I use punk as broad term that even encompasses indie rock, since all fo the foundign fathers of the genre were grown up punks. While punk did die as a marketing tool, it never, ever went way. I agree with you on the Texas punk front. I think Texas produced the most interesting underground music of the early 80's. Also. some opinions are more valid than others.
Butthole Surfers, Jesus Lizard and the like-minded heavy, abbrasive bands Rites of Spring and the whole DC Revolution Summer scene. the whole New Zealand noise/pop scene Dinosaur Jr and the whole guiitar rock oriented Boston scene the twee/sarah records scene in the UK/birth of indie pop the crass collective anarachist/peace punk scene the crossover/thrash scene the NYC hardcore scene west coast straight edge hardcore scene of the late 80's i can go on and on. What more can we possibly learn about the UK77 and CBGB's scenes?
The Jam did not have a crappy era. XTC didn't have a crappy era but had rollercoaster rides throughout their albums. I like pretty much all of them, but some were better than others. The best of the West coast STraight edge hardcore was over by '85. Butthole surfers definitely have some stuff that would qualify but a lot of their stuff was hard edged industrial at that period as well.
what are you talking about? the west coast straight edge scene didn't even start until around 88 and the Butthole Surfer's released Locust Abortion Technician in like 87.
Minor Threat was from Washington DC. I'm talking about the whole Revelation record west coast scene on the late 80's and early 90's. A lot of it ties intot he NYHC scene. Bands like Chain of Strength, Bold, Judge, etc.
and while I do think msot of the 88 style hardcore hardcore stuff is horrible, there is no denying it's impact. fallout boy is arguably on of the most popular bands in the world right now, and that scene directly influenced them.
huge david berman fan. "in 27 year yeards i've drank 50,000 beers, and they just wash against me like the sea into a pier."
postcard ruled. i almost put c86 in my list, but thought i had expended far enough. and speaking of postcard, the last roddy frame solo album was incredible.
and i also think sarah had more interesting bands in terms of quantity. the best postcard bands were way better than the best sarah bands though.
zantabak, you have a very expansive definition of what you consider to be "punk" music. Many of the bands you listed don't qualify, IMHO, simply because "punk" was dead by then. To me, "punk" and "hardcore" are two completely different genres of music. They have similarities, but they are not identical.
Minor Threat was a DC band but there is no doubt that they were part of the straight edge scene. And in LA it started in the early 80's. Contemporaries of suicidal tendencies, Fear, Circle Jerks, before they turned heavy metal which happened around the same time you claim the straight edge scene was just starting. The straight edge scene started just after that scene, and was going on at the same time. There was part of that scene that carried on during the late 80's. As for the Jam, you think The Gift, Sound Effects and Settings Sons sucked? It may not have been the band's best as far as the whole album, but it is far from sucking. Some of the best material the band every put out was on those albums. Locust Abortion Technician was one of the Butthole Surfers best albums. There is no doubt about it. But they were still headed more into hardcore/industrial hybrid at that time. Actually they kind of have their own niche which only brushes up against other scenes, so they are hard to classify.
the whole youth crew/straight edge hardcore scene is called 88 hardcore for a reason. IT HAPPENED IN 1988. Minor Threat merely had a song caled Straight Edget that a later scene used to label themselves. There was no widespread straight edghardcore scene in 1981. I assure you. The early 80's LA hardcore scene was made up of bands like Black FLag, Suicidal, and Circle Jerks like you mentioned. However, all of those bands were ALL ABOUT excessive drug and alcohol use. The whole 88/Youth Crew/Revelation scene was MUCH different. The musical was different, too. It was less monotonous than the 84 punk, and had tons of breakdowns from their metal influences.
and yes, i think the gift sucks compared to earlier jam records. they were also playing several what would become Style Council songs live at the end.
I understand that the straight edge movement was different than the original hardcore movement. I was merely stating that they were contemporaries and did have people who bounced back and forth between the scenes.
