Which Christian denomination?

I'm not sure I agree with that. At a minimum, I'd posit that the idea of "eternity with the father" is, in itself, subjective.

I'm pretty sure we've had this type of conversation before here.

 

Cool beans. I don't like to do this type of conversation on the internet because it has no benefit, so I'll drop it.

 

I dunno about these sorts of topics being totally without benefit - I think I have learned a lot in these sorts of conversations. Certainly, I get more constructive thought out of this sort of debate than a democrat vs republican wank fest. That being said, I've gotten fairly burned out on most of these topics - to a certain extent they're depressing for me.

Anyhow, there are a lot of threads that touch on the above "problem". Most of them are actually quite interesting.

 

is unitarian universalism a "denomination"? just wondering, because i've heard it mentioned in the same breath as other christian sects, although they are more open to other "paths" and spiritual truths.

 

They are almost always associated with Christianity just because that is the tradition out of which they most sprang. But you are right, they are much more "other" than...uh...other denominations. I see a lot of redirected Taoism in their core belief structure. The problem is that they, too, have such a wide variance amongst churches. Some are more Christian-centered, others more "all spirituality is good and important and there may or may not be a God", etc..

 

I would respond but your e-penis is too small for me to take you seriously.


Forgive my gratuitous bling from obstructing your view.

 

How could you have (supposedly) been a Catholic and so woefully ignorant of your own religion?

 

There's always the Church of the Sub Genius .

 

Sorry, my apologies. I confused you with someone else who claimed to be a Catholic earlier.

As a non-Catholic, your questions are valid. Rimbaud already spoke to your issues very eloquently.

Rituals are a necessary by-product of any organization. Churches included. Nearly all of the rituals have origins within the dogma.

The most important part of the catholic mass is just a re-enactment of the last supper.

 

After his resurrection Jesus told the apostles, "‘As the Father has sent me, even so I send you.’ And when he had said this, he breathed on them, and said to them, ‘Receive the Holy Spirit. If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained’" (John 20:21–23).

 

I suggest going here for "Catholic" answers.

http://www.catholic.com/

You may not agree with the answer, but they tend to explain the process.

 

True. Don't be surprised if you've forgotten about it by the time twhy gets back to you!

 

Beware the Gospel of Mental Assent --

Matthew 7:21 -- "Not everyone who says to me, 'Lord, Lord,' will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven."

Mark 4:16-17 -- "Others, like seed sown on rocky places, hear the word and at once receive it with joy. But since they have no root, they last only a short time. When trouble or persecution comes because of the word, they quickly fall away."

James 1:22-26 -- "But be doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves. For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror; for he observes himself, goes away, and immediately forgets what kind of man he was. But he who looks into the perfect law of liberty and continues in it, and is not a forgetful hearer but a doer of the work, this one will be blessed in what he does.
If anyone among you thinks he is religious, and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this one’s religion is useless.

James 2:18-24 "But someone will say, "You have faith; I have deeds."
Show me your faith without deeds, and I will show you my faith by what I do. You believe that there is one God. Good! Even the demons believe that—and shudder.
You foolish man, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless?Was not our ancestor Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. And the scripture was fulfilled that says, "Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness,"[e] and he was called God's friend. You see that a person is justified by what he does and not by faith alone.




I am disappointed that the Church in America has diminished the Gospel down to a point where the goal is merely to get as many people as possible to say the magic words at an altar call... though I don't think mental assent, in and of itself is a bad thing. I just don't think it's the END that we're seeking when we say we're seeking the Kingdom of God that Jesus talked about....when he insisted it was right here, right now and within us as well. Very Zen-like, actually.

I do believe in an eternity spent with God and one spent without Him. I have no idea what that actually looks like, and I don't care. It's hard enough to seek to follow Jesus on a day to day...week to week...and year to year basis IN THIS LIFE. I'm concerned most with seeing the Kingdom right here and right now. That looks like 1,000,000 other things other than streets paved with gold and harp-strumming cherubs on clouds. It looks more like people made whole and good news for the poor.

Jesus spends most of his time talking about how we are to relate to one another here...I don't think it's as simple as mental assent.

p.s. i don't have all the answers, only my own.... and i've been trying to stay away from these discussions entirely....this is just a particular topic i'm very interested in as i work out my own faith

 

While I agree with 90% of your post, there are plenty of non-Catholic pre-Nicene churches that still exist, in Iran, Palestine, Turkey, Egypt, and India, among others that I'm sure I'm forgetting. Do they have enough influence to really color the Christian religion as a whole? No. But they do exist and offer a non-Catholic perspective that goes back 1800 years or so.

 

I know it has become cliche to talk about how cool MadMax is and how he is missed in his time away from the board but, seriously, you make me feel bad about myself. I have told Jeff the same thing for similar and different reasons. It is just an unusual combination of thoughtful, compassionate, and overall "goodness" and willingness that only underscores how ridiculously lacking I am and how contradictory my positions are (I am empathetic and compassionate and a socialist but I am also a misanthrope?). Sure, my me-ness makes me me and I like me and can never be nayone but me and I am cool but people like you make me wonder what it would be like to be genuinely good and thoughtful and caring. You know, ache for what I am missing.

I liken it to when one of my grandfathers died. Everyone loved him but I never really knew him due to weird family dynamics that had nothing to do with me. So in a lot of ways his death disturbed and saddened me more than the grandfather that I did love because of the lack of understanding and the wonder at what I had missed.