Are you saying that Vince is a better defensive player than Battier? If not, then I believe the point differential you will get by inserting VC into the starting lineup will not get us a championship. Scoring points with our starting 5 is not our weakness. The only way this would work to our advantage is if VC or McGrady would be willing to come off the bench which I don't believe either of them would be willing to do. I wouldn't be willing to take a 4 year contract at > 13m a year on the contigency that T-Mac or Yao will get hurt. If you are convinced that is the case then you should trade one or both, because with or without VC if you do not have T-Mac or Yao you are in the same position as this year. No bench.
Do you just like being a jerk? In a nutshell: Carter is known not to play up to his potential after his first few years after being a Raptor, known to not give his hardest at all and just coast, is known for being lazy, known for quitting on his teams, and extremely injury-prone (maybe even faking it). Vince Carter is one of my favorite players of all time though. And just because you get good money, doesn't mean you deserve it or is any indication of the player you are. See: Monte Ellis (although he's under his rookie contract) or in contrast the entire New York Knicks roster (in particular the stud Jerome James). Here you go: -On the morning of the day of Game 7 of the 2001 Eastern Conference Semifinals (Raptors vs. Philadelphia 76ers), Sunday, May 20, he attended his UNC graduation.[8] In that game, Carter missed a game-winning shot with 2.0 seconds remaining.[9] and shot just 6 of 18 from the field.[10] -During the 2003 NBA All-Star Game, under great public pressure, Carter gave up his starting All-Star spot to the Washington Wizards' Michael Jordan to allow Jordan to make his final start as an All-Star.[12] -As his Raptor tenure progressed, Raptor fans began to witness a transition in Carter's offensive game that featured more perimeter shooting. This was in stark contrast to Carter's initial repertoire of regular drives to the hoop for dunks which had subsequently gone on a decline. This, combined with Carter's chronic injury problems, predominantly from Jumper's Knee,[13] had some Raptor fans questioning his toughness and durability. Carter's work ethic was also questioned with his play declining as the years went on, culminating in a mediocre 15.9 points per game in 2004-2005[14] before his eventual trade. Carter became frustrated with the Raptors' management team as he was promised input by President Richard Peddie on the hiring of the next general manager. The Raptors failed to do so - Carter recommended Julius Erving[15], who arrived at Pearson Airport and never set foot at the Air Canada Centre for a legitimate meeting. On November 22, 2004, when pressed by the local media about his lack of dunks, Carter sarcastically responded, "I don't want to dunk anymore."[16] In late December 2004, there were allegations that Carter tipped off the opposing Seattle SuperSonics (the Raptors' opponents on November 19, 2004) of an upcoming Raptors play by yelling "It's a flare! It's a flare!".[17] However, no further actions were taken and the accusations were found to be baseless. Sources report that Reggie Evans was the Sonics player who was the source for the story and he later back tracked on his accusation saying he didn’t hear anything from Carter about tipping plays in order to sabotage the Raptors. Ray Allen was the player guarding Carter on the inbounds pass standing right next to him, and he said he didn’t hear anything from Carter about sabotaging plays, either. -Carter made it clear in the 2004 off-season that he wanted to be traded from the Raptors.[18] On December 17, 2004, Raptors General Manager Rob Babcock traded Carter to the New Jersey Nets for Alonzo Mourning, Eric Williams, Aaron Williams and two future first-round draft picks. The trade to the Nets, combined with Carter's continually declining popularity with Raptors fans, also put an end to his charity basketball games in Toronto, with the last one being played in the summer of that year. In early January 2005, he stated during a television interview with TNT's John Thompson to not giving effort in his last months as a Raptor; when asked if he always played hard, Carter replied, "In years past, no. I was fortunate to have the talent. You get spoiled when you're able to do a lot of things. You see that you don't have to work at it."[19]
That's twisting my words. Obviously we'll need all 3 of them healthy to win it all. But unlike previous years when we're clearly better (not overall but at the time) when Yao's injured instead of T-Mac, i think Vince and Yao can keep the team winning on a regular basis if T-Mac went down for a short period. I would rather have Battier come off the bench than VC. Just cause he's not know for being a stud defender doesn't mean he's not good at it. If your implying he's a liability on the floor because he'll give up more points than he scores i couldn't disagree more. Not to mention i wouldn't pay someone to come off the bench 13 million a year.
Not implying that he will give up more than he will score. I'm just saying that our starting 5 offense is not our problem, therefore VC, is solving a problem we don't have. A T-Mac/VC/Battier rotation is definately better than what we have now, but I would much rather find a true backup SG, PG, C and leave an already efficient starting 5 in place than spend > 13M on sortof solving one issue at the possible price of defense and team chemistry. I also believe where there is smoke there is fire. VC has worn out his welcome in both Toronto and NJ. He has a reputation as a quitter whether it is justified or not, I don't know, but risking 4 years >13M is obviously a gamble. I don't care about Les' money, but I do care about the cap and I don't want us strapped for 4 years if the VC gamble doesn't work. Also NJ has been trying to unload VC for 2 years. There have been no takers. Wonder why?
I remember someone posted a link to a article that said the Nets turned down the Cavs because they want more value then just expiring contracts. Also Carter will make close to 16million dollars this season, with an increase every season for 4 more years till its at 18 mil per. You basically have to throw in battier or Scola or Rafer's contract just so it will match up.
Wow, I thought it was an escalating 13M. Double everything I said. VC would be idiotic for the Rockets to obtain. No way moneyball is going to pursue VC.
But why would the Nets want to do that deal? The Cavs offered them a package of Wally's expiring contract and picks and the Nets turned it down wanting more, why would they want the Rocket's smaller expiring, battier, and low first rounder? Besides I think our main problem is the lack of a consistent offensive power coming off the bench. Carter's contract will tie us up for the next 4 seasons, and there is no guarantee that trading for him will improve our team. There are players who are younger, more productive, and make half as much out there, it would make a lot more sense to go after one of them.
Um. No. There are very few players out there who are as productive as Carter, much less even more productive. And there are none out there who make half as much (rookie contracts excluded, obviously)
What, did you just copy/paste that from Wikipedia? For that matter, did you even read it before you pasted it on here? For the record, I don't think giving up your starting spot in an all-star game to the greatest player to have played the game of basketball for his final start is a bad thing.
Well just throwing some names out there, not saying we should go and get them but most of these names we have the same chance of getting as Carter. If you want to talk about statistics Carter: born January 26, 1977, Avg 22pts, 6 rebs, Making 15.6 million with 1 million increase perseason for the next 4 seasons Ron Artest: 2 years younger then VC, avg about 21pts, 6 rbs, and will make around the 8-9 million dollar range. Corey Maggette: 2 years younger, avg 22pts 6 rbs, will be making around the 8-9 mil range. Mike Miller: 3 years younger, avg 16pts, 6 rbs, making 9 million for the next 2 seasons Gearld Wallace: 5 years younger, avg 19.5 pts, 6 rbs, making 9-10 range for the next 4 years Joe Johnson: 4 years younger, avg 20pts, 4 rebs, making 14mil for the next 2 seasons. And then there are players like Josh Smith and Andrea Igudala who are almost 8 years younger, Steven Jackson:1 year younger, avg 20pts, 4 rebs, making 7 million dollars a year I am not saying Carter even at 32 can't help this team, but why do you want to pay his 16+million per year for the next 4 years, when you are just as likely to get some of these other players. Yao makes 16million a year, and his contract runs out a year before Carters does. If you are willing to give up that much for a 32 year old Vince then wouldn't it be smarter to go for some of these other guys for less?
Yes, it's from Wikipedia. My mistake. 1) Carter didn't relinquish the spot UNTIL the very last second which I think obviously shows something about his character. He came under fire for that. 2) Your point is irrelevant. Fact is he is known for being lazy, etc. which is why I showed that just because you get a lot of money and you're Vince Carter, doesn't mean you'd necessarily be good for the team or deserving of that money, which is the whole point of contention.
Jannero Pargo should be the free agent that Rockets should pursue, look at his performance in the playoffs.... he actually would be a upgrade of Rafel Alston. How about we trade Rafel Alston, Bobby Jackson, Luther Head and chuck hayes for Vince Carter, Ron Artest, or Mike Miller...... Jannero Pargo / Arron Brooks Tmac / Steve Francis Shane Battier/ VC,Ronron,MM/ Steve Novak Luis Scola / Carl Landry / Joey Dorsey Yao Ming / Deke / Lorden Woods A total of 13 players, with one of them on a injury list... so 12 active players roster for 2009... thoughts?
