Have any of you guys ever sat down one-on-one with CD???? Obviously none of us have. When it comes down to basketball conversation, with a prospective coach, I'm sure CD handles himself quite well. All we see of CD is in front of microphones where he knows any and every word he leaks, will be broken down and picked apart in places like this. It's double speak, from both ends. None of us know what went on between CD and Van Gundy. Like I've said, CD's job is done, and from the sounds of it, he impressed the hell out of Van Gundy. But this organization speaks for itself. The finger is pointed at Les if this doesn't go through. It's now down to the $$$$$.
If this truly is/was the most coveted job in the NBA, why should it always come down, then, to a question of $$$$? I can understand since it would be a major move for him that he would have to carefully examine if Houston is the right place for him. But if the only thing holding this deal up is whether he wants a s***load of money or a f***ing s***load of money, then screw it...bring on Dunleavey.
Do yo really believe this or are you just trying to get a reaction. Because if you believe that anyone but Les is calling the shots you are not very bright. If CD really had any kind of input we would not be looking for a coach today because in his mind we already had the best available coach for the Rockets, Rudy T.
You're not very bright if you don't realize that the point man on the coaching search is Carroll Dawson, that it is his job to take the consensus best available job and get the best available candidate to fill it. I'm not talking about decisionmaking, I"m talking about execution. And he's not doing it. Lament rudy's firing all you want, but he wasn't getting the job done, and neither is Carroll, and they were, and should be held accountable.
Again I have to ask do you really believe this? Are you naive to believe if CD holds the door open for Van Gundy, buys him some expensive hookers, a case of vintage Don Perignon and a box of Havana Ambassadors, that's going to make a difference. The bottom line is and always has been show me the money. It was the same story with Larry Brown. The rockets can have any coach they want if they raise the stakes. Van Gundy has already said he respects CD, he loves the city and the team. But show me the money is his number one priority. The Wizards are offering more and if the Rockets want VG they will have to show him the money. And that is all Les's decision. So if you think VG is the coach to lead the Rockets to the promise land (I don't, Larry Brown okay Dunleavy maybe not VG), and we don't hire him, No one is to blame but Les. Do you understand?
Oh, yeah, I forgot that Les is the second coming of Donald Sterling and that it is well nigh impossible for Houston Rockets General Manager Carroll Dawson to not get publicly negged by one, and maybe two head coaches in an embarassing public spectacle. The blame Les scenario or the "blameless" scenario is wonderful, it's in faact the reverse of the "blame the players" scenario that the pro-Rudy apologists used. "It's not Rudy's fault, it's the players, Steve showed a lack of leadership, blah blah blah" (notwithstanding the fact that Rudy and Carroll hand picked the players, of course) I guess it proves that when you're in the Rockets front office or coach, **** can roll both uphill and downhilll.
Classic case of the pot calling the kettle black on this one. Les calls all the shots. End of discussion.
Why do you insist on confusing the issue with a bunch of pointless retoric,(blah,blah,blah). This conversation is not about Rudy. It is about money for Van Gundy as it was for LB. If you don't like CD that is fine but he is not the one signing the check and he didn't refuse to give Larry Brown what he wanted and so far he is not offering Van Gundy what he wants. The one who pays the most gets the coach. Do you understand?
Read the posts buddy, he took a shot at me calling me "not very bright", I answered the same way. If you want to compare SAT scores or resumes we can reach a resolution on that if youwant. Yes, les does call the shots. And Carrol is the man who shoots the gun, or whatever, and he's misssing.
Well, I'm not sure what your definition of pointless rhetoric is, I'm responding to your complacent attitude. And by the way, you made Rudy relevant when you said this And it is not simply a matter of "the one who pays the most gets the coach." or players. If that were the case, how would the Rockets be able to attract Shandon Anderson or Maurice Taylor for low salaries? Do you think that if the CLippers offered rudy a big money contract in 1996 he would have bolted? NBA head coaching jobs are not fungible. Do you understand?
Sam Fisher:- Your vulgarity is unacceptable on this quality Forum. Please 'Clean up your vocabulary'.
Mostly it is. I do agree however that CD and Rudy created an organization that alot of players wanted to be a part of. But in the end they were willing to take less to play for the Rockets, but not millions. This is my last reply and I will agree to disagree with you on all other points. I apologize if I offended you by calling you not so bright. FUNGIBLE - Something that is exchangeable or substitutable. Often used in the plural.
Well, maybe Les should give Carroll a better gun with a more precise aim. How do you expect to shoot a target like Larry Brown or Van Gundy with a squirt gun given to him by the owner? Congrats on your SAT.
You guys crack me up. You sound like a bunch of Jr. High School kids. And everyone knows that SAT scores don't prove anything, just ask any athlete.
Would any of you take a job in a different city with a whole lot of pressure (even if the money was great) without careful consideration? I don't think JVG would either. This is a big decision for him with a lot on the line for him and for the Rockets. He really needs to think this through. Also, if you have ever negotiated you know you are NOT supposed to act eager to close the deal. If you do, you will get taken advantage of. JVG might very well want the job like nothing else in the world but if he's a smart business man, he'll act like he's only sort-of interested. Who knows? If he acts disinterested the Rockets may sweeten the pot. For example, this whole Wizards thing can totally play into JVG's hands. By not acting too interested in Houston (i.e. Gushing over the job) and with the Wizard's offer, JVG can probably get a little more then what was/is originally on the table.
Uhh, let's see the chron said that VG was expected to be offered around 4 large a year for 4 or 5 years. Squirt gun? Right.
Yetti: You are hilarious. Sam and Faos: I like you both. I so wish you wouldn't fight. The decision has nothing to do with CD. Everyone, including JVG, knows Houston's a better fit teamwise. If he doesn't sign here it'll be about money or quality of life (east coast preference for his family). I was pissed about the Brown thing and the role money played. But this is a different situation. If what's been reported about Washington is true, Les can't do anything about it and CD can't either. I don't think anyone here expects Les to counter with 2% (or more) ownership. If Washington's crazy enough to offer that plus a huge salary, I won't fault VG for taking it and I won't fault Les or CD for blowing it. Kind of crazy how they've gushed all over him in the media without knowing they had a deal, and it'll be damn awkward after, but no one could have seen this insane Washington offer coming.
Let's break down the economics of both hypothetical offers, btw. Rockets 4 yrs for 16-20 m, let's call it an even 18m Wizards, 5 yrs for 35m + ownership. Well 7m/yr is better than 4.5 m/yr right? so wizards is a no brainer. Not so fast, when was the last time a coach lasted in Washington for 5 years? Dick Motta back in the late 70's? It's a revolving door for coaches and a mess of a franchise. I would say that JVG lasts 2-3 years there tops, which would make him probably the longest lasting coach in the past 20 years. Let's give him a 25% chance of finishing all 5 collecting all 35 m, so the wiz offer is worth about 9m. Now the 2% ownership stake is nice, but I don't know enough about how it's given to him to figure out how much he will realize off of it or whether he has to sell it when he quits or what, so let's make it one or 2 m more. That makes the Wiz offer worth about 11 m. The rockets' offer? The Rockets are a much different team and organization than the moribund Wizards, this years hiccups notwithstanding, and his chances of finishing out the 4 years are pretty high, I'd make it 60%, but that's just a guess. So 60% of 18.5m = about 10m. So the Wiz offer is worth slightly more in the end. But my point is that there is more to this calculus than just contract years and money.
