I was reading through the thread thinking of what I was going to add and got to your post and you pretty much summed it all up for me. I have made a decision on my own that I do not believe in the existence of any Gods, however I do no hold it against anyone who does and can understand why it may bring happiness to them to believe. I have never told a religious person that they are stupid for believing or tried to bring them down for doing so. Here lies my problem however... Now I am not saying this is same for all people who believe in God but it is something I have encountered many times living in a country that is one of the least religious on the planet in Australia(I believe there is a higher % of Atheists here than any of the religions). The problem is I have encountered people that because I am atheist have looked down on me and basically treated me as a lesser person in their eyes, the thing that ticks me off in these situations and often it is with born again's is that I have lived my life as best as I can, I have never broken a law, never beaten another human or animal and yet these people can be drug dealers, murderers or rapists and they are apparently 'better' than me because they have found God. Now I know this isn't a belief amongst all people of faith but I point it out because I actually currently have a situation in my personal life reflecting this particular view. My current girlfriend(of over 2 years) had a very strict christian upbringing, her mother is a born again christian and when she gave birth to my girlfriend was living in her mothers house because she had no job and was an alcoholic and drug user. She 'found' God through my girlfriends now step-dad, which is great as it turned her life around. However because I am atheist they refuse to acknowledge me, kicked my girlfriend out of home when they found out(shes a quite girl who wouldn't hurt a fly) and say cruel things to her like 'If you ever marry him we won't be coming to the wedding'. I know this is an extreme case and the majority are not like this but there are certainly many who are. If I didn't come to the same conclusion on God as you did then why should I be frowned upon in a 'free country'.
same problem over here. If I reveal that I am an atheist to my grandpa. I wil be sent out of the house . But my parents are cool with my stance. on a side note.. do you guys think Theists are happier than atheistS? I mean.. Atleast from what I have observed.. I generally get a feeling that theists are happier lot because they have a sink to throw their problems into.. unlike atheists... I am not sure about this. I live in India and the percentage of atheists is very low here. so my observation might be skewed. what do you guys think? I have a couple of friends who are atheists and they share the same opinion.
but my belief in God is based on more than just faith. Could you even begin to pretend to understand what sort of super powerful force it would take to create a universe? or even a life sustaining planet? or to create something as massive as time? certainly you cannot. It's impossible for a human being to imagine it because in order to have the ability to create time and space, one could not be contained by those dimensions. God would have to exist in at least 10 different dimensions to create this universe, which allow him to be everywhere, at every moment. His abilites extend far beyond what any human has ever written about him. but lets say God did show us HIS face in order to prove he exists, I can't imagine what kind of devestating impact that different type of matter would have on this earth or this universe. God has told us as much. Exodus 33:20 20And he said, Thou canst not see my face: for there shall no man see me, and live. or.....there is your theory. That this is all completely random, just a lucky chance in our solar system. Which is also "scientifically" inaccurate.
I love atheists. Some of the most caring people I have met have been atheists. Not believing in God is not some kind of demonized sick condition it is an expression of finite human reasoning, I was once an atheist To me not believing in a loving God is pretty understandable based upon the evidences of suffering, pain and loss when trying to reconcile that with a God who has the power to protect I don't see how anyone can have a very convincing clear and honest view of God without a genuine spiritual experience that justifies that type of faith Just to take God by blind faith is simplistic and can lead to great bias Also to believe wrongly about God has lead to the worst of evils and actions Also to be hypocritical about God has resulted in great destruction to people and relationships So I would say most people are disadvantaged towards believing in a real and rational God At least that is the challenge I consider as one who does believe
not that I agree to your theory.. but just because "god" created the universe/earth/man etc.. does it mean you have to worship him? now why should you do that?
Well, they are would-be inlaws. If it isn't religion, it could be your job, looks, personality, age, race, etc. etc. Look at it this way: They could see you as an opportunity, and try to convert you every chance they get . Either way, good luck with inlaws and congrats on the (over) 2 years with your gf
Neither God or Evolution can be proven to be 100% fact, you could argue the facts for years and no one would ever win....I could end it with the stale mate of if God exists who created God?. However I find it difficult to understand why we should be frowned upon for believing what you don't, why should it matter to you that we may end up in Hell for not believing? Isn't the great thing about being human being the ability to think for yourself and choose your own destiny in life? When my life ends if I was wrong and God really does exist then I would hope that as long as I continue living life as I have that your God could not hold it against me if I do no wrong except not believe, if he did hold it against me then God isnt something I would want to follow even if I knew for fact he existed.
People are threatened when their entire belief system comes into question, (i.e. politics and religion.) Their responses most of the time come from fear and intolerance that there could even exist another opinion. It speaks more about their own self-motivated desires and fears than anything else. If I told my mother I haven't really been going to Church because I am having doubts, it would crush her and the my entire family would think less of me. As it is, I just tell her the truth... I enjoy the teachings of Jesus and think they are a good philosophy for anyone to follow, but I cannot be apart of a religion which seeks to promote itself and its own interests over that of "God's Plan" which they claim is why they do everything.
I don't understand your post. You start off proclaiming that faith is not the only foundation you rest upon, and then list a litany of unprovable or unevidenced assertions that are meritous only under the guise of a "belief" in them. The only take-away I actually got was that you find the idea of "chance" disconcerting - is that accurate? As an aside, note that the anthropic principle somewhat complicates your ideology that there is only belief in "god" or belief in "chance".
that is just pathetic dude. . they might force you to convert to christianity. I have heard of many cases like this .. a friend of mine was forced to convert from hinduism to christianity for the getting married to a christian girl..
btw.. i think you guys might enjoy the following movies 1. Man from Earth - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0756683/ 2. Inherit the wind - http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0053946/
wow. see i hear these things and have ZERO experience with them. i've never seen it. so when i speak from my experience on a topic like this, i'm baffled that someone would feel threatened by me...or the people who make up my church. we have atheists and agnostics who come to our church all the time...they participate in community service we put together...there have been at least 2-3 i can think of who regularly participated in bible study with us. you should never be made to feel as second-class because of what you believe...particularly by people who claim to be followers of Jesus.
I think the fact that you use terms such as "god concept" says enough about why you might annoy people on the Christian persuasion. Also, the fact that Christian's cannot satisfactorily prove, to your or science as you might call it, the exsistence of God, doesn't mean Science Wins, which is how I am taking your encounter in the class to mean. Science, as you are using the term, is simply a method of reasoning. The irony here is that science, as a method, has had many things which satified science at the time, to be latter found to be plain wrong. That, in itself, is what I find funny about people who believe in science and use the term to mean intellectually rigorous. Science is really nothing more than deducive reasoning with an escape clause. Which is, nothing is ever fully proven at all, and if that is the case, the fact that anybody chooses to not believe in god based on science is to me halarious. For if you cannot fully prove something, it opens the air for the idea that you cannot fully disprove something either. Science in a word should have no bearing on your believe in god or not.
I was particularly impacted after I read Don't Sleep, There are Snakes. The author, a christian missionary and linguist spends ~30 years in the amazon with his family trying to convert a tribe of amazonian natives. At the end of the book he reveals that in the course of his study and investigation he lost his faith. His wife divorced him and two of his three children have cut off all contact. Think about that. They interacted daily for 30 years with the most pagan of the pagan, and now refuse to speak to their own father. As Gak mentioned, this is not endemic to faith. But the mindset required (one I've described here a few times) is certainly urged upon followers of the more fundamental sects. I used to be angry about these sorts of stories - now I'm mainly saddened.
i'm saddened by them too...because they seem to be missing the point, entirely. me following jesus isn't about joining a club. in my favorite book, "Velvet Elvis," (which you should totally read if you havent'!! ) he talks about the dangers of "in or out" theology. and how they don't mesh with Jesus.
