What will it take to make you seriously consider an EV?

How about now?

 

Yup. def tanking.

Guess we all have to buy Teslas now. Oh well.

 

I've been waiting for him to get his hands on one of these. I'll watch it later, but thanks for posting it. Unfortunately, it's still way more than I want to spend on an electric car, but it's going in the right direction, I guess. We'll see what Doug says.

 

Lmao are you throwing your alt right sarcasm in here

 

Yes yes. Everything is systemic racism.

 

Also when you posted LCID tanked, it was down 5%....
How come you didn't post TSLA tanked....when it's down -6.5% today?

 

When I posted LCID tanked it was down -20% at the time that day as it was being investigated by the SEC for fraud charges, it bounced back by the end of that day ending at -5%, which you pointed out to me cheerfully. It is now back down -20%.

 

Going in the right direction? You are referring to the Lucid Air Dream edition that is being reviewed correct? The $170k Lucid Air Dream edition. Which is more expensive than when the Model S first came out 8 years ago, that right direction. Not the $40k Model 3, no, the Lucid Air Dream edition is the one going in the right direction. Correct?

 

I don't want a car that looks like a Fisher Price toy on the interior. If that's what you want, more power to you. I know you get your panties in a wad when something non-Tesla is mentioned, but again... I don't want "ooh look at the great tech" with a mundane interior, questionable quality, at a high price. By moving in the right direction, I mean the styling of the car and its interior is almost up to the quality of an Acura (lol) now at around 2x the price... but in terms of EVs, yeah, that's moving in the right direction. Maybe in another 5 years or so, I won't actually feel like I stepped back into the 80's with an iPad when I get into one. lol.

 

In what world is 2x the price of an Acura $170k?

And if you were referring to styling for moving in the right direction, that’s your personal taste, so more power to you. Because just to be clear, as far as price goes these Lucids are moving anything but the right direction.

 

I like how you focus on the most expensive variant. What about the $80k variant? In what world would you be impartial in your argument? Not this one.

Of course it's my personal taste. I'm the one buying the car. If "minimalist" interiors is what you go for, more power to you, like I said.

And "just to be clear" : I've stated many times in this thread the pricing of the Lucid is beyond anything the average person would buy -- even their lowest-priced variant at around $80k. I'm hoping this, like Tesla's Roadster and Model S were, is their halo car. But then I'm worried if/when they decide to make a $30k-$50k car, we'll be back to sitting in a cave with an iPad. I'm hoping that changes in 5-10 years.

The Porsche Taycan and the upcoming Cadillac Lyriq have nice interiors, but the Taycan isn't for the average buyer and the Lyriq... well, I'm going to to have to see it beta tested by the public before I jump on a GM product that quickly. lol.

See? Some of us don't have biases towards these cars like we're defending the honor of a wife or kid.

 

You were referring to the Doug Demuro review, which is of the Lucid Air Dream edition, which is $170k. Not the $80k entry level version. Let’s not start moving the goal post here.

As for the rest, my only gripe is referring to “moving in the right direction” when it comes to Lucid’s price, which it sounds like we agree. Whether they can come down in price like Tesla, that requires scale, which no startup US automaker has accomplished without going bankrupt in the last 70 years, save for one - Tesla. So good luck to Lucid, their buggy software (read user reviews), and fraudulent projections. But I wouldn’t hold my breathe.

fwiw I have never said anything bad about the Taycan, it’s a great first shot at an EV by Porsche. I have also stated many times that I think Volkswagen (parent of Porsche) has a good chance of remaining competitive in the future EV world.

I have been studying this industry like the back of my hand for the last 10 years, what to you must seem like Tesla fanboyism from your ad hominem is simply just an acknowledgment of the truth, the reason why it is the most valuable automaker today and most valuable company period in the not too distant future. They make, by far, the best EVs. Gm and Ford offerings are woefully uncompetitive. Lucid is too expensive and likely will fail before they scale. Rivian has been around for as long as Tesla and never made a product. The Model Y will be the best selling vehicle period, EV or otherwise, sometime in 2022-2023. (title currently held by the Camry, ~1m units a year) So whether they look like Fisher Price to you or not is totally cool, because the world can’t get enough of them. (quite literally right now, 8 month backlog)

 

Can you tell me what the difference in styling is between the $170k and the $80k Lucid Airs are? Follow directions and you'll get a good grade and at the same time understand there were no goalposts moved. You're the one that's frothing at the mouth coming up with your own arguments. The majority of differences between the Lucid Air models revolve around the tech and some drivetrain. The styling, for the most part, is the same. For me, there is no value in any of the models, tbh, but for interior styling? Yeah, any of them are a step forward since they're basically all the same.

I read reviews about all manufacturers. I also know that all these electric cars have their defenders and detractors. Funny story from a few days ago : The barber I go to has a lot of clients who are C-suite level or upper management types and roll some nice wheels. The last story she told me about a Tesla was from a client from about 3 years ago who bought a Tesla and decided to take 3 of his buddies golfing from the DFW area to somewhere in Oklahoma just to show off the Tesla. Apparently the weight of the people and golf clubs drastically cut their mileage, so he decided to find some place to charge up before they got there as a precaution. Whatever place he went to, the charger was broken, so he went somewhere else that apparently charged too slowly, so they all decided to come back home rather than risk being stranded. Somewhere at about half their journey back, they got nervous again and decided to find a charger which again was charging slowly. His buddies gave up got rides home since they were only about 30-40 miles from their destination. He said it was kind of embarrassing since he wanted to show off his new Tesla. Again, this was 3 or 4 years ago, so I'm sure the charging network is better. It doesn't make me think any less of Tesla because well... that's where we are in the tech today (or 3-4 years ago).

As for buggy vehicles and questionable quality, none of these manufacturers have escaped that and nor will they. It's automotive tradition. Outside of maybe Toyota/Lexus. lol. That's why I'm not going to jump on the Lyriq or Hyundai's GV60 even though both of those vehicles are closer to what I think an EV should offer (minus questionable mileage). There're just too many things about all these vehicles that's probably going to make me wait another 5+ years before buying one, unless somebody makes some jumps quickly.

And much of that is irrelevant to me. I don't care about Tesla's market cap or technology except in terms of value and bang-for-the-buck. Apple is the largest company in the world, but I don't own an iPhone... because my Android phone does everything I need it to do. But wait... it's the largest company in the world by market cap, so maybe I should buy an iPhone? Huh? And I've been a tech nerd forever (although not as much anymore since I think it's a waste of time for the most part). Simply because something is the best at what they do doesn't mean they do what I want from them. In the end, nope... not enough. I mean it's great these things have 0-60 times that are 3 seconds or below, but.... so what? What am I doing? Drag racing on the freeway? I just need enough punch to not get run over on a merge. I need rock-solid reliability for the first 100-150k of ownership. I need at least around a 400 mile range on a charge, but 500-600 would really make me happy. I need to be able to get into the car and not feel like I've dropped a few classes in quality. I don't want to be looking at the center stack for information I need as I drive -- it should be there on the dash, so I can glance down quickly and look back up. I don't want to have every control embedded into a tablet. Touch screens are a horrific UI for many things while driving (like AC controls, some radio controls, etc.).

We're still in this transition's infancy and I'm not about to say just because "Company A" is the best at what they do, I will buy that. Well, no, because for what they do, they're not quite what I'm looking for and I'm not about to jump on that bandwagon just so I can say "lookit me, I have an electric car" even though I really want to have an electric car. Hell, any alternative to the archaic ICE stuff we drive now would be awesome as long as it doesn't feel like I'm taking a step back. And in every case that's out there right now, whether it's quality, range, price, styling, etc. I feel like I'm losing something(s) big for what I'm getting and what I'm getting ain't enough to justify what I'm losing. So when people scream "it's the best tech!" and "it's the future!" -- that means nothing to me because I'm not paying for the future today. Let me know when the future really gets here.

And lastly, I don't care what the rest of the world is doing. What am I? A 10 year old? Cars like the Ford F-150 and Corolla have been the biggest sellers in the US and I really don't want either of them, either. Yes, that's right, I'm already not giving a damn what everybody else is buying. There's a lot of things in this world other people do that I don't. So if the rest of the world wants to buy a Tesla, why should I care? I'll look into and judge them like I'm doing every other manufacturer. I'm just sharing why I don't want any of these vehicles at the moment. Tesla, Ford, GM, Lucid, whatever... none of them. But I'm keeping up with the progress.

Anywho, now you've made me not watch the Demuro video tonight typing all this crap up. Guess I'll do it later today. Really surprised he gave the Lucid and Taycan a 7 on styling. I think the Taycan is about the only electric car that makes me say "nice" when I look at it -- probably because I love the new Panamera design. I don't think the Lucid touches it in that regard.

 

I truly don't understand what chubby wants....because something is popular (without any decent competition so far)....means it's the only product people should buy ..ever? You think the entire global auto industry will just die and everyone will only have the option to buy a Tesla?

Don't we want competition? Don't we want other options? What a boring world if everyone just drove the same car...

Chubby is so fixated on this 170K model but he forgets the rich people bought Tesla a few years back because it was a status symbol. They didn't give 2 sh!ts about EV. They wanted to show off a new toy to their friends. The same thing will happen with LCID.

Of course chubby is not a car person...he is just another tech nerd. His passionate dk sucking is 100% equivalent to android vs iphone fanbois or homers in the GARM.

 

And this is why you need to wait and chill. This is far from over.

 

I’m cool with this 100%. Would just say that when I mentioned highest valued company, its sales etc, just meant validation by the market, by the world. But you are right, that has nothing to do with what your personal opinion should be, nor did I ever intend to imply that. Again, my comment was solely directed at thinking you meant Lucid was heading in the right direction in terms of price, which is my mistake. Cheers!

 

lol the ad hominems when the arguments fail.

Fwiw I did not disparage this Lucid car (except for some software issues people are reporting), just that it is expensive when I thought DoD was stating otherwise. I do have major doubts the company is competent and capitalized enough to scale though. (hence the commentary on its plummeting stock) I see you active in the stock market chat, if you are holding good luck with that.

Tesla is going to have 20% market share in the long run. That means 80% of the market will be owned by the competition. This is highly likely. However, just because I speak the truth about gm/Ford being woefully inadequate, Lucid being too expensive and unlikely to scale, Rivian being incompetent up to this point etc does not mean I think competition will never come. It will, for sure! And when I see it I will acknowledge it. Perhaps VW continues to refine their ID family, or the Apple car is worthy when it comes out in a couple of years or 10. But you guys want me to call trash treasure, when I’m just calling it what it is.