Wacky trade ideas? This is the third straight year out of the playoffs. Third straight year of wacky trade ideas. Where's Hottoddie when we need him? As I said: the Brian Grant trade idea is a for-instance. We're probably stuck with Glen Rice. But KT deserves to start, and it should be in the East. The West is the land of the big, talented power forward. We desperately need some size (and talent) in the post. Something has to give, one way or the other: 5) Cato, Collier 4) Mo, KT, EG 3) Rice, T-Mo, Lanky 2) Cat, Torres 1) Steve, Mooch, Tierre B. So what to do with the #1 draft pick? Re-sign Walt? I hope not, but you know Rudy and players who jack 3's. Gotta have'em. KT and the #1 pick are the most tradeable commodities we have. Hell, I'll take Crispee's bet. (Of course, I didn't change my username on the last bet; I'm not convinced EG will be a 3.)
We have the perfect tools for the trade. We have nails and a hammer. All we need is for someone to pound it. #6 + KT? If we get a C for that pick, Clipps would gladly do it. They need the frontcourt depth. Their current line-up, with a capable backup PF and a capable backup C would be great. All while trading a player whom they don't want to pony up the dough for and have been playing without anyway. Kandi/Center(draft pick) Brand/KT Miles/Maggette Q Rich/Piatowski Mcinnis/Dooling Significantly improved. Excellent trade. I hope the Rockets inquire about Odom again.
imo Sane, you hurt that team with that trade. Why would they want two backups for Odom? They have other pieces to trade for backups, because they already have starters at those positions. The odds of a center taken at #6 being better than what Kandi is starting to show is equal to Kandi continuing to show that he can play. KT + #6 might be more valuable than Wagner for many teams, but not for the Clippers. Odom is going to have to deliver a sure fire stud starter at one of their positions! Are you kidding me? How about they trade Odom for Wagner straight up, and then Quentin Richardson and their pick for a top 10 center?? Kandi/Center(draft pick) Brand/beefy fodder Miles/Maggette Wagner/Piatowski Mcinnis/Dooling Now, honestly, tell me which team you'd rather have. Yours or mine. If you like JWilliams better, then sustitute him for Wagner, keep Richardson, and shop you excess guards for serviceable backups for Brand/Kandi and count of them not needing much in the way of backups....then you have Kandi/beefy fodder Brand/beefy fodder Miles/Maggette Quentin/Piatowski JWill/Mcinnis/Dooling So, you don't want a stud starter in exchange for Odom? Really?
God, I hope you are right, Crispee. Remember this thread? Granted, I didn't present my argument too well at the time, and I "endeared" myself to the HP-Smeg-Heb clique (hehe), but I was basically saying give Kenny a chance and see what he can do. Here we are 6 months later and like you say, KT is the 3rd most improved player in the league. I sorta resigned myself to the fact that because of the glut of forwards that the Rockets have that someone would have to go & it would highly be unlikely to see Mo leave. However, I agree that no one should bank on Mo's return being an extremely smooth one. We have no idea if he will ever be the same player that he was until after several games and it may be longer than that. So, I really would like to see us keep Kenny, but if we get a great offer for him and like our draft pick, then I think that we might have to consider it. Let me ask you this, HP: What do you think the Rockets' off-season plans will consist of if trading Kenny is not an option?
yeah, like i have a good track record with that stuff....LOL! I am absolutely terrible at predicting Drafts, College Players, and GM maneuvers. I have no sources, and I don't watch college ball. And I quit making predictions when Stacey King showed up as a wimp, and Derrick Chievous was the next James Worthy!!! oh, I lost many points of credit that season, and oooohhh, that whole Kurt Thomas the real deal with a McHale-esque low post game just because he made mincemeat of my beloved Rice Owls, and lied about being 6'11". lol I'm better at sticking to scouting NBA players and plays...got to know your limitations. I like DearRock's idea of status quo, get another big man in the draft, work on chemistry, and reevaluate trading Kenny after seeing Mo play. I have ZERO fear of playing with no true SF when we can play a 1 3 1 zone with Griffin as key roamer ala Garnett. I have ZERO fear of Griffin not developing a true PF game just because he likes to shoot jumpers -- anymore than I would worry about Nowitzki doing that. The game is changing. Zones allow teams with tall shooters a great deal of flexibility, and zones allow you to play without a true center and KT and EG in the game together, no sweat. But, if I were GM!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! If I were to Dreamcast...I'd bust up the luv fest completely, ala Achebe. Steve is out of here while he has HUGE trade value. The PG experiment is over. hehehehehe Francis for Ming and Jamal Crawford (chicago doesn't want 3 towers) yeah buddy!!! or Francis for Kwama Brown and their draft pick or Francis and our pick for Ming and Battier (let the Grizzlies have another chance with Stevie) hehehehehe ...
The other two trades, I could stand ... but this? We'd be trading a proven star for a guy who can't crack a line-up on a mediocre team and who has been publicly criticized by Wizard's management... remember, Brown's older than Eddie Griffin, and has shown much less. I guess another draft pick would be nice... but it's not like we'd be getting a top 5 or so pick, which is what I'd want. I think your love affair with Cuttino is making you de-value Francis...
My reasoning behind Odom being available is just that they have plenty of players that can play the forward positions and might not think Odom is worth the max, which is surely what he'll be asking for. Maybe wagner does fall to our pick and the Clipps want him + a backup for Brand? Hehe, or we could toss them Mooch + pick. Yeah, I do think the suns owner is stupid. And yet another player that the owner might not think will be worth the max. If I was a gm, Marion wouldn't be the choice for the foundation(and cap eater) of my franchise. But a complimetary(even if overpaid) player? hell yeah. Oh yeah and did I mention they have a big hole at pf and a nice young cheap sf in the wings? That being said, I'm not holding my breath on landing either of those two, and those are really the only sfs I would trade Kenny for. Other than that, I do think Kenny would only be traded for an upgrade at PF. I would say center too, but how many available + desireable centers are out there? Speaking of Phoenix though, if there wasn't someone good who could fill either sf or C with our draft pick, I wouldn't mind trading the pick for say Joe Johnson + a later 1st round pick. Can we just win the lottery please?
touche. are you declaring Kwama a bust...nevermind, I'll just go read Clutch's thread about it. Be fair, though. My love for Cuttino doesn't have anything to do with my assessment of Francis. Fair enough? I'm more in love with Francis's trade value and getting taller than I am in Cuttino. I'm not sold on a guard-oriented team with bad defense. If Cuttino had a bigger salary to make him tradeable in one-for-ones, I'd accept certain trades. But, you're right I do love Cuttino and would miss him the same as everyone would miss Stevie. But the main this is that I'm convinced of one certainty: If Ming is the real deal like Bill Walton says, everyone team in the NBA must do everything in there power to get him. Trading Mobley and our pick isn't going to cut it, but, Chicago and Memphis surely would love to have a major ticket drawing stud in Francis. We are in prime negotiating position to get Ming, especially if Chicago gets the first pick. You aren't making that trade without major pain, though! but this is all dreamcasting fun, right? I've got the bug when it comes to 7'6" shooter/passers who have a well-proportioned NBA body. The dude looks like a real person, as opposed to a lumering giant or praying mantis.
Houston trades: PG Steve Francis (21.4 ppg, 7.2 rpg, 6.7 apg in 40.9 minutes) SG Cuttino Mobley (21.7 ppg, 4.2 rpg, 2.6 apg in 42.3 minutes) Houston receives: PG Jeff McInnis (14.8 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 6.1 apg in 37.8 minutes) SF Lamar Odom (13.1 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 5.9 apg in 34.5 minutes) SF Darius Miles (9.5 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 2.2 apg in 27.2 minutes) Change in team outlook: -5.7 ppg, +2.9 rpg, and +4.9 apg. L.A. Clippers trades: PG Jeff McInnis (14.8 ppg, 2.6 rpg, 6.1 apg in 37.8 minutes) SF Lamar Odom (13.1 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 5.9 apg in 34.5 minutes) SF Darius Miles (9.5 ppg, 5.6 rpg, 2.2 apg in 27.2 minutes) L.A. Clippers receives: PG Steve Francis (21.4 ppg, 7.2 rpg, 6.7 apg in 45 games) SG Cuttino Mobley (21.7 ppg, 4.2 rpg, 2.6 apg in 63 games) Change in team outlook: +5.7 ppg, -2.9 rpg, and -4.9 apg. TRADE ACCEPTED Just a thought
lpbman: I would insist on the Clippers including Elton Brand instead of Miles or Odom. As a matter of fact, if they are willing to deal Brand, Miles, and McInnis for Mobley and Francis, then we can talk. However, I would not do the deal you proposed because I think it is giving up far too much. If you are going to trade one of the best, maybe the best, backcourt duo in the NBA then it is a given that you get a dominant PF/low post player along with an above-average PG in return as the bare minimum. crispee: Believe it or not, I value your opinion on Rockets things pretty highly. I can't explain why I felt differently in the past, but I have now seen the light! Seriously, I would love to see the Rockets try to get Ming. I have always felt that your championship teams, with the exception of the Jordan-led Bulls, had as one of their go-to-guys a dominant presence in the low post. Unfortunately, Kenny is the only guy that the Rockets have that is even a threat to score on the block. I feel that if we have a healthy team next year that there is no reason why we can't reach the playoffs. However, I think we would be probably no higher than a #5 seed. We would need a dominant low post player to get us in that top 4 of the West, IMO. I have heard great things about Ming, but I have also heard that it might be hard to get him out of his contract with his Chinese team, and that he might be more of a project than expected. I am curious to know if you can shed any light on the following questions: 1) How hard will it really be to get him out of his team in China 2) Will he be an impact player right away or will it take him some time sorta like with Eddie? Meaning that he will show flashes, but for the most part, it is too early to expect the moon from him. The reason why I ask you about this, especially about #2 is that for a long time all I ever heard about this guy was tremendous hyperbole. Of course, this has planted some doubt in my mind plus it allows one to be set up for an incredible let-down if he doesn't perform to expectations. However, if everything about him is close to being true, then I feel that the Rockets should take him if they have that opportunity. It would be interesting to see what it would take to get him, though. I know that most people think it might be our pick + KT.
Here I am. Sooo, it's a wacky trade idea you want. I can do that. Since we're speculating about trading away a pick that we can't, as a result of Toronto choking & our debt to Memphis next year, let's see if we can do some juggling of picks. The CBA states that no team can trade away their #1 pick 2 consecutive years in a row. However, you can trade your #1 pick for someone else's in the same year. So, with that in mind, the fact that Crispee's left the door open for trading KT, & that we don't have any idea how the lottery picks are going to fall, let's do some wheeling & dealing. First off, let's assume that the top 3 picks end up like this: 1) Houston 2) Chicago 3) Memphis Assuming that Chicago would love to have JW, we threaten them with trading the 1st pick to another team like the Clippers, Atlanta, Washington, etc., unless they trade with us. We then swap picks with them in exchange for them agreeing to let us cash in the Drew obligation for their unconditional #1 pick next year. They agree & we've acquired a potential lottery pick for next year & dropped down to the second pick. Chicago picks JW & is released to trade future picks. Next, assuming that Memphis really wants Yao Ming, we make a similar threat to them. We swap picks, they release us from our Francis trade obligation next year & agree to this 3 team trade: Houston sends Cato/KT/T-Mo to Memphis. Houston sends Moochie/our #1 pick next year to the Clippers. Memphis sends Wright to Houston. Memphis sends Battier to the Clippers. The Clippers send Odom/Dooling/Boykins(throw in) to Houston. We end up getting our #1 pick back to send to LA, acquiring a starting center, SF, a backup PG & drop down to the 3rd pick. Memphis picks Yao Ming. Next, playing off of Crispee's idea, we could do one of these two trades: Trade #1 Houston sends Francis/Collier to Chicago. Chicago sends Crawford/Curry to Houston. Trade #2 Houston sends Francis/Collier to Washington. Washington sends Kwame/Etan/this year's #1 pick to Houston. Depending on which one of the two trades we do, we then take the best PG or big man available at the 3rd pick. These moves would give us a lineup next year of: With Trade #1 C: Wright/Curry/Willis or draft pick? PF: Taylor/Griffin/draft pick? SF: Odom/Rice/Qyntel? SG: Mobley/Torres PG: Crawford/Dooling/Brown With Trade #2 Washington's pick should be somewhere around #11-16. C: Wright/Kwame/Willis or draft pick PF: Taylor/Griffin/Etan SF: Odom/Rice/Langhi or draft pick SG: Mobley/Torres PG: Wagner?/Dooling/Brown Hey, don't blame me. You did ask for a wacky trade idea after all.
I like your thinking, but, Crawford is injured so your analogy of Taylor can apply to a greater degree to Crawford. He has yet to produce in the nba.
Did he just get reinjured, because he's been playing in the last 12 games, if you count todays game of 24 minutes, 14 pts., 4 assists, 2 rebounds, & only 1 turnover? Here's the link to the box scores of the other 11 games. http://www.nba.com/playerfile/jamal_crawford/game_by_game_stats.html
We shouldn't trade KT. He is one of the only players we have that plays defense and has an interior game. I know maybe we trade him for another non-defensive and non-rebounding three point shooter. More long rebounds for the other team to fast break on. Just my opinion.
One question: What is the infatuation with trading steve francis on this board? He is not part of the problem. He is the solution.
