Well, he can learn how to dribble better, and it's not that hard to learn how to knock down a turnaround jumper. As much as you think Payton is a perfect fit with Lewis, I think he might be a hinderance. Lewis needs to learn how to create for himself more during games, and it's a little hard to do that with Payton's ball-hogging tendency. As far as him not being any better than perkins, please. That is so far out there it is not even worth commenting on. You have been biased against Lewis for quite some time, even calling him a poor man's Horry before. Gimme a break. How can he be a star? Hitting the boards, knocking down his shots, posting up when he has a mismatch, learn to dribble better. He's had a good start so far, I don't see why he has necessarily hit a brick wall and can't get any better now.
Well I don't see why the Rockets would be concerned with cap space when they would have been capped out at the time anyway. Roster spots? pfft big deal, that's what the IR is for. Lewis would have been more valuable trade bait than Turkan, maybe not that year though.
and you are assumming that there was a draft manuver in place when they drafted him. The trade was good, the pick was bad. If there WAS a deal in place, then it wasn't even really our pick, but who is to say there was a deal in place? How do we know we did not get bailed out by NY? hmm?
Using your logic, the question becomes whether or not the Rockets deliberately chose a tradeable commodity over a high-reward project. Almost impossible to tell. We do know that the Rockets were extremely impressed with Turkcan in his workouts. I was under the impression that they originally meant to keep him. If this is true, it was a bad pick that was salvaged when they stumbled into Griffin. If, on the other hand, they were in essence picking for the Knicks, or merely finding someone with marketable skills... it becomes decent. I'm not going to argue about crispee over Lewis. That's usually an exercise in futility . I think he'll develop further... but hell, I don't know.
Very few people "develop" a whole new facet of their game. Sure, there are a few exceptions. You can develop a pet move, but most can't just "learn how to shoot" or "learn how to dribble". Rashard may get better at handling the ball, but odds are, he will never be able to beat his man off the dribble, just like Shandon won't become a deadly outside threat. Rashard Lewis will be a very good role player, but probably not the type of player you can build a contending team. We may have made the wrong choice if it comes down Lewis vs. Morris. But, as crispee said, Lewis would be in Memphis right now if we had picked him. It's not like we passed on Michael Jordan for Sam Bowie. Also, crispee-I'm fairly sure we traded the pick we got for Turkcan for Morris. We got Griffin with our pick, Bucks pick, and the Magic pick.
I'm not quite so sure about that part. Lewis' first season was very unimpressive. Besides, even if they had wanted him, someone else might have remained in Houston. It's almost impossible to look back clearly, since nobody knows what would have turned out differently. Maybe we could have traded for the #1 with Lewis .
I thought the Rockets traded the Turksan pick, and the #22 pick for the #23 pick as part of the Pistons/Grizzlies draft pick blackmail caper. Rudy knew all along that we would probably need 3 picks to move up, so the Turksan pick was invaluable.
I'm just reciting what Feigan said in the Chronicle the day after. Obviously, he guesses a lot about specifics like this...I'll go with what you say, then, awaiting others on the BBS challenge it.
haven...you need to cut out the logic business in this forum...and buy NBA League Pass or stay in the hangout. Logic arguments don't fly, when we can all see that Lewis has no one-on-one talents, yet, to be considered a "star" like you say.
Logic doesn't apply to front office decisions? My, we're all in trouble. I've seen enough of Lewis to believe that he has a great shot, good size, good athleticism... if he can develop a post-up game and bulk up or develop ball skills, he'll be stellar. I don't actually believe that a "star" has to take guys one-on-one. Would you consider Reggie Miller a star?
Hey, watch the bouncing ball. I was talking about your use of the word "logic." You and I are talking about this "Lewis is already a star" issue. Don't even try to mesh your arguments with others. Stay on track. You are kidding, right??? I assume you mean to say Reggie Miller cannot beat one-on-one defense....ummmmm....he was often doubled...that is why they started running him through a slalom of picks. OK.....haven is officially off my bball debate list until Nov 1st for using "logic" to go outside the boundaries of "logic." while still trying to claim it. ....next!
And I consider anyone deranged who thinks that Miller's success stemmed from one-on-one skills as opposed to the ability to hit a shot even against good defense... ... if you mean one-on-one skills in that sense, then sure, he had them. If you mean the ability to take someone off the dribble... then no, he didn't. I don't understand the belligerence.
I have three quick points to make about this thread. I was wrong. I was wrong. I was wrong. From the Chronicle- <b>Later Wednesday, the Rockets cashed another first-round pick acquired for another player who played for them, Mirsad Turkcan, to pick up Maryland forward Terence Morris in the second round. The Rockets sent the future pick the Pistons owed them -- any pick the Pistons should acquire by 2004 -- to Atlanta for the fifth pick of the second round, using it to acquire Morris, Francis' former Maryland teammate. </b> This info pretty much makes my arguments meaningless. I think I will go back to lurking.
I never said a star requires dribble penetration. I said a star requires double teams to prevent him from getting his shot off. And if you don't think Reggie required double teams...if you actually believe other players on Indiana drew the defense away from him....then the belligerence is not on me, it is on you. Haven....Reggie Miller is a HOF Star requiring a double team as much as Rice, Mullin, Gervin, English, Rudy T or any other sure-fire quick release dude on the planet. If one on one defense is too close they dribble once or twice and shoot that quick release. You measure Miller along some type of LOGIC that says he can't get a shot off against one on one...well!
Crispee: Geez, the bit about logic pertained to the transaction itself, only... not any analysis of Lewis, Miller, stars vs roleplayers vs superstars or whatever. Why crossapply it? I guess I misunderstood you. I thought you were saying that being a "star" (not even a superstar) required taking someone off the dribble... that seems to be what people usually mean by one-on-one abilities. I think that a good "pure shooter," especially with Lewis' size, can be a star. But... whatever... this is pretty circular.
Worst all time Rockets pick: Rodney McCray - I remember beating my head on the breakfast table when I read the Rockets passed on Clyde and took Scooters brother. Worst all time NBA pick: The Kandi Man - No way this guy was worth the number one overall pick. He should have been an early 2nd rounder at best.
While, Lewis isn't a star in my "book" either, the Sonics franchise has pointed to Lewis as their frontman in the future. And, could possibly become it. IMO, the skills are there, just need the right opportunity to come out. Anyone else who saw his Alief-Elsik games, knows that he definitely has talent and promise.
wow. That raises an eyebrow. Even then, Steve was more highly regarded than Rashard. Basically, CD would have traded Dickerson/Othella/pick for Rashard !?!?!? I wouldn't have traded Dickerson for him after their rookie years. I'm SHOCKED that Seattle didn't jump all over this trade.
