While I will stand by that the Epic Beard Man was justified in defending himself I don't think he is a hero and find it troubling that people seem to be making him out to be one. I disagree with Durvasa's specific take regarding the fight itself but he is correct that EBM behavior, initially arguing with the other guy over a misunderstanding, contributed to the fight.
remember when elton john redid candle in the wind for princess di? i think nickleback should redo hero for EBG. norma jean = englands rose spiderman = EBG <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/etp8L9pbqeM&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/etp8L9pbqeM&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
insofar as this wasn't what happened in that video - why is it relevant? What happened in the video is that an apparently mentally deranged guy and another guy, apparently not as deranged, mutually provoked/instigated/escalated a fight with each other on a bus. Obviously this type of behavior on either part is illegal and generally not tolerated in the society that we live in. End of story. Not sure why this thread is so long.
I will deny it, because I never said it and it is not what my words imply. If I thought otherwise, I would not have blamed Tyrone for throwing the first punch. He would not be morally responsible if he did not have free will. He behaved like a thug, and he should be punished. Sure. But this is semantics. When I said "its a separate thing", I meant they are not independent. Precisely. Uh huh. "More to blame". Sure. No blame whatsoever to the other guy for it becoming violent? No. Don't know who said the violence was excused. Not I. See Bill/gold watch analogy from a few pages back. Won't repeat it here. Never argued the self-defense was excessive either.
I really don't take much issue with EBM's initial behavior. The other guy was being a jerk, and he was basically just saying, "Why are you being hostile? Don't try to be at tough guy with me." I get it. But when they had separated, the other guy was sitting down, and EBM was walking the other direction, just let it go. Or if the other guy is walking away from you, just let it go.
durvasa, basically I don't see where we disagree much. I would say you are taking EBM too seriously when you say he should just let it go. Considering his obvious mental state if you have watched the follow-up videos, I am actually surprised that he didn't kill the guy immediately, but walked up to the front of the bus at first. He is obviously not a hero, but a man who needs help. Well, at least I think both these guys will make some money from this. Plus, they entertained many people. So I guess everyone's a winner here .
You're right. And I did acknowledge way back that the guy is not mentally there, so it is understandable why he behaved the way he did. It is, I think, unfair for me to fault him as a person. I don't think he's a bad guy (the subsequent videos show him to be a very sympathetic figure). It is the behavior, potentially dangerous not just to himself but also those around him, that I took issue with.
I don't know what's funnier, the video or the fact that this thread has spun off a ridiculously long drawn out debate. Do we really need to take everything seriously? A crazy 67 year old man beats up a dumb 50 year old. Can't we just laugh at that?
I've had my disagreements with durvasa before regarding in-depth quantitative statistics and the methodology behind them vis-a-vis basketball, but I respect the fact that he is defending his position in a calm, rational manner without resorting to name-calling and other forms of propaganda and continues to do so. I found myself in a similar position in the D&D in a thread a while back so I can understand where he is coming from and appreciate how he's handled himself.
Haha....After seeing all the interviews, the guy is completely insane and delusional. I'm honestly surprised he was able to bring himself to walk away from the situation.
Don't know if this has been posted yet, but here's Michael side of the story. Sorry if it has been posted. <object width="560" height="340"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/4I1r3dhMUO4&hl=en_US&fs=1&"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><param name="allowscriptaccess" value="always"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/4I1r3dhMUO4&hl=en_US&fs=1&" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowscriptaccess="always" allowfullscreen="true" width="560" height="340"></embed></object> He admits he was drunk and knew he would get his butt whooped. lol
So, in the end, it was just a drunk guy picking a fight with a crazy guy. It still isn't clear what sort of criminal record he has, but obviously he isn't what Tom claimed him to be.
How could this topic possibly be worth debating for this long? Is it not time to agree to disagree on whatever is still being discussed and move on?
