I've never bought into the battier hype. He really is not THAT good at defense. Kobe and other star players seem to still score at will on him. He takes a charge a game, but he also gets called for blocking fouls alot because he tries to take charges too much. So it kind of cancels out. He is a mediocre three point shooter, 30th in the nba last year. He has no offense or offensive confidence in anything besides the 3 pt shot. Coaches love him for the same reason they love Ryan Bowen, he is a hustle guy and he listens to the coach. His perceived value is much much higher than his real value, this is why we really need to trade him.
I'm not sure whether quoting off JVG is fashionable or not these days, but I'm gonna try anyway... If anyone has a problem with Battier, then he has a problem
Seems pretty clear to me right now that the great defense the Rockets had last season had a lot more to do with Van Gundy and his system than Battier (and Hayes). They are clearly not the all-world defensive stoppers that many claim they are. Just two good (not great) defensive players that benefitted greatly from Van Gundy’s system last season. I would say trade Battier, but his trade value is probably at an all-time low.
The problem is NOT with Rafer alone. All the guards are performing very bad. What did the line up tell you last night in the 4th Q where Head took the 1 position, to me it tells me that RA recognized the ineffectiveness of our guards so he tried a shocker combo on the floor. Bonzi is making bad decisions, taking 3s and jumpshots. That is not his game. As for Tmac, we can't go farther if he continues to rely on his jumpshot. Yao should not take the last shot because all teams have defensivie strategies against Yao. RA should realize that too.
Wasn’t Battier brought in to be our “glue-guy” on the defensive end? The guy that holds our defense together (with his "glue"), leads us on the defensive end, and inspires the rest of the team to play defense with his hustle. So if our defense looks like crap, shouldn’t he take a lot of the blame?
There's some truth to the criticisms Battier is getting in this thread. But I don't agree with any of this. Battier isn't a great one on one defensive stopper. That's not his strength. He's really a big SF, so he's going to be outquicked trying to defend guys like Kobe, Wade, and Redd. Responsibility for points he gives up on those players in one on one situation should also be shared by Tracy. But Battier is a terrific team defender. That may not be obvious if you're just watching the ball when the team plays defense, but it makes a big difference. The charge/block thing doesn't cancel eachother out. Most of those blocking calls he gets called for would be easy baskets or fouls if another player was in there. His rotations to protect the basket can also deter penetration, which doesn't register in any way as a turnover but helps the defense. As for 3-point shooting, I don't know where you're getting that number. Amongst players who attempted at least 80 3 point shots last year, he was 10th in makes and 14th in percentage. He's one of only a handful of players who were top 15 in both.
I've never been "up in the air" or "on the fence" about Battier. Bad trade from Minute 1. When you have the slowest Center in the league, you don't surround him with Battier and Hayes...good team defenders, mediocre 1on1 defenders. Van Gundy could "hide" them, no one else can. When you have 2 star players with a history of injury, you don't stockpile role players with little to no upside. When the NBA is trying to increase scoring and excitement, when the NBA is allowing sumo wrestling in the paint and calling a foul for breathing on a perimeter offensive player, you don't stockpile one-dimensional spot up shooters. When every team in the league is spreading the floor to drive and kick, it's unwise field a starting 5 with one person capable of doing it. When the Spurs are the template, (not mine...but probably the majority of this board), it's unwise to field a team of players who can't push tempo or finish strong. Battier's primary transition move is to run to the short corner arc. The best move Morey could BUT WON'T make is to trade Battier and parts for ANY PG who is essentially a one-man fastbreak. Hell, at this point I'm so tired of slow Rockets. I'd settle for Brooks and let him suffer like Parker did in his first season. (For the record, I hated the Brooks drafting). Too many slow Rockets in a fast league. Battier being 1 of many.
Agreed, because Battier would be that great role player on a team that is already has those athletes. Like Phoenix. I'd love to keep Battier and get that great PG some other way, but that ain't possible. Battier may be the only move-able piece. The problem is that there are no good PGs out there you can get. Raymond Felton would be cool, but no way the Bobcats trade him. Same with Jose Calderon. Unless the Raps think he is un-signable, or start to tank (and 6-6 is great in the East), why would they trade him for a Luther Head or someone similar? Earl Watson is strong a/to guy, but can't shoot. Are the Knicks finally tired of Jamal Crawford yet? He's a horrible shooter but crazy athletic still. Louis Williams...why would Philly trade this cheap up and comer? Not many choices. The best I can think of is some combination of Shane/Rafer/other for Maggette/Cassell. The Clippers would just suck thereafter, but let's be honest, they're not going to make the playoffs. They could use another high lotto pick for next year when Brand is fully healthy again. If we throw in our first round pick, that'll give them 2 next offseason, Rafer can at least run a team, and Battier can be a good defender. what else is there really? I guess if I had to choose 1 relatively unattainable PG to try for, it'd be Calderon. He's still relatively young, but experienced overseas, and his NBA stats keep getting better, and he's a good FG % shooter, which it doesn't seem like this team has had in the backcourt for decades. the problem, though, is that he's still on his rookie salary, so its hard to return value to the Raps. Maybe #1 - Battier for Calderon and Humphries. then #2 - Rafer/Snyder for Donyell Marshall/draft pick ??
I've seen him do that before, now that you've reminded me. Why in the hell does he do it? Why doesn't he go to the hole and either score or draw the foul? Are his handles that bad? I don't think so.
BS. when Bowen is sucking it up like Shane has been, getting torched and missing the corner 3, the Spurs yank his ass out and put Barry, Finley, or Ginobili in his spot. Thing is, it's not often that Bowen sucks as hard as Shane has been latley. Shane IS a part of the problem. We only expect a few things from him, and he's not coming through on them. Hayes and Rafer are playing pretty much how we expected. If you think they are the problem, the you have to face the fact that the real issue is with the coach that insists on playing them.
At this point, I believe Hayes is more important to the team as a "glue" guy. The fact is that this team often does extremely well without Chuck scoring buckets but it seems like when we lose you can almost always look at the box score and see that Shane had a bad night offensively. This team does not need consistent offense from Chuck but it does need it from Shane if he is going to get big minutes. And I think most of us agree that if we had a PG who could shoot straight the Shane Battier issue and/or the Chuck Hayes issue would not exist.
I think you missed the root of the problem, we expect too little from shane to begin with, and the fact that he can't even deliver on that little bit is an absolute travesty.
When you said "last shot", did you mean the last shot in a game? Yao usually does not play such a role, does he?
