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Why Conservatives Allow People to Die w.o. Medicaid in TX

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by glynch, Apr 30, 2014.

  1. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    The article exerpted below claims that conservatives are content with people dying due to lack of insurance not due to finances or even sadism , but to a twisted "moral" conecrn that being poor means a person is immoral and that immorality should not be rewarded. The article cites Charlene Dill of Florida who died mostly likely due to Florida not allowing her to get Medicaid under Obamacare and thus her heart medication.

    Why do you think they are content to let these people suffer and even die for lack of Medicaid?
    ***
    Conservatives constantly say that poor people are lazy. That hardly applied to Charlene Dill, a 32-year-old mother of three in Orlando, Florida. Dill worked at three different jobs to support herself and her children, and pay for a divorce from her estranged husband.
    .... Charlene Dill earned about $11,000
    a year from her three jobs. It doesn't sound like much, but it was actually too much.

    Dill's earnings were well below the federal poverty rate — $23,850 per year for a family of four. But state governments administer Medicaid and set their own eligibility requirements. Dill earned too much to qualify for Florida's Medicaid program, which puts an income cap on eligibility. Dill needed to earn less than $4,535 per year to qualify. TEXAS HAS THE SAME LIMIT !!

    Like millions of Americans before health care reform, Charlene Dill was trapped in the “Red State Donut Hole.” She earned too much to qualify for Medicaid, and to little afford private insurance. So, she lived and worked every day with untreated pulmonary stenosis, because she didn't have health insurance.

    The Supreme Court upheld the Affordable Care Act, but opened the door for states to reject the law’s expansion of Medicaid. In a show of political opportunism and depraved indifference towards the poor, Republican governors and legislatures in 19 states opted out of the Medicaid expansion. GOV PERRY DID THIS ALSO.

    the federal government would pay all the costs of Florida's expansion until 2020 and 90 percent afterwards. SAME IN TEXAS

    ...

    Are Republicans literally killing their constituents by refusing to expand Medicaid? No, but they’re letting them die. It’s a stretch to say that Charlene Dill died because Florida Republicans rejected the Medicaid expansion. Dill died because of an untreated heart condition. Even if Florida had expanded its Medicaid program, she might still have died. But access to health care, treatment, and medications would have given her a fighting chance.

    Now, a new study from Harvard researchers, published in Health Affairs estimates that 7,115 to 17,104 people will die needlessly in states where conservatives lawmakers have rejected the Medicaid expansion.

    So why are conservatives so willing to just let people like Charlene Dill die?

    Rep. Alan Grayson (D-Fla.) said, “One rationale is sadism. Some people actually enjoy the fact that people are denied the care they need to stay healthy and alive.” Grayson’s next statement sounds closer to the truth. “I suppose,” Grayson added, “their ideology instructs them that if you can’t afford health insurance you should’t get it.”

    But what I’ve read from conservatives addressing Dill’s death, the tone isn’t so much sadistic glee as moral concern. Their questions either suggest that “she would have died anyway” or frame it as her own fault.

    ...

    In the conservative worldview defined by George Lakoff in Moral Politics, material wealth indicates moral strength, and lack thereof indicates moral weakness. Poverty equals poor character. That worldview puts Charlene Dill’s death in the context of her poverty, and expands upon Ryan’s and Grayson’s statements.

    Tyler Cohen spelled out one of the principles of conservative health care reform when he wrote: “We need to accept the principle that sometimes poor people will die just because they are poor.”

    Republican policy reflects a belief that wealth indicates moral virtue while poverty indicates moral weakness. The former must be rewarded while the latter must be punished — or at least not encouraged with government programs to alleviate poverty and its effects.

    Conservatives are willing to let poor and struggling people like Charlene Dill die because they believe poverty itself is a moral failure. Thus saving the Charlene Dills of the world is immoral.

    http://www.alternet.org/speakeasy/t...e-charlene-dill-die?paging=off&current_page=1
     
  2. peleincubus

    peleincubus Member

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    Bombs and missiles don't make themselves obviously.
     
  3. Raven

    Raven Member

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    Let's be more specific, this is nothing less than deliberate genocide.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimes_against_humanity
     
  4. mc mark

    mc mark Contributing Member

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    This will continue to be an issue for republican elected officials.

    GOP Lawmakers Confronted By Constituents Demanding To Know Why They Won’t Expand Medicaid

    Americans for Prosperity (AFP), a right-wing group funded by the billionaire Koch Brothers, has been aggressively pressuring states to reject Obamacare’s optional Medicaid expansion. Last fall, the organization launched a massive campaign that has focused mainly on Virginia. But the latest town hall meetings hosted by AFP in the state aren’t exactly going well.

    Over the past week, at several town halls intended to emphasize why Virginia shouldn’t expand Medicaid, GOP lawmakers have been confronted by constituents who are demanding to know why they’re denying health care from an estimated 400,000 low-income residents.

    Last week, at an AFP-sponsored forum in Charlottesville featuring two GOP lawmakers who oppose the expansion, the event was packed with more than a hundred Medicaid supporters. Protesters gathered outside the building with signs encouraging passing cars to honk for Medicaid expansion, and a local outlet noted that the politicians faced a “hostile audience” inside, too.

    Then, on Monday, three Republicans were “deluged with questions” about their refusal to expand Medicaid at an AFP event in Ashburn. The “largely hostile, relentless audience” asked why the lawmakers would want to turn down the billions in federal funding that’s designated for the states expanding their public health programs, particularly since business groups in Virginia support the policy.

    Also on Monday, an anti-expansion Republican faced push back at an AFP town hall in Waynesboro, fending off multiple questions about Virginia’s refusal to extend coverage to additional low-income residents. Attendees pointed out that the benefits of expanding the program outweigh the potential costs.

    Progressive groups in the state are encouraging lawmakers to listen to their constituents, and put public policy before partisan opposition to Obamacare. “Members of the House of Delegates face an important decision,” Anna Scholl, the executive director of ProgressVA, noted in a statement.

    Although Virginia Gov. Terry McAuliffe (D) has continued to push for Medicaid expansion, the policy has been blocked by the GOP-controlled legislature. This isn’t the first time that state lawmakers have sparked controversy for their position in this area. Earlier this month, health care advocates blasted lawmakers for voting to spend $430 million dollars to build new offices for elected officials — the same amount of money that Virginia has missed out on because of its continued refusal to accept the funding for Medicaid expansion.

    Virginia isn’t the only state where this dynamic is unfolding. Continued GOP-led resistance to Medicaid expansion is leaving an estimated 5.8 million impoverished Americans without any access to affordable health care whatsoever. Nonetheless, AFP has poured millions into anti-Obamacare advertising campaigns, and has specifically attempted to block Medicaid expansion in at least six states. Thanks to those well-funded misinformation campaigns about health care reform, many uninsured Americans in the poorest states don’t understand what their new options are under Obamacare.
     
  5. mc mark

    mc mark Contributing Member

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    Man! Once republicans start to lose seniors look out!

    Republican Governor Scott Went Looking For Obamacare Horror Stories But Found Satisfied Seniors

    Florida Gov. Rick Scott (R) went to a senior center on Tuesday to warn of the dangers of Obamacare and hear horror stories about the law. But instead Scott found almost all the seniors he talked to were satisfied with the new law.

    There were 20 seniors who were assembled at a roundtable at the Volen Center in Boca Raton for Scott's visit, according to The Florida Sun Sentinel. But the seniors expressed satisfaction with their health care and even praised Obamacare.

    Harvey Eisen, 92, said he was "completely satisfied" with Obamacare, according to the Sun Sentinel. Eisen also cast doubt about Scott's claim about cuts to Medicare that come through Obamacare. But that wouldn't be the end of the world even if there were, Eisen said.
     
  6. CometsWin

    CometsWin Breaker Breaker One Nine

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    They deserve the freedom to die. Freeeeeeedumb!
     
  7. Deckard

    Deckard Blade Runner
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    What glynch posted is true, and it is an abomination. Every American living in the states deliberately treating their citizens this way should be ashamed. Ashamed that they elected those responsible. That includes the state I am ordinarily proud of, Texas, but I am not proud of this.
     
  8. glynch

    glynch Contributing Member

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    The GOP/Libertarian position on this is literally a killer.

    Wendy Davis says she will save these needless deaths.
     
  9. JuanValdez

    JuanValdez Contributing Member

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    I think this is close to true, but uncomfortable with slinging around the word 'moral' like that. I think the conservative viewpoint on it is built heavily around capitalist ideals of rewarding high performers and punishing low performers. In the case of Dill, she may have worked hard, but she didn't work smart. She didn't get the education or training she needed to get a better job, or maybe she didn't seek the right kind of work, or didn't go after it hard enough. She had a character failing of some kind (you can call it a 'moral' failing if you are liberal with definitions) that she should have overcome. She should have (and implicitly, could have) pulled herself up by her own bootstraps. And while they may have nothing against Dill in particular, who at least was trying, they're scared to death to create an environment that doesn't have this very strong incentive for everyone to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. A few thousand (or even hundreds of thousands) early deaths is worth it to perpetuate a system in which millions of others will achieve more because they have to for their own preservation.

    I don't agree, but I think that's the argument that has the most merit, at least.
     
  10. FTW Rockets FTW

    FTW Rockets FTW Contributing Member

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    They need to learn from Obama and other liberals.
     
  11. Phillyrocket

    Phillyrocket Member

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    Of course Seniors are happy the PPACA is closing the hated doughnut hole that Bush included as part of the Medicare Part D legislation. Medicare providers are receiving less annual increases in reimbursements and Part C plans have reduced subsidies but that isn't effecting Grandma and Grandpa who are now elated that their out of pocket costs for drugs are down significantly.

    Maybe if Rick Scott actually read the legislation before he went to the Senior Center.....nah
     

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