So after ONE season of not making the playoffs after making it straight to however many in a row they were in Utah, by your standards, Jerry Sloan has to go, huh? I love math.
I have no clue why this thread is in existence. I mean sure, we all love Rudy (to varying degree), but: 1. This topic has been debated to death in as many as 10 threads I can recall (and dozens of others b****ing/whining threads like Les is cheap, Les is disloyal, Screw you Les good luck Rudy threads). 2. What exactly do you hope to accomplish/resolve with this debate? Unless some *cough cough* informant secretly sneaks into Les' office and finds paper documents showing his evil plot to fire Rudy, nobody in hell knows whether Rudy (except Rudy or Les, both of which could lie about it) was fired or force out. 3. It's been over a season, just let it go. 4. (True for some people) who cares?
There's a guy on here called tim something whose signature reads, "Never underestimate the heart of a traitor." I never knew what it meant until he explained that he thought Rudy abandoned the team and then went to work for the enemy. He thinks Rudy T is a traitor. If this thread can enlighten guys like him (and maybe get him to change his offensive sig), it's 5 stars in my book.
p.s. Anytime someone says "It's been xxx long... let it go..." I'm reminded of the old Bill Hicks routine: Christian: You know Bill, Jesus died for your sins. Bill: That was a long time ago... Let it go...
who would fake cancer guys???with the team falling out of hand, he probably wanted to step down, forced or not
1. Rudy is not Jesus and his accomplishments doesn't come close to mirroring Jesus (assuming he exists). So I don't think saying that was a long time ago unto Rudy (basketball coach, former Rocket) is undermining Rudy's achievements. 2. It is a business. There are many MUCH more loyal employees than Rudy who worked for certain organizations longer than Rudy who were treated less well than Rudy (I mean hey, at least Rudy got his decade or so). If everyone gripes about that it'll require hundreds of books. If you want I can sit down with you over a cup of coffee and amuse ourselves over the worst cases in the business world. 3. As I've said, what exactly do we hope to achieve with this discussion? Even it hasn't been done hundreds of times already, we don't know if Rudy was force out or he quit and we won't know no matter how many times we discuss it. 4. The "who cares" factor. There was a time when I cared (especially after he was initially let go). And I thought, if Rudy was let go due to health reasons, than Les and the Rockets PR definitely f*cked up. They could have said "we would love to have Rudy around, but he's concerned about his health, we want him to stay but his health is first," in other words explained the situation better and more than they did. If somebody comes up and said to me, "hey, what do you think of Rudy?" I would have said, great player, nice guy, great Rocket. But it's kind of hard to ask me to "CARE" if he's a Rockets coach after this long.
mfw: I'd have coffee with you if you wanted to, but not to discuss the worst firings in the history of the world. I'm just not that interested. I am interested in the Rockets though, which is why I post on this site. Rudy was a big enough part of the Rockets that I think he's still fair game here -- even more now that he's coaching again and at least one fan here is calling him a traitor. As for the idea that it's been a whole year and it's ancient history now... Who cares if Malone held Drexler? It's been like 8 years. Get over it and learn to love him. Who cares if Pippen was a disaster? Who cares if we traded Cassell and Horry for Barkley? Who cares if the Rockets won two championships? Who cares if we once had a player called Hakeem? Or Clyde or Rudy or Calvin or Moses or Steve. Call me crazy but I care how Rudy was treated by the organization and it pisses me off when people call him a traitor. Even a whole whopping year later. Judging from the poll results, I'm not alone.
Malone held Drexler 8 years ago, but during the last 8 years he only got dirtier. I hate him as a player and as a person. Glad Boki stood him up. Got over Pippen already. Besides, I am pleased that Pippen's wretched existence in the NBA brought down his "Greatest 50 of all time" status. That is punishment enough. The Sam and Horry trade was mistake on our part. But that's what it is, a mistake. When you have to make decisions (which is basically every field out there), you are expected to make mistakes. Barkley didn't screw us over it. Well, since we (as fans) think the team is playing for Championships, we'd better care (to a certain extent). The Celtics are the best team ever but do their fans care a lot? Nope, they care more that their team blows right now. Hakeem, Drexler and Rudy brought the rings. Calvin and Moses were great Rockets also, but does it bother me that they are not Rockets right now? No. I care only as far as I respect them. Not that their life has to be followed in every detail. And I really don't think you should include Steve in that list. The fact is, people might not stop caring all together, but they eventually start caring less. Agree with you on the last part. I have a great problem with people calling Rudy a traitor especially when he's not here to defend himself. However, my post was more towards the why this thread was started. I mean, if we really feel the need to discuss it again, we could just dig the graveyard and find the dozens of others.
This is a fair assessment of what went down. The rest of you guys allow sentiment to cloud your view. To you guys, if Rudy lied about the how it happened, he is a saint. If Les lied, he is the scum of the earth. Rudy had free reign and leeway for a long time. He had more chances than most if not all other coaches in the league. Things just don't work out any more. What else is an owner supposed to do? Is it better if he had gone out and fired Rudy? He allowed Rudy to "make" the call, to save face. That was a decent thing to do.
You should have just ignored the thread then. You certainly haven't added anything to it. Anyway, this thread is two days old - let it go.
The thread now has a life of it's own, but as the thread starter, I can tell you why it initially came into existence. The subject of whether Rudy T betrayed the Rox by signing with the Lakers keeps coming up. The assertion that Rudy was forced out keeps coming up. So, as I had said, I just wanted to get a read on the pulse of the people. I wanted to see how many people believed Rudy. All I was really interested in was the poll results, in a sort of truth-through-democracy. I've discovered that most people think Les forced Rudy T out. I now know where public opinion (with the realm of cf.net) stands. It's not that I wanted to convince someone of something or discover the real truth, or that I'm fixated on Rudy T's dismissal. I couldn't just refer to the many past threads because they (1) didn't have polls and (2) reflected the opinions way in the past and not now. I just wanted to know what the majority sentiment was. And now I know.
It's simple. He stepped down because he had cancer. When are you people going to get it thru your heads that the guy had A LIFE THREATENING DISEASE!!! Since nobody knew for sure what was going to happen, and the Rockets were about to move into Toyota Center with all the fanfare and big expectations, the Rockets HAD to move forward and sign a new coach. They could not wait to see if Rudy T was going to die, be permanently disabled (i.e. lose his bladder or some other important organ(s)), or be able to come back in a year or two. I mean, it's like we're forgetting that he MIGHT HAVE DIED (had the cancer spread), for cryin' out loud... I'm sure that if the Rockets were still two years removed from a championship, instead of four years into the lottery and losing traction, they could have (and would have) waited for Rudy to come back. But, given the marketing situation they were in (new building, no playoffs, etc...) they just couldn't. It's that simple. Believe it or not, sometimes things happen in the NBA just because of normal circumstances -- i.e. a person gets cancer and has to change priorities for a while.
Ok guys. Let me give you the scoop. I live in a high rise. And Rudy's daughter lives here. She is very nice and I see her at the workout facility here every day. We talk a lot. Not basketball most of the time, but I did ask her how her dad has been doing etc. The prognosis for Rudy was always very positive because they detected has cancer early. It was at his family's insistance that he took some time off from coaching. Rudy asked the Rockets if a coach could take over on an interim basis. The Rockets told Rudy to take care of himself and that should be there first priority and that they wanted to go in a different direction and get a full time coach. They did want want an interim coach as they thought makeup of the team was fragile. They told Rudy he would always have a position of some type in the Rockets. After he took care of his health, he wanted to coach again. This may just be his daughter's interpretation or my interpretation of his daughter, but I thought I'd share.
Umm... Rudy's cancer was not considered life threatening. Sure, Cancer can spread but Rudy's had not and he was treated as an outpatient with medication being applied to the tumor which had not penetrated to the bladder muscle. He didn't undergo Chemo or Surgery. He was lucky it hadn't spread and he needed to take care of the situation before it became life threatening.
It is kind of funny that we just ignore the fact that the guy had cancer. When you think about it, it is kind of ridiculous for a pro franchise to hold a spot for a coach. I guess it could happen, Duke held a spot for Coach K. But that's Coach K, he means absolutely everything to Duke. What was Les supposed to do. Life moves on, especially in professional sports.
Had cancer. Had cancer treated. Ready to coach: I also personally ran into Jim Boylen at Tien Ren (formerly Wonderful Vegetarian Restaurant) about two weeks before it all happened and asked how Rudy was. He said Rudy'd just been given a clean bill of health that day, that they'd just got off the phone with each other a couple hours before. Unless the coach is the franchise.
It feels unbelievably weird (they're not the "Jazz", but I have still grown to hate the Lakers over the years), but... I will be forced to root for him, too, cuz I love the guy.
