Why Are Minorities "Proud" of their Heritage and does that Pride Cause Problems?

No comment on the topic just that Morgan Freeman is awesome.

 

I think that's the point of minority pride. It's that it isn't using it as a crutch but celebrating the triumphs.

 

You didn't just bring up race. You brought up why black and brown people are proud of their heritage. This is exactly what you said.

I personally believe that some of the aspects of the "proud culture" of Blacks, Hispanics, Indians or anything else actually helps perpetuation or racism.

If you think Greeks or Italians or Irish aren't every bit as proud of their heritage then it sounds like you haven't gotten around a whole lot in this country. It sounds like you're making the argument that if blacks and hispanics would just try to fit in more, assimilate more, be more like "everyone else" then there would be less racism. It's a bull**** argument.

 

The problem is associating yourself with someone else's triumph because they share your skin color.

 

That isn't what it's doing. It's celebrating triumphs against odds and obstacles that people of the same skin color face specifically because of that skin color. If you have a problem with that, then work to eliminate those obstacles and odds.

 

Every time he talks about his background, he talks about the craziness of being from a Kenyan father and a white mother from Kansas and being raised by his white grandparents. But regardless - you're contradicting your original point of which people didn't talk about race at all. Now you just wish he would talk about one race instead of another. Why?

 

You say you are versed with the troubles of black Americans and are a self avowed history buff, but i haven't seen any indicator that you are.

Any American can claim they're versed in American history and ethic sub histories...that's what black history month is for amirite? Except BHM taught in schools only reveal less than a fifth of the perpetual struggles blacks have gone through and the path they've set and cleared for other minorities. Want to know where black pride became popularized? Look towards the Harlem renaissance and the subtexts that led up to it.

I'm only skeptical as to your level of true interest on the subject matter, and whether it deserves true discourse. Any real history buff knows there's more than just the accounts of the victor.

 

I like how this thread is now strictly about black people

How typical

 

Unless you're talking about first generation immigrants these may be misnomers, if not then they will be two or three generations down the road; it will be filtered out of them by breeding, education, grammar and diction.

What's more, black Americans who came here pre-emancipation don't have the benefit of a defined genealogy or cultural heritage; partly because they came from a non-bureaucratic, pre-literate civilization without any written records or political boundaries, but also because like any other livestock they were bought, sold and distributed individually at each generation.

Ironically enough that lack of ancestral clarity compels them to create their own language, naming systems and factually dubious historical and religious narratives, and take much more personal ownership of thereof.

 

I think if you walk around the North East, you'll see a lot of reminders of the country's European roots (statues, street names, etc.). Given European Americans are the majority of this country, it's also the biggest influence on the US culture. So there's no need to really pump it up that much.

On the other hand, if you go around the South, you might get a lot of reminder of the "Southern Heritage".




As far as being a minority, despite growing up in the U.S., I get a lot of "Which part of Asia/China are you from?", "Say some thing in Chinese..", it's kind of hard not to be reminded of your heritage is different at that point...

I think the most important thing though is that being proud of one's heritage does not pre-clude you from being proud of being an American. Being the biggest melting pot of the world (not just race but religion, ethnicity, and etc.) is what makes this country great, and is the real heritage of this country (USA).

The fact that this country will accept you for who you are, what you do and a lot of times embraces your uniqueness is why the smartest and brightest from the world would want to come here and try to make a life here. That's what we should be proud of, the acceptance of the differences.

 

No, it's because of the common culture, history, and pride. That's what it is. Sure, I'm an American citizen and as has been observed by others, a borderline-insane nationalist. But I'm also Japanese. There's really nothing more to it.

 

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I haven't read through this entire thread, but at first glance I find it interesting that (1) a white person is advising minorities how to view our own heritage, (2) perhaps not surprisingly, the discussion is breaking down the lines of GOP/conservatives advising minorities and not understanding and accepting why minorities view our heritage the way we do, while Democrats/progressives support minorities identifying with our heritages.

I wonder why minorities tend to associate more with the Democrat party?

btw, if you look back in history at when some white minorities (eg Irish Americans) immigrated to the US and were discriminated against (employment, housing, etc) you would see a lot more self identification (eg "we're Irish"). I am not a social scientist but I suspect the discrimination tends to reinforce identification with their heritage. So I would also suspect that simply "playing down on our heritage" will result in reducing discrimination since I suspect the causal factor would be in the wrong order.

 

I think we all know the answer to this

 

Let me be clear, I think we can discuss racial issues as white guys and have a dialogue about it. What we can't do is know what it feels like to be a minority in all aspects of life, and to be discriminated against because of our race. It's great that you get to travel around and experience being a minority for a couple days at a time, but at the end of the day you get to fly back home and enjoy your status as a majority race. Your "experiences" don't amount to a lifetime of being looked over, discriminated against, and feeling the injustices of not being given a fair shot.

At the end of the day, people form cultures around people they are akin to. This doesn't have to break down among racial lines, but often times it does because of geographical factors. Frankly, if you don't see Southern culture around the South, you're just not looking. Why do you think there was a big fuss to keep the Confederate Flag up at the capital in South Carolina? Southern white people love Texan pride, we have "southern hospitality" etc. I really don't see a meaningful difference between that and a culture that's based around certain shared experiences.

I find it troubling when people ignore racism that still exists. I agree that in some instances, the type of otherization you're referring to can be harmful. But in the same way we need to revisit the Holocaust through museums and history books, we also need to celebrate the achievement of overcoming the institutional racism that did and does exist.

I really, really think that your tone and arguments spell out a lack of understanding and empathy for minority races. I know you think that you're being criticized because you're a white guy, but that's not it (I'm a white guy too), but it's because it's pretty clear you posted this without any intention of having your mind changed. Open your eyes to how other people live their lives every single day of their existence.

It is commendable that you came up through poverty (and I really mean that), but realize most African-Americans are only one or two generations removed from the Jim Crow era. You of all people should know how difficult it is to come up through poverty and live the American dream. Now imagine your life experience without being given the benefit of the doubt for anything. Most minorities are striving to do what you've done, but face the increased challenges of a justice system that doesn't give them the benefit of the doubt, employers preferencing others over them, and a society that has pockets of people who will still go out of their way to make life more difficult. Consider this, and then re-evaluate your thoughts on this issue.

 

This.

The mistake is looking at the country as truly a melting pot where everything mixes up to a Velveeta like texture. The US has always been pluralistic and rather than a fondue the culture is more like chunky salsa.

One problem with the view that having pride in one's heritage causes problems comes back to though to then should you just completely subsume your heritage to a dominant culture? The problem with this argument is that the majority tend not to look at themselves as an interest group as opposed to minorities. For example consider arguments that Christians make regarding banning displays of things like the Ten Commandments on public grounds. A common refrain is that this is an attack on religion. If that were the case why weren't Christians upset that Muslims, Hindus and Buddhist and etc.. couldn't display their religious symbols on public grounds?

To get back to the question of race a lot of what is considered American culture is tied up with the idea of a white Western European Christian culture so from that majority standpoint someone taking pride in a minority racial or ethnic heritage is seen as a problem while ignoring that the fact that the majority culture is also racially and ethnically based. This ignores the fact that the experience of non-whites is also an intrinsic part of the American history and culture.