When did *I* become the "confused" one?

While I agree.

I think you guys are being kind of naive.

I'd like to live in the country you're imagining, though.

 

Perhaps I am naive but what makes this country great is that we can work to make it better.

 

i'll see your "not-a-choice" and raise you a "who-the-****-cares-if-it-were?" you don't like gay sex, don't have it. you don't like seeing dudes kissing, don't watch gay p*rn, or just look the other way.

you don't like seeing two girls making out...then you're the one that's acting "unnatural."

 

why do you care whether Gay men and women can marry? how does the law affect you one way or another, unless you're contemplating marrying a member of the same sex?

 

discrimination against one group can open the door to discrimination against another, and so on.

so it is in your best interest to see that everyone has equal rights and treatment under the law.

 

agreed.

 

Then why do you support the 2000 Florida result?

 

i don't follow.

 

I voted the first option, although I think "genetic" is the wrong term and "biological" is probably more appropriate.

The actions themselves are choices. The choices are primarily made based on preferences. The preferences are determined primarily by your biology.

So it's mostly about semantics.

And I believe that applies to homosexuals, bisexuals and transgender folks. In fact, it applies to a ton of other unrelated human behaviors as well. That's how humans work.

 

Damn iPhone keyboard. Ya got me.

I meant "homophobes".

 

I think you give Congressmen a bit more credit than I do. I don't think that people in Congress who are opposed to equal rights for gays because they think it's a choice. They're opposed because they think the behavior is abhorrent. If you were to discover a "gay gene", I don't honestly don't believe their view would change all that much, if at all. I don't think the mentality of our nation has evolved enough yet to truly respect homosexuals as equals. And that is truly sad.

I sincerely hope that I'm wrong.

 

I agree with all that. Though women will have to choose between daily comfort of "topfreedom" or empowerment with boob seduction. And men will have to give up having things like wet t-shirt contests and Mardi Gras being anything meaningful. With no breast taboos and National Geographic tribesmen style toplessness, Girls Gone Wild would be the stupidest thing ever (It already is, just saying).

I agree people should sex discreetly as possible with whomever, just keep it safe and fun. I ALSO think people should just get the mate they're most compatible with at their level. No moving up or down the scale. No 2's trying to get 9's. No fat people trying to get skinny people. Its the most fairest way of all. You get what you're supposed to get. Because even a few people trying to get mates out of their league makes things unbalanced for everyone else. But that also will NEVER happen.

- - - -

On GLB, I would think "biological" without being purely genetic, for lack of a better term. I think traumatic events like child molestation, especially same sex molestation, can alter someone's gender "preference" later on. Or maybe its genetic AND a little of everything else. Like prison sex.

 

you are correct. When I randomly feel like punching someone in the face, it is technically "biological" since certain areas of my brain emit certain chemicals to make me feel that way, that is understood. But something that is "genetically predetermined" goes farther than that. It means that the person was "born into it". Considering the lack of scientific evidence, I don't believe that's the case. And for you smartasses out there ( ) asking for scientific evidence for "hetero attraction being genetic", there isn't a need for evidence because hetero preference is the NORM, well over 90% of all human beings are hetero, making the homosexual preference one that is NOT NORMAL. There I said it, it isn't normal. Not that there is anything wrong with that. To each his own. But I love it how people try to make the point that "hey! It's normal! everyone admit that it is normal and natural!". No, buddy, it isn't. When you're expressing something in disagreement with the majority of your species, you are not natural.

Then we get into the whole thing with illegal sexual behavior such as pedophilia, necrophilia, zoophilia etc... All of those behaviors deviate from the norm just like homosexuality, but they are universally frowned upon while homosexuality is celebrated and has movements for "rights" that dare to compare themselves to the civil rights movement. How does that make sense? Yes, I understand that most pedophiliac cases involve non-consensual interactions, which is definitely illegal. But what about those mormons who are constantly raided and crucified for consensual sexual relations with underage individuals? That's a consensual relationship, just like a homosexual one would be. And yet one is considered the dirtiest form of disgusting sexual deviance, and the other is celebrated and its members take pride in it, and try to further its cause and gain "rights" such as marriage. Why don't those mormons (notice I'm not lumping all "mormons" into this, I'm specifically referring to the ones that got busted in Texas) go out and start a pedo movement? the right to be married to underage individuals? how would we react to that?

I'm not a crazy right winger by any means. In fact there is nothing I dislike more than the hatred and intolerance displayed by those "neo-conservatives". My feeling toward those with homosexual preference is complete indifference. I don't care about your sexual orientation, I will treat you exactly the same no matter what you like to ****. There is nothing wrong with choosing to be gay.

The problem I have is when people make it DEFINE who they are. For example, as a member of the U.S military, why in god's name do you feel the need to "come out" and express what your sexual orientation is in front of people you sleep and interact with on a daily basis? I don't think it's appropriate to even talk about sex in the military. You're supposed to be shooting the enemy, not a soap opera. You don't see military people expressing their desire for P%ssy during the battle.

I can keep incoherently rambling about this for days, but here's where all of this leads me: If you're gay, great! I don't need to know about it. If your straight, also great, but I also don't need to know about it unless you're a female and you're interested in having a certain part of my body inside of you. There's no place appropriate for expressing one's sexual preference (exceptions exist, and include your doctor's office, a sex therapy session, a dating site, etc...). Your sexuality is a private matter. No one needs to know about it. And it shouldn't change who you are. it shouldn't DEFINE who you are. I don't let my love for big boobies define my existence. I don't ask for my right to be proudly recognized as a boobies-lover. why don't you do the same?

 

I was in no way making a statement regarding legitimacy. I have said it on here many times before - sex is just sex, there is no right or wrong in that regard provided it's two consenting adults.

My comment was really directed at the "activities" associated, i.e., a transgender person has to choose to do something about the situation they feel they are in. A gay person is just gay, and does not need to make a decision of sorts to legitimize it. (Edit: Legitimize is a bad word - I was not trying to imply that transgender folks are illegitimate sans surgery)

By and large, my experience with bi folks is that they're just sexually curious folks not tied down by the rigor of "this is my sexual preference". Kinda liberating, I'd argue, although it's not my cup of tea. The point is that I think most of the bi folks I know are not trying to establish a sexual identity per say as bi.

My two cents.

 

If the right to marriage is constitutional based on the right to privacy I don't see how sexual orientation should have any bearing on that, whether it is biological or not. The right to privacy isn't one that is based on biological imperitive.

 

so since there is no proof of either/or, it is 100% or?

my parents have the trifecta. i came out at 20. my sister came out last year at 34. due to my sister coming out, my brother came out to me last year at 20. we've rarely discussed "teh ghey" because it really is a non-issue and isn't that important of a fact in our lives. however, all three of us agree that we did not choose.

choice (for us anyway) was not an option, but the whole genetics/evironment argument is well (for me and not the other two) unsettled. i really don't know and really don't give a damn. for me it's inconsequential.

 

To answer the OP, you became the confused one at birth. It was predetermined by genetics, and you have no control/blame in the deal. Now that we know it's not your fault, we're alright with you... mostly.