What has Lebron exhibited that is so amazing? 25, 7, and 7 or whatever his stats are? Yeah, those are crazy, but what about a sub .500 record against the other top 5 teams in the NBA? Or 0-2 against Kobe and the Lakers? Even if the Cavs get to the Finals, they are not even going to sniff the title...just like when they got swept a couple years ago. Lebron has a hype machine like nobody else ever, but he has zero impressive playoff wins at this point, and even during the regular seasons the Cavs do not regularly beat good teams. He feasts on the weak Eastern conference. That said, Lebron is probably the 2nd best player in the NBA today, after Kobe, and it's not his fault the East is crap, but to be calling him the best SF of all-time? I don't think so.
You mean to tell me Bird couldn't guard Andersen Verajao, Luis Scola, Battier, Artest, Trevor Ariza, Glen Davis, Kenyon Martin, Dirk Nowitski, Josh Howard, Maurice Evans...all in the playoffs right now? Bird wasn't the defensive sieve that everybody makes him out to be, he averaged 10 rebounds for his career and averaged 1.7 steals. He's no worse then Dirk Nowitzki as a defensive player, who everyone loves to compare him to. And so what if Bird had a great supporting cast. Go blame Red Auerbach for building a team around Bird. Or blame Danny Ferry for getting Lebron only Mo Williams all these years. Larry Bird would have been great in a crappy team, maybe with less stats and awards, but he's a one of kind no matter what team he would have been on.
Oh, and get this, Bird was a better passer than Lebron is. Bird didn't handle the ball nearly as much as Lebron and if he had he would have averaged double digit assists or close to it.
That leads me to ask you how you define "better player" then? What has he done in only 6 years that would have you put him as the best to ever play his position in the history of the NBA?
While I understand the potential and the present day basketball brilliance of one LeBron Raymone James. I think mentioning him as one or two alltime is just lazy. Scottie Pippen= that probably says more about the demographic of the posters and popularity of the Bulls of the 90's. That being said I agree with Bird topping the list of all-time best threes and I'm not surprised Elvin Hayes got overlooked........................ How is Dominique Wilkins and Bernard King not even mentioned?
He posted monster numbers in the ABA ... true. Please notice that he was in his prime when he came to the NBA as a 25-26 year old. Look at his stats immediately following his arrival into the NBA. His numbers have a definite drop-off. He was still putting up great numbers, but he was not the god-mode player he was in the ABA. Was this due to better overall talent in the NBA? I can't use a player's ABA stats when I consider whether or not he is the greatest player at his position. If I use his NBA numbers alone - he was a very good player. A great player. He's not quite on the level of a Bird, however. Bird had the numbers plus one thing that even LeBron is not noted for : If I wanted one person to rip your heart out and take your will to win away from you with one shot, or hit the game-winning shot, I want the following one of the following 3 : MJ, Bird, or Reggie Miller. And yes, I watched Dr. J play in the NBA.
Elvin Hayes was a PF. Dominique was a hell of an offensive player, but he was all about scoring and even with his dunks, his FG% wasn't all that impressive. I'd still take pretty much ever player on the list over him (noting that I can't really translate Baylor's numbers that well to the modern era). Bernard King was a great scorer, but he didn't do it long enough and he really is a notch or two below the other players in this thread.
In the ABA, Dr J was a one man team. In the NBA, he actually had teammates who could score and thus did not have to carry the whole load. And then you must have a very poor memory. Dr J was the was dominant player in the NBA, the minute he started playing in the NBA. If when determining the GOAT SF you compared the player against his peers, Dr J wins by a mile. Nobody could do what he did when he did it. Not even close.
Bird solidly right now. (But one has to acknowledge how good of teammates he had, in fact the 1st title MVP of those Celts teams was Cornbread Maxwell, who most people barely remember, which gives you an idea of the talent around Bird throughout his career and definetly the ring years) I give it 50/50 Lebron catches him. This isn't as ridiculous as comparing Kobe to Jordan though. I have seen Dr. J play, Pippen and Hill. In all honestly I think Lebron is harder to contain and puts a bigger stamp on the game than any of them. I think he largely takes the best attributes of all of them (Pippen's handle and defense, Dr. J's finishing/physicality, Hill's court awareness/leadership) and adds some 30lbs+ of muscle. So I do think Lebron now is better than they were, as long as he stays relatively healthy the only SF who might stay ahead is Bird.
Mo Malone and Dr. J were my favorite players in the whole league in the late 70s/80s, and I hated the Celts/Bird. That said, Dr. J had outstanding Phily teammates as well, but kept getting beat by other teams (e.g., Walton's Blazers, Bird's Celts, Magic's Lakers). In fact Dr. J could get a ring until he was the #2 guy (and you could make a case as #3 offensive option after Mo and Toney). I never would have said it then, but I would def. take Bird over Dr. J to build a championship team around. Dr. J was more spectacular, but Larry Bird was a better basketball player.
what? Go check laker record and cavs record against tough team Also having the best home court only losing once to the laker is pretty amazing. He took the cavs to the final by himself, even kobe today can't do that. Last year, he took boston to game 7 even kobe can't do that so tell me...who's better than who?
