You might have an argument if you said that players get cold from not being involved and miss shots yielding a low % due to ISOs freezing them out, but you're off base suggeting the ISO itself is a low percentage option. Whatever you might think about the Rocket ISOs, they're a high percentage option -- which is why they used them so much last year and why they go back to them when people aren't hitting. The only 'play' that yields a higher percentage for the Rockets than a Francis or Mobley ISO is a Cato or Griffin tip in off a miss. p.s. You have some good points, but enough with the "play as a team" stuff. We heard you the first hundred times. We all get it, Rudy gets it, Steve gets it. You might as well repeat over and over that we should score more points than the other team.
Tonight I saw Steve set up his teamates....not all the time, but enough to get a glimpse into what he can be. If Steve continues to score at will AND set his teamates up...then we will have something special in H-Town. I even saw some effective Fast breaks..... DaDakota
Steve is one of those players you don't tell what to do on the floor. You coach him in practice, but let him do what he has to do on the floor. Why? because the guy wants to win. When you have gifted players like that, you don't restrict them too much...you let them find their strenghts and adjust their game through experience. Steve will learn when to pass it, or drive, or pull up and shoot the jumper. He'll figure it out....that's what he's doing. Who cares if he mucks it up...the Rockets aren't competing for the championship - yet. I'm not worried about Steve or Mobley. More concerned about the Yao Ming's fellow durability. The Rockets look fine, all they have to do this year is aim for the playoffs. It doesn't matter how they make it, how ugly, how poorly, whatever. AS long as they do it on their terms. The desire to win is what will hone their games. Otherwise it doesn't matter how great of a coach or how gifted the atheltes are or how willing they are to listen...they'll never win the championship. So relax...all this make your teammates better...well, first Francis has to get better on his own time before he can make anyone else better.
For the record, everyone on Dallas' roster isn't named Finley or Nowitski. Nash gets passes to Raja Bell, Evan Eschmeyer, Adrian Griiffin, Walt Williams, Shawn Bradley, Eduardo "Offensive Put Back" Najera and Raef La Frentz - whose 46% career FG% and 36.7% 3pt % aren't a lock for a HOF nomination.
DavidS- you summed it up great. I agree that the position the player plays is moot. The whole thing about Steve being a 1 or 2 doesn't matter a bit, when it comes to making your teammates better. What I'm wondering is, at what point are you going to relax and look at it the way Jeff does? I think you guys agree, essentially, so when will the negativity stop? When do we just get to enjoy watching this phenomenal player grow without listening to the pessimists on their pulpits? Where's the love man?
Yes, I have. Of our current squad only Cato and Thomas had significantly better percentages. Cato barely shot so he doesn't really count, but what he got he got on putbacks off missed shots (how many of those were ISOs?) and alley oops from Steve. Thomas got his on, guess what, ISOs. I'm not FOR ISOs. I just think it's daft to suggest Rudy (or Steve) would keep going to something that didn't work. I think it's also daft to suggest that they don't know there's a better way. They clearly do or they wouldn't have spent training camp developing a new offense which emphasizing team play. It doesn't happen overnight -- especially when you've got key players out and players playing out of position. But the wins and losses count the same no matter what we're running, so they go to what they know will work and what they know to be a, yes, high percentage option. Practice is for learning and implementing new schemes. Games are for winning, even if it's at the expense of a new, team-oriented offense. But I guess I know your answer to each of these issues. Does it go something like "I DON'T CARE!!! PLAY AS A TEAM!!!!! BASKETBALL IS A TEAM SPORT!!! WIN OR LOSE AS A TEAM!!! TEAM, TEAM, TEAM!!!" If it is, be patient. I think you'll be pleased with how these guys play AS A TEAM, once they've had a chance to practice as one.
Jeff - You seldom (if ever) respond to me. I don't know if my points are not credible to you, I'm on your ignore list or what...but even if you don't respond I hope you will consider the following. You and I have different degrees of patience and it just dawned on me as to why. Unlike you, when I mentally process Steve Francis's (and Cuttino's) future I am not able to factor in "look how long it took Jordan" or "it took Dream 10 years" to win it all. The root of my impatience (which I'm sure comes off as pessimism to those who don't read much if what I post) is in the fact that today's NBA is drastically different than it was for the early years of MJ or Hakeem. More specifically - 1) With today's salary cap structure (and the impending Luxury Tax), teams do not remain together as long (Rodney Rogers, Keon Clark and the Rox not using their MCE this year as small examples). 2) MJ and Hakeem's era had an occassional Sabonis or Divac. Today there is an open floodgate of skilled international players who are thoroughly versed in the elements of team basketball. My personal expectation level is thus - playoffs 2003 > 2nd round 2004 > WC Finals 2005 or 2006. If that journey is likened to a coast to coast automobile trip of 5 days, the Rox (given today's NBA operating environment) just don't have the luxury of waiting until the morning of Day 1 to start packing and pull out the road map. If Jeff or any of the rest of you find my impatience on the ideals of "making those around you better by sharing the ball" to be pessimistic then at least now maybe you will have a minor understand of why I feel a sense of urgency for the learning process.
I don't think Cato would score any more than 2 points a game if it wasn't for Steve. He has force fed Cato many a monster dunk. So, I think saying he doesn't make ANYONE better is going a little far.
See, I blame Michael Jordan...Not kidding here. Just like Madonna's barley clothed floor-crawling, pole-twrling, breast-grabbing routines and commercial success begat a whole generation of Brittanys and Aguileras etc., so too has MJ's shot-taking, ball-hogging, Nike-selling, blatent-fouling-no-calling, geting-away-with-murder-on-defense eventual basketball success has spawned an entire generation of basketballers who try to emulate him, as Jeff pointed out, when push comes to shove because they have been weaned on Jordan, and think it's the right thing to do. The differences are, few of them have Jordan's talent, and none of them have Jordan's ref-protection, especially when push comes to shove. I disagree with Jeff that Magic and Bird and examples of team play like that are rare, I just think htey are becoming rare because of the example Jordan set, and all the guys who grew up watching Jordan take the ball whenever he felt the team was sagging, ( or whenever he felt they weren't, etc..) have learned the lesson well. It's just that, sjort of David Stern proclaming them the focus of the league, as he did with MJ, they won't be able to get the carte blanche that MJ got. So what you're left with is a mindset of our star players that what it means to be a star is that when your team is in trouble you get selfish...It works on the scoreboard when you're hot, doesn't when you're not, but either way it breaks down the concept of teamwork and mutual trust that Magic and Larry's teams always had, not to mention the Nasty Boys, etc. Okay, in retrospect, I blame Jordan, Stern, and the refs...oh, and Madonna...
Yes, interesting point you bring up. The kids today that were brought up on Jordan only saw his dunks (in your face on NBC and TNT/TBS). So kids emulate him. His dunks only! But they never realized the WORK it took for Jordan in other aspects of his game to even get to the position to get the DUNK the first place. What I mean is, he practiced hours on hours in on the court BY HIMSELF! Shooting 1000s of shots per day. 500 freethrows. Everyday. 500 jump shots, everyday. 500 Lay-ups with BOTH HANDS, everyday. 1000 routine post shots, everyday....over and over and over again. What do kids today do? They play street pick-up games. Dunk a few times then consider themselves he "next Jordan."
DavidS- Obviously you didn't watchj those old Chi-Det games because Joe never shut Jordan down. What they would do is shut Pippen and Grant Down and make Jordan do it himself. People keep talking about Joradn not and not passing, but by Jordans 3rd yr he was one of the top 5 players in the league period. On top of the 30+ points, he was dropping like 7 or 8 dimes from the 2 guard not pg slot. We are comparing apples with oranges because Shaq ,Jordan and Dream were big players that could always get good shots from 17 ft, Francis is a pg who is suppose to set up and run the team and still get his. I think just like with Eddie that Rudy ruins Steve by playing him at the sg spot just like Rudy used to have Eddie 25ft from the basket shooting. Gametime experience, Francis is still a young player in general, but its becoming more and more like he'll never be a pg that will avg 8 asst. Its like Francis is like Marbury with a better attitude and less asst. I hope that I'm lying, but i don't think Francis will be a good or effective older player like Iverson. Once his explosiveness starts to slip, i think he's done because he doesn't play the mental side of basketball enough. I would like to see him stay above the ft line more also.
Don't kill me for this, but sometimes my biggest fear is Francis' career going roughly the same way Starbury's went...and his start this year is eerily like Marbury's start 3 years ago, when he came out averaging 30 pts/game, but there were complaints that his big men weren't getting the ball, but just standing around watching Marbury beat his guy 1-on-1...It's a very fine line between "scoring point guard" and "selfish point guard"...I'm not saying Francis has crossed that line, but it would be foolish to keep saying that there is no chance he'll ever become a Marbury just because we root for him...
This is a issue for another debate. Buy my point was that I wanted to use the Jordan/Dumars comparison regarding the image of Jordan/Francis being all flash and no-substace early in their careers. After being "taught" by no-nonsense players in the playoffs, they ended up learning what it took to win. Just because you can score doesn't mean that you can win in the playoffs. Jordan learned that he had to trust his teammates in order to beat the Pistons. Plus, the Pistons would get in their heads; especially Pippens! We can talk about whether Jordan was "shut-down" in another thread.
Youre right. Dumas never "shut down" Jordan. But Detroits team defense did, or rather, they contained him. It was called the "Jordan Rules". Michael struggled quite a bit against that type of defense and in reality, that defense helped him develop into more of a team player. Before the Jordan Rules were implemented, he had games of around 50 points. After, he was held below 30 quite a few times and Chicago had alot of problems beating Detroit.
David, Interesting post. You say that Frances drives you crazy 50% of the time. We are talking about the best player on the team, an All Star, a premier player in the league; and, you know what, I feel the same way. Every time I watch him I end up screaming, jumping up and down, and punching things. And this is consistently the team' s high scorer. This is amazing! Without question, Frances is the least popular player on this board. He is incredibily talented. He is a gifted athlete, etc. BUT, he has created the image that he is a selfish player. He works hard, he seems driven to win, he hussles. BUT, he dominates the ball, takes ill advised shots, and plays so-so defense. This reputation is not just local. WHY IS THERE SUCH A LONG LEARNING CURVE? Does he not listen to anyone? He says the right things in public, he seems like a nice guy, he doesn't seem dense. Name a contemporary playoff team whose star player has the same reputation with a coach that permits this pattern to continue.
