what great player has ever been hampered by a "system"?

Scottie Pippen is a zero without Michael Jordan.

 

You're right. Stephon and Steve are interchangeable. I'd say the same for guys like Baron Davis and Gilbert Arenas too. All those guys would not play well within the Rockets' offense.

 

You are asking for examples and you are putting down assumptions???!!!

Please name a great/very good player who had to change system and did not affected his game play?

No, I don't believe Francis's poor play is totally due to the system, but I do believe it plays a part. He hasn't adjusted, but I do believe he is trying. Will he ever adjust to the point where we will be successful, I don't know, but I sure do hope so. And since he is still part of the family (like a brother-in-law), I'll support him until my sister divorces him (Rockets trades him).

 

So, the year Jordan retired and Pippen put up great #s was a fluke?

 

Systems do not make good players worse. Good systems make good players better.

I'm sick of the excuses. We're young. (Which we are not.) Our guys need time to adjust to JVG. (What is there to adjust to. Just play smart.)

Look at Atlanta. Brand new team with players that have barely played with each other. They took us to 3 OTs. Ridiculous.

Look at Portland. Brand new team with players who have hardly played with each other. They are on a 5 game streak.

Look at Minnesota.

Look at Memphis.

Look at Denver.

Look at Utah.

San Antonio reloaded. Lakers reloaded. Sacramento lost many players and are still without Webber.

We have problems with our on-court chemistry. Either that or many of our players seriously lack basketball smarts.

We are a pretty good team that sometimes has great games.

 

Jordan was hampered under doug collins system, which had him running the point guard position.

 

Yao Ming! I remeber all the YOFs blame SF/Cat /JVG/whoever for Yao's low scoring. Yao is Definitely "hampered" by our system.

 

I was worried about you, Verse. I was afraid you had gotten yourself banned or worse.

Although Francis has all the physical tools, I'm beginning to wonder if he will ever be great. He has been trying to do things the way JVG wants, and has cut his dribbling and turnovers down greatly. However, in doing that, he can't provide enough scoring. Certainly not enough to be called great. He doesn't seem to be able to catch and shoot. He consistently passes up open shots, just to cross someone over several times and get off a contested shot.

If he goes back to scoring a lot of points, I think he will have to dribble excessively. When he does this, he turns the ball over a lot, and worse, destroys any team offensive flow. Everyone else starts standing around on offense, watching Steve try to hypnotize his defender.

Seriously, the best thing Steve has done for the offense lately is give up the ball. Not great. Not great at all.

All this b.s. about Steve drawing double teams and having the ability to take over games is just that. B.S. The only time he gets doubled anymore is when he drives the lane. Name me one player in the NBA that can drive the lane without drawing a double team.

Anyway, I think Steve has a long, long way to go to get to greatness.

 

well said.

 

Will the ISO system make Yao a better player or at least on-par?
Nash is known to be a "smart" player, why is Dallas only 4 games ahead of us? They probably have twice as much talent as us.

Nice to see you use 1 game as an example for Atlanta.
You forgot to mention that Portland beat the Clippers, Warriors, Celtics, Heats, and Magic in those 5 games.

Memphis is only 2 games ahead of us.
Nuggets have 2 more losses than us.
Utah is 4 games behind us.

 

Kobe in LA is the one star right now that adapts the most. I think. Teams with multiple stars are a good place to look, the system is built around the better player or the player worse at adapting.

Earlier: maybe McHale, P-Ew with Nelson, D-Rob with Dunc, McGrady with Vince. Kareem didn't run very well with Magic but he did pretty good still, team did better though. And so on.

 

Pippen's worth to the Bulls was amplified in that he didn't have to be the go-to guy. His skills are not of a go-to guy but of a great roleplayer. He may be the best roleplayer in the last 20 years. I jumped the gun when I said he was a zero without MJ.

 

What this thread shows is that certain players do not fit with certain systems. Steve could easily succeed with a team like the Nets with Jason Kidd passing to him in the open court. His game doesn't match with the slowdown half-court game of the Rockets.