I also saw the movie last Friday and while the bias was clear, there was a big departure from other Michael Moore films, namely that he let the video clips do the talking in large part. Granted, you have a lot of editorial license when you're boiling down thousands of hours of film into 2 hours, but still some things speak for themselves. I wouldn't necessarily call it educational or informative, but it was definitely entertaining and thought provoking... Well worth the price of a ticket.
I was thinking about that fact today on the way to work to be honest. In my personal opinion, the Bush Administration is paying for the "sins" of the Republicans going after William Jefferson Clinton to such extremes during the Lewinsky scandal. The way that alot of Democrats are rallying behind this movie as a key piece to their 2004 Campaign to elect John Forbes Kerry is really odd though. _______________________________________________________ June 24, 2004, 9:08 a.m. Democrats and the Fahrenheit 9/11 Trap Do they endorse Michael Moore’s kookiness? Democratic National Committee chairman Terry McAuliffe says he believes radical filmmaker Michael Moore's assertion that the United States went to war in Afghanistan not to avenge the terrorist attacks of September 11 but instead to assure that the Unocal Corporation could build a natural gas pipeline across Afghanistan for the financial benefit of Vice President Dick Cheney and former Enron chief Kenneth Lay. McAuliffe and a number of other prominent Democrats attended a screening of Moore's new documentary, Fahrenheit 9/11, at the Uptown Theatre in Washington Wednesday night. McAuliffe called the film "very powerful, much more powerful than I thought it would be." When asked by National Review Online if he believed Moore's account of the war in Afghanistan, McAuliffe said, " I believe it after seeing that." The DNC chairman added that he had not heard of the idea before seeing the movie, but said he would "check it out myself and look at it, but there are a lot of interesting facts that he [Moore] brought out today that none of us knew about." A short time later, McAuliffe was asked by CNN, "Do you think the movie was essentially fair and factually based?" "I do," McAuliffe said. "I think anyone who goes to see this movie will come out en masse and vote for John Kerry. Clearly the movie makes it clear that George Bush is not fit to be president of this country." Fahrenheit 9/11 devotes a significant amount of time to a fantastical theory that the war in Afghanistan was not part of a wide-ranging U.S. retaliation for the terrorist attacks of September 11, but was in fact undertaken for the financial benefit of Texas oil interests, specifically the vice president and Kenneth Lay. Narrating the movie, Moore briefly considers the administration's stated reason for the war and then asks, Was the war in Afghanistan really about something else? Perhaps the answer was in Houston, Texas. In 1997, while George W. Bush was governor of Texas, a delegation of Taliban leaders from Afghanistan flew to Houston to meet with Unocal executives to discuss the building of a pipeline through Afghanistan bringing natural gas from the Caspian Sea. And who got a Caspian Sea drilling contract the same day Unocal signed the pipeline deal? A company headed by a man named Dick Cheney. Halliburton. And who else stood to benefit from the pipeline? Bush's number one campaign contributor, Kenneth Lay, and the good people of Enron. That was not all, Moore says in the film. "When the invasion of Afghanistan was complete, we installed its new president, Hamid Karzai," the narration continues. "Who was Hamid Karzai? He was a former adviser to Unocal." The Afghan pipeline scenario has bounced around among conspiracy theorists of the fringe Left, but Fahrenheit 9/11 is the first expression of the idea likely to reach millions of Americans. For the record, Unocal was involved in bidding for a pipeline in the mid-1990s but dropped the project in late 1998. According to an Associated Press report from the time, "Unocal Corp. withdrew from a consortium planning to build a pipeline across Afghanistan, saying low oil prices and turmoil in the Central Asian nation have made the project too risky." The Afghanistan segment of the film is one of a grab bag of anti-Bush themes in Fahrenheit 9/11. To name a few: The film suggests that when the president was a young man, his (failed) oil-exploration company was supported by the family of Osama bin Laden. The film attacks the president's sale of stock in Harken Energy, it attacks his Air National Guard record, it attacks his conduct during the Florida recount, it attacks his vacation habits, it attacks his immediate reaction to the September 11 attacks, it attacks his long-term reaction to the September 11 attacks, and, of course, it attacks the war in Iraq, which Moore suggests was undertaken for the financial benefit of the Halliburton Corporation. When the father of a soldier killed in Iraq speaks of his son's death, he asks plaintively, "And for what?" At that point, the movie quickly cuts to a clip from a promotional film for Halliburton. The Washington screening was filled with Democratic politicians and activists. In remarks before the film, Miramax Pictures head Harvey Weinstein praised former Clinton White House social secretary Capricia Marshall, who organized the screening, for doing "an incredible job of, you know, bringing together such a bipartisan audience." When the audience laughed, Weinstein joked that the film would provide the crowd a "truly interactive experience while watching the movie trying to guess which person in your row is the undercover member of the RNC." In addition to McAuliffe, other Democrats at the Washington screening included Senate Minority Leader Tom Daschle, Iowa Sen. Tom Harkin, Montana Sen. Max Baucus, South Carolina Sen. Ernest Hollings, Michigan Sen. Debbie Stabenow, Florida Sen. Bill Nelson, New York Rep. Charles Rangel, Washington Rep. Jim McDermott, and others. Harkin told the Associated Press that all Americans should see the film. "It's important for the American people to understand what has gone on before, what led us to this point, and to see it sort of in this unvarnished presentation by Michael Moore." Since Fahrenheit 9/11 is so heavily identified with Democratic causes, it seems likely that a number of Democratic leaders, possibly including presidential candidate John Kerry, will be asked whether they endorse the conclusions of the movie. That could present a dilemma. To do so would mean associating with some of the least credible theories of the radical Left, while declining to do so would tend to undermine Moore's status as an anti-Bush hero. Meanwhile, Moore himself, who has often claimed that he had no political motive in making the film, seems to be changing his position. In May, when he spoke to reporters after winning the Palme d'Or at the Cannes Film Festival, Moore said, "I did not set out to make a political film.... The art of this, the cinema, comes before the politics." Last night, however, speaking to a crowd gathered on the sidewalk outside the Uptown Theatre after the showing, Moore appeared to have another message. "We're all in the same boat and we all have a job to do," he told fans. "And if we do it, this country will be back in the hands of the majority." http://www.nationalreview.com/york/york200406240908.asp
Of course, I'm sure that there aren't any members here who are Republican, or Democrat for that matter, members of Congress.
Well it would be very odd if the half the people in the country who never really supported the war until overcome by the constant lying of the Bu****es and the natural desire to back their children sent to Itraq, would not support this movie.
That's funny. I mentioned this earlier in the thread but I'll do it again. The people Moore hired were my theater company, Infernal Bridegroom. They weren't having a barbeque and they weren't drinking beer; they were dressed as cheerleaders. And the show wasn't a documentary nor was it called the "Angry" Truth. It was the Awful Truth and it was satire. Here's the real story. It's a pretty good read: http://houstonpress.com/issues/2000-02-03/news.html Stand Up and Holler A Huntsville execution draws a strange crowd BY LAUREN KERN lauren.kern@houstonpress.com Jay Martel wandered through the pro-death-penalty crowd outside the Huntsville prison on the night of January 24 without arousing suspicion. Wearing blue jeans, a baseball cap and a windbreaker that looked a lot like the state flag, he fit right in. He offered cans of ginger ale, passed out foam fingers and praised George W. Bush. If there had been a baby, you can bet he would have kissed it. If there had been cheerleaders, which there were, you can bet he wasn't surprised. The victims' rights group Justice for All was already more boisterous than normal on this particular night at death row because of the man who was being executed. Billy Hughes Jr. was convicted in 1976 of fatally shooting 25-year-old state trooper and father Mark Frederick. But Hughes, who was wanted for credit card theft when Frederick pulled him over, claimed he had merely returned fire when the officers shot at him as he reached for his wallet, and he managed to avoid his death sentence for 24 years by launching numerous appeals. While the cop killer "abused the system," he also became a college graduate (with two degrees in religion), a paralegal, an anti-death-penalty lobbyist, a well-known cartoonist and, at least according to the Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals, a humanitarian. Needless to say, the anti-death-penalty camp was a little sadder than normal to see a "reformed" man die. Beyond that, it was business as usual at the Walls Unit. Justice for All stood at the left end of the police line, holding signs that said, "No Murder Equals No Execution." The Texas Coalition to Abolish the Death Penalty stood at the right end of the same yellow tape, forming a circle and singing "We Shall Overcome." Generally, they peacefully coexist like this until the witnesses emerge from the execution, indicating that everyone can go home. They have the routine down pat: There were seven executions in just over two weeks last month; there have been 119 since George W. took office. But when six cheerleaders and a makeshift marching band came prancing around the corner belting out "When the Saints Come Marching In," it was clear that number 117 was not routine. In pigtails, letter sweaters and red-pleated skirts, the fresh-faced drill team chanted, "We are Texas" and "Go, George, Go." As the antis struggled to maintain their circle vigil, the pros turned into fans at a football game. Fire up, fire up Fire up, and up And up and up and up! They grinned, cheered and waved their foam fingers. Two bits, four bits, six bits, a dollar All for the death penalty stand up and holler! They were already standing, but they sure hollered. P, P-O, P-O-W-E-R We've got power Woo! Killing power! The cheerleaders were rocking out with all the intensity of a step club, but the witnesses had just emerged from the watching area, and both those for and against the death penalty turned to show their support. Execute, execute, sis, boom, bah Lethal injection, rah, rah, rah! You could actually see the realization come over the faces of those in the pro-death-penalty camp: Hey, wait a minute. These death row cheerleaders aren't on our side after all. Florida oranges, Texas cactus We kill convicts just for practice! That did it. Rick Lemmon, a man who has lost both his twin brother and only son to murder, shouted back through a megaphone: "We have never killed anybody for practiceS<caron>.Y'all don't forget the victim here." Kill 'em to the left Kill 'em to the right Here in Texas We kill 'em every night! David Atwood, president of the Texas Coalition to Abolish the Death Penalty, and Dudley Sharp, vice president of Justice for All, both visibly pissed off, yelled at each other at almost exactly the same time, "Did you do this?" then, "No!" We're number one, can't be number two If you don't agree with us, we'll kill you too Texas is good, Texas is great We kill more than any other state! "Is this what George Bush wants?" asked Atwood. "The cheerleaders?" Sharp put his hand on Atwood's shoulder and said, "Anti-death-penalty and pro-death-penalty strongly believe in what they're doing, and that doesn't include disrespecting the other side." Meanwhile, a bare-chested, body-painted, football-helmeted man ran through the crowd with a "Death" pennant. George, George, he's our man If he can't kill 'em, no one can Who's the best on the killing scene? George Bush, he's a killing machine! He's a killing machine! He's a killing machine! The confusion moved to a nearby parking lot where a scoreboard read: George 117, Jeb 2. (In all fairness, Jeb has only one execution to his credit. Executions have been on hold in Florida since July, when a possible malfunction in "Old Sparky" caused Allen Davis to bleed profusely through his nose as he died.) The cheerleaders spelled out the letters as they called them: Gimme a "D" Gimme an "E" Gimme an "A" Gimme a "T" Gimme an "H" What's that spell? Death! Pardons are for wimps! Pardons are for wimps! "It shouldn't have been this way," Atwood said, shaking his head. "I bet you have Monica Lewinsky sex!" shouted a particularly rabid member of Justice for All. "Desperate times call for desperate measures," muttered Martel. Nah, nah, nah, nah Nah, nah, nah, nah Hey, hey, hey Good-bye After failed attempts to ignore the demonstration, shout down the cheerleaders, circle the band and blame Canada for the fiasco, attentions finally turned to Martel, who seemed to be enjoying all the mischief a little too much. "You did this!" they shouted at him from both sides. "They're not here all the time?" he asked, pushing the limits of playing dumb. They wanted answers: "Are you pro or against the death penalty?" "I'm pro Texas!" he whooped. In a place where affiliations are always clearly delineated, this was as infuriating as the cheerleaders themselves. Even the news media -- well, those outlets that didn't miss the demonstration for days by relying on the AP feed -- didn't know where to put the blame or the credit. Channel 2's Suzanne Boase called it an "anti-death-penalty commercial." No one recognized Martel or his gonzo journalism as trademarks of Michael Moore's popular, populist and political television show, The Awful Truth. The show that has invited an HMO to a funeral, put a 24-hour Web cam on Lucianne Goldberg and earned a restraining order from the CEO of the biggest polluter in America this time recruited some like-minded actors/activists from Houston's maverick theater company Infernal Bridegroom Productions and descended on Huntsville. The piece, which will include a segment shot in Florida, is "a celebration," says Awful Truth producer Dave Hamilton, "of two states who have long embraced the death penalty and turned their ability to kill Americans into a state pastime." The episode is expected to air on Bravo sometime next season. One man at the prison that night did know the score: Billy Hughes. Citizen provocateur and KPFT Prison Show host Ray Hill was a gold mine of information for Moore's segment producers. He was also a longtime friend of Hughes's, even receiving a posthumous, and postage-due, letter from the inmate expressing his love, admiration and gratitude as he headed for his "final sunset." Hill was sworn to secrecy when he was contacted by the show, but during his last visit with Hughes before the execution, he says, "I had to confide in Billy what was going on. My conscience required me to." How did Hughes take the news that his death would be surrounded by satirical fanfare? According to Hill, he said, "Thank you."
Clinton's rough ride I think in large part happened due to the Iran Contra affair. The Democratic Congress did go after Saint *I Must Have Slept Through That Meetting* Ronnie, but the Republicans have since shown them to be a bunch of pikers.
As I recall, "The Awful Truth" ran for a very short time on Bravo not The Comedy Channel. I watched it every chance I got. I can laugh at Moore's antics, but I choke in his turning his stuff into serious political commentary. I guess that's how the anti-Limbaugh contingent feels. I enjoyed "bowling for columbine." I will probably see"Unfair 9/11" sooner or later. I don't mind lining Moore's pockets with a little of my money. His brash POV helps keep America centered. Some of this criticism of Bush's behavior during those 7 minutes makes me want to throw up. He's got an audience full of children; the cameras are rolling. Indiana Jones is a character of fiction. Regardless of what the time clock says, do we know what was known when Card whispered whatever he did into GWB's ear?
I saw the movie saturday and i have to say it was really good. It was ofcourse very biased but the facts, although 1 sided facts, are still facts. In the movie he made both republicans and democrats look like the bad guys. It really connected the dots and made sense. Even though i think some of moore's views are kind of.. odd... it really shed some light on the administration and the personalities of it too. Made me laugh, sad, and angry all at the same time. Even if you hate moore, no matter what its good to know more than u already know so watch the movie and be surprised.
just came back from the movie at lincoln plaza (moore was spotted there on friday) and was surprised by several things. First, I showed up 30 minutes early to a 3:40 show on a monday to find that it was sold out. Never ever have I seen this in my life, a movie sold out midafternoon on a monday. second, contrary to what the far right leaning people on the board have been assuming, most of the theatre was not filled with "crazy liberal Bush-haters". more than half were old people, about 60 and above, white, and dressed conservatively and with seeming significant wealth. although I was against the war from the beginning, despite having voted for Bush (i'm a registered republican), I was not a michael moore fan. Although I like parts of BFC, and agreed with part of his message, as a filmmaker and editor myself, I detested the tricks and editing jobs he did to create illogical causal effects on the audience. I especially did not like him on the camera too much, simply because he disrupted what was going on, and it just obvious when he is acting. This was my feeling entering the movie, to be on the lookout for ways that he would trick the audience. However, although there is some illogical cause and effect, it was much less than BFC, and I was glad that he was much less in the film. With the flip-flopping and waffling that Bush has done, all caught on film of course, Moore did not need to push hard to prove his point. yes, moore does lie a little bit, but i'd rather take the small liar with the right agenda than the big liars with the wrong agenda. i'm hoping that this film is capable of changing people, after all, if people were convinced with the administrations lies, they can just as easily be convinced with a very moving, provocative documentary. if you don't like it, fine, you are free to have your own beliefs. But if you look at the opinion polls on Iraq now, you will now know what it feels like to be in the minority.
Bush new about the first plane crash before he even went into the classroom. While he was in the classroom one of his aids whispered something in his ear that was obviously upsetting. You can tell by the expression on his face and how long he held that expression that there was something seriously wrong. A true leader will think of worst case scenarios. For all Bush knew there wasn’t a third, forth, or even fifth plane that was going to fly into various buildings in the New York area. A true leader does not have to get his aides to convince children that he has more important things to handle at the time. What is more important excusing yourself from a group of school children or making sure that New York city is safe from future attacks? Its called priorities, there are something’s that are more important than others. I hope that my president would know which priority was more important. If you really want to find out how a true leader handles a situation like 9/11, read Rudy Giulliani’s book called Leadership. Rudy took charge of the situation the second he found out about it. Now to the defense of George Bush, Rudy was not in a stressful situation of having 25 kids that were demanding to be read to. We should be very thankful that it wasn’t “Read to Your Child Day” or the NY Firefighters would have had to make tough decisions.
Ignoring the accusations refuted by others - a guy I went to high school with said his fellow students at the university in Huntsville circa 1984-1990 would have parties whenever there was an execution, and make fun of the people protesting the death penalty. edit: he told me this in 1985, so it was very prescient of them to make this up for Moore so far in the past.
SHSU 89' graduate and I can attest to this post! I was one of the one's being made fun of! Another weird story... You knew when someone was being executed in Huntsville because there would be a 1 to 2 minute "brown out" of power during the time of execution. Very weird sitting in class and all of the sudden the lights dimmed for a few minutes. I think since then they started doing the executions at midnight or very early in the morning.
Somebody Moore interviews for the movies says that the US only sent 11,000 ground troops into Afghanistan and that there are more police than that in NYC. Can somebody look that up? Can you really expect them to find Osam with only 11,000 guys?
that resonated with my father, big time. in defense of it, the taliban was displaced from power with that force. but...still no osama.
And still no control of the country either. It's only a small portion of the country currently under our control. It would take a much larger force to stabilize Afghanistan. On the bright side NATO would not send the troops to Iraq that Bush wanted, but they are sending more into Afghanistan. Hopefully the training of IRaqis by NATO will be enough for that situation. I also hope that the new troops from our allies in Afghanistan will help stabilize the country as they enter election time. I was saddened to hear about 6 people being killed for registering to vote in Afghanistan. The enemy is afraid of democracy, I wish had the troops their to make the democratization more stable and less costly in lives.
Don't forget that crazy bunch of warlords from the Northern Alliance... they had a small role and are now apparently collecting on what they think is their just due.
Yes. President Bush can: http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2002/01/20020105-3.html Q What was the first thing that went through your head when you heard that a plane crashed into the first building? THE PRESIDENT: Yes. Well, I was sitting in a schoolhouse in Florida. I had gone down to tell my little brother what to do, and -- just kidding, Jeb. (Laughter.) And -- it's the mother in me. (Laughter.) Anyway, I was in the midst of learning about a reading program that works. I'm a big believer in basic education, and it starts with making sure every child learns to read. And therefore, we need to focus on the science of reading, not what may feel good or sound good when it comes to teaching children to read. (Applause.) I'm just getting a plug in for my reading initiative. Anyway, I was sitting there, and my Chief of Staff -- well, first of all, when we walked into the classroom, I had seen this plane fly into the first building. There was a TV set on. And you know, I thought it was pilot error and I was amazed that anybody could make such a terrible mistake. And something was wrong with the plane, or -- anyway, I'm sitting there, listening to the briefing, and Andy Card came and said, "America is under attack." And in the meantime, this teacher was going on about the curriculum, and I was thinking about what it meant for America to be under attack. It was an amazing thought. But I made up my mind that if America was under attack, we'd get them. (Applause.) I wasn't interested in lawyers, I wasn't interested in a bunch of debate. I was interested in finding out who did it and bringing them to justice. I also knew that they would try to hide, and anybody who provided haven, help, food, would be held accountable by the United States of America. (Applause.) Anyway, it was an interesting day. But I agree that it's unfair to criticize Bush for those 7 minutes. Like someone else said, it's your staff's job to figure out a way to quietly get the President out of the room. The kids didn't know what had happened in NYC at that point -- you could easily come up with a reason to get him out of there that wouldn't scare them. What struck me was when they cut from the President to Ari Fleischer and a couple other aides -- they were standing there frozen and speechless. But it's their job to handle the President in that situation. Trust me, I've had to get politicians out of a room before -- it's not rocket science, and, as a staffer, it's your job.
