasting my time on this anymore. i have no problem with a claim touting artest's defensive ability - but at least make some attempt at substantiating your opinion intelligently because you are just embarrassing yourself right now.

just stick to the "ROFL gtfo" idiocy next time - its actually a lot less damning of your lack of intelligence than your actual attempts at logical argumentation.

 

The devensive play that stands out in my mind by Ron was against Tayshaun Prince in the closing minutes of a home game I believe.

I don't know if the Ariza deal in a "done deal" but I don't think the Rockets have enough yet. There are too many unkowns regarding big time players.

 

There's a few names that make you say WTF like Wally or House, but they all are bench players on great defensive team and rarely guard good scorers.

 

@thecabbage - I normally don't post, but I'm curious; what's your evidence for John Stockton's defensive liabilities?

From my search on the internet, I can't find one substantiation of that claim. I saw Stockton live several times and on TV a bunch more and I feel your claim of Stockton's 'horrific' defense seems overblown.

Just curious.

 

You want proof? **** John Stockton. There's your proof.

 

Artest is still a very good defender, but Battier is far better.

 

Perceptually, from my own observations, I never found him to be a good defender. Most commentators would also agree that his inclusion on the annual all-defensive teams was some of the most damning evidence towards its flawed methodology.

however, if you personally didn't observationally find stockton to be a poor defender, just as many in this thread intelligently felt regarding artest, that is completely fine. i don't agree with the observation, but it's completely rational and consistent. the greater point here is that steals and blocks statistics aren't sufficiently indicative of defensive ability - such a claim, as was posited, is laughable. most steals are garnered from gambles in the passing lanes and are rarely straight on in man-to-man defense. now steals and blocks statistics certainly don't preclude a player from being a great individual defender (hakeem, payton, pippen, etc.), but they aren't sufficiently probative of such prowess.

 

Fakers are not stupid, they sign artest for a reason, he is overall better than Ariza for a champion team, right now.

 

don't think so.

Artest > Arizza > Battier​