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Wafer fans vs. Battier fans

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Will, Jul 18, 2009.

  1. Shroopy2

    Shroopy2 Member

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    Want to think that means pining for Wafer at full MLE cost, and badmouthing Battier means trading him for a simple backup center like Nazr Mohammed, right?

    2nd Team All Defense vs 2nd Team on the actual team of the All Defense guy. Wafer doesnt deserve Battier money
     
  2. TimBly15

    TimBly15 Member

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    I'm a Rockets fan
     
  3. pmac

    pmac Member

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    This was a great post. And Will, you are right. Most people seem to fit into these groups. I just don't understand why. I will never understand why people feel so obligated to support a type of player. I love the positives that Battier and Wafer bring to the table but I could care less how they do so.

    Why should I care if Shane overcomes his lack of athleticism or Wafer scores in a flashy way?....that's silly.

    I only care about how overall productive they are. Battier is the better player but it's not like he isn't compensated. He'll probably make more than twice as much as Wafer next year.

    It's just funny to me that if there was a way to quantify overall production and Wafer/Battier were found to have the same exact production people would still favor one or the other because of the way in which they produced.
     
  4. Strawman

    Strawman Member

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    QFT you can't classify me.
     
  5. Carl Herrera

    Carl Herrera Member

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    Gay fans: Which side do they fall?
     
  6. Pizza_Da_Hut

    Pizza_Da_Hut I put on pants for this?

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    At the end of the day, Battier will always give you 100%. The prototypical scorer, the dynamic player that everyone loves, almost always has attitude issues. Look at Wafer, Tmac, KB24, Shaq, even MJ to an extent. For some of these athletes, they never stopped winning so the exposure of their attitudes really never reached the light of day. As I've said before, winning is the cureall to any chemistry problems, the issue is winning does not always happen.

    Players like Battier come in with one goal: to win. The prototypical scorer is more concerned with Sportscenter than rings. Look at Kobe sans Shaq, he was innefective. Team USA gave him an attitude adjustment. Part of the reason the Rockets took that Laker team so far is that the Lakers started to have a sense of old Kobe. The rockets stole game 1, and Kobe's cockiness nearly took that team down. Look at how we won, by putting the ball in his hands. After that series, Kobe looked more like Shane Battier than KB24. He was in it, he wanted the ring, and not necessarily the sportscenter top play.

    I think players like Shane keep the team grounded, and I'm not as wowed by his play (the intangibles) as I am his attitude. By any means necessary seems to be the goal in mind. A lot of players say that this is their motto, but very few live up to it. Look at Ariza. Let's not beat around the bush, he came here to get some limelight, not rings. If he wanted rings, LA is the place to be.

    Now, none of this downplays Shane's play on the court. He does some magic. I think the best players are the ones you don't necessarily see their impact when they are on the court, but you notice when they are off the court. At the begining of last season, the Rockets without Shane didn't have the same intensity, they didn't guard as well, and they didn't make the plays they should have. Some people wanted to blame it on chemistry between Ron and the rest of the team, but it wasn't. That extra play, the floor spacing, the no nonsense defense, it all adds up. Hell, Shane guarded Kobe in that 7 game series and avoided fouling him at every cost. It really wasn't until game 6 and 7 where Shane broke down and started to committ fouls.

    I'm probably wrong about everything I'm saying...
     
  7. solid

    solid Member

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    I would have taken Gay in a heartbeat. Ball in hoop = two points; most points at end of regulation, wins. As a fan I would much rather see teams try to outscore each other than mudwrestle. But that's just me.
     
  8. CXbby

    CXbby Member

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    I would rephrase the premise as people who are blinded by -take the ball and singlehandedly create a dunk or a pretty jump shot, love hops, speed, and degrees of difficulty, love highlight reels and box scores- and people who aren't.

    Like yourself, I value the principles of team, fundamentals, and hustle over athletic ability. However if a guy like Battier had supreme athletic ability to go along with all of his intangibles, it would be even better. Appreciating the values you've stated does not preclude me from liking the spectacular play, raw speed and athleticism. However I will not base my judgment solely on them.

    On the other hand, there are people who will be swayed by box score or spectacular plays alone. These people are blind.
     
  9. cjtaylorpt

    cjtaylorpt Member

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    He did a contrast
     
  10. CXbby

    CXbby Member

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    It's not about aesthetics, but wins. If trying to outscore someone meant you won less, would you still enjoy it?
     
  11. Tom Bombadillo

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    I think this thread would make more sense if it was, "Tracy fans vs. Battier fans".
     
  12. bjshot

    bjshot Member

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    No. Both Battier and Wafer are role players.
     
  13. Tom Bombadillo

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    So is Tracy...
     
  14. bjshot

    bjshot Member

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    Then you like Super stars.

    Wafer and Battier represent two extreme sides of the players, physical and mental abilities. If one owns both, he will be super star. The role players always have weakness. They are then the Battier and the Wafer.

    The fans and even the media more often overvalue the physical ability and undervalue the mental ability. So the team management maight overvalue the phyisical ability to please the fans.

    The fans also usually ask too much from the role players. If a role player win one game in 7 game series, I think he's on the best level of role players. Thus I think Rafer is good enough for Rockets. Both Battier/Wafer are very good role players. They both successfully play their roles, Shane is a starter and Wafer is a bencher.
     
  15. redao

    redao Member

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    Battier is overpaid.
    Wafer is not paid.
     
  16. BleedRocketsRed

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    Rudy Gay and Luther Head on the same team. Nobody can stop that Gay-Head combo.

    Maybe we would have had another lottery year and landed Kevin Love. Go with the Love-Gay-Head trio.


    Sorry for my immaturity. I find this funny.
     
  17. Pizza_Da_Hut

    Pizza_Da_Hut I put on pants for this?

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    If he signs for the MLE he will be.
     
  18. Uprising

    Uprising Member

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    I just hope the Rockets never turn into that boring display that JVG was running.

    I loved JVG, dude was hilarious. But man, for the most part that team was damn boring. (until his last year or so...the WBPS...and Dallas series).
     
  19. BetterThanEver

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    Why do we have to be Battier or Wafer fans?

    Can we be Waftier or Batfer fans?
     
  20. Canadiandude

    Canadiandude Member
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    Don't know why you're critizing his preference for vanilla over chocolate. And basketball has a lot to do with asthetics. People actually pay to "watch" the players at their craft. Not just simply stare and cheer at the scoreboard while they are at the Toyota Center :p
     

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