Ottoman's post covers most of what I wanted to say. The rest is this: Let's make two assumptions (relatively close to truth): Half of Texans have easy access to a gun (42% of households nationwide have guns) and 98% of CHL holders have access to a easy access to a gun (I'm sure there are some that have a CHL and no gun). Ignoring all other conditions, that means that CHL holders are arrested for weapon-related crimes at a rate 15% lower than the general population who have easy access to a gun. (If you use 42%, it's 19% lower.)
I don't remember seeing any guns while at school. I did see plenty of fights with meathead frat guys etc. The thought of mixing in guns is more than scary. I really can't believe that people are arguing for 19 year old kids to be running around armed on college campuses. It is just insane. If that was going on I would rather not even try to get an education. Hand guns plus this, sounds great...
What exactly are you arguing? That people under 21 should nopt carry handguns? Ok i agree That drunk people should not carry handguns? OK I agree. Do you have any other points to make or what? These things are already illegal.
Thats my point. People have different views now. Self defense seems to be moving away from being correct from a moral point of view. If you argue to me I don;t have the right to self defense than that will just be a difference of opinion.
TYou have no reason why they should not be allowed on campus. When pressed for one you said we want drunken 19 year olds to have guns. We told you that is not the case. I guess my point is to tell us a real reason why people with CHL's should not be allowed to carry their guns on campus.
Again I don't want to sound like an internet tough guy and I've never been in a situation like that and honestly don't know what I would do in a situation like that. That said given a situation like that if I'm in a classroom and someone bust in shooting my reaction will probably depend on where I am at in the classroom. Most likely my first step is to hit the deck. At that point I'm going to look to try to crawl out towards the door or windows keeping out of sight of the shooter. If I can and the desk aren't locked I'm going to try to push or kick them at the shooter to distract him or injur him to be able to make my getaway. If I'm near enough to the shooter and haven't been hit right away, within 10 to 5 feet, I'm going to try to take him out using my hands, books, pens scissors, laptops or any other hard or sharp object. The problems with using a gun are that one I have to have it with me and since a gun is fairly heavy and bulky its not like people will always be carrying one. Two, is drawing it which since hip holsters aren't the norm anymore we don't quick draw. Three, releasing the safety and four, aiming and finally firing. The problem with those is that even trained individuals aren't able to execute those rapidly and under stress. I saw a demonstration with cops who had waterguns in hip holsters. They put someone 20 feet away with a rubber knife. In every single instance the person with the knife got to the cop before they could get a shot off. What you're counting on is civillians to be able pull out their guns under duress and get off shots in a crowded and chaotic situation. I see a lot more threat to other civillians in such a situation than to the shooter.
19 year olds will have access to guns if they have friends/roommates etc who are 21 and have guns. Most 21 year old are idiots. Last Fall I went to New Orleans for my little bro's 22 year old buddies for his bachelor party. They are decent kids and all but come on! I could not imagine these guys with guns. I do not want to be around any 21 year olds with guns in a college culture. It's a recipe for disaster.
To me, you are the type of person that will not wait for someone to pick you while you cower in a corner. IMO, Your actions may save lives. As for the bulky guns, you would really be suprised on how small they are nowadays. A Glock 27 can carry 10 rounds and shoot a .40 round (Federal HST) that will flower out to the size of a quarter. There is no need for a quick draw. Unless you are being targeted. First order of business is to find cover. Then draw. Glock do not have a safety to fiddle with...just point and click. You can never predict how one will react in that situation, but that is why I go to the range and practice practice practice. As for the knife handler charging the police officer, you are correct. A knife handler can cover ground in a short amount of time. I have seen the video. I've been looking for someone local(Brownsville) that instructs in Krav Maga, but have had no luck, but in any SHTF situation, I would rather be with my Glock than without.
"hip" holster are the norm. Usually IWB holsters. I think your reasoning of what to do is fine but you cannot really argue time when you say you would probably try to arm yourself with a sharp object. Also if you remember our old thread my handgun does not have a safety. And these crazy senario's really don;t go anywhere. You are not familar with guns personally. You would thus feel more comfortable without one. I feel more comfortable WITH one because I have been around them my whole life. A note about the 20 foot knife thing. That demo was done with basic cops not really expertly trained guys. And the entire purpose is to release cops from shooting people with knives who are within 20 feet of them.. I do agree with your very first point that a gun at home is totally useless when you are at school.
As was mentioned in another thread, wouldn't it be just better to have a few more security officers on campus? Not only would they able to stem a situation like this but also stop more crimes (and perhaps deter a few). Id much rather have them shooting a weapon than some 21 year old engineering student.
How many of these guys would pay the at least $100 dollars for the class, the $140.00 for the license, sit in a CHL class for 8 hours, and pass a shooting skills test? additionally, from DPS... A: The concealed handgun law sets out a number of qualifications that must be met. Your application packet will list them in detail. For example, you must be a legal resident of Texas and you must be qualified to purchase a handgun under all state and federal laws. A number of factors may disqualify you from obtaining a license, such as: felony convictions and some misdemeanor convictions, including charges that resulted in probation or deferred adjudication, pending criminal charges chemical or alcohol dependency, certain types of psychological diagnoses, protective or restraining orders, defaults on taxes, governmental fees, student loans or child support.
I've been to Va tech and I can tell you that the social life there - as in a lot of colleges - consists of drinking as much Milwaukee's Best and Natural Lite until you lose control of all bodily functions. I don't know if adding guns (and sadly, now, paranoia) to that equation is going to be the kind of place where I'd want to go to school
