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Ukraine

Discussion in 'BBS Hangout: Debate & Discussion' started by NewRoxFan, Nov 25, 2018.

  1. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Your arguments are all over the place. It’s not as though Russian oil and gas don’t also cause greenhouse gases.
     
    AleksandarN, Amiga and Nook like this.
  2. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    I don't need your war machine, I don't need your ghetto scene.
     
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  3. Nook

    Nook Member

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    Based on what? The US actually took Iraq and huge parts of Afghanistan and they withdrew. The USA had large patches of Vietnam and eventually decided it wasn't worth it and withdrew. Russia withdrew from Afghanistan after invasion.

    Invading forces withdraw all the time when the cost becomes too high.... that doesn't even take into account that Russia is led by a 70 year old man that is vulnerable, in a country that is rapidly changing.
     
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  4. Nook

    Nook Member

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    No one is being "bullied" into anything, this is no different than standard international politics around the world that has happened for at least 2,000 years.

    Also, two things can be true at the same time - someone can support renewables and pollution control AND be aware that for the foreseeable future that LNG is going to be a popular energy source.

    Rather than being "amazed" over what you posted, you should be amazed that you support the Russian invasion of sovereign nations. Last time everyone sat around and did nothing; we ended up with a world war.



    This is such a faulty argument. Russia invaded Ukraine, not the USA or UK or anyone else. They decided to spill blood by invading another nation. When there is no longer a will to fight from the inside, the Ukraine will fall. That hasn't happened. Not to mention how many people would die from a third world **** hole invading and occupying Ukraine.
     
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  5. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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  6. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Contributing Member
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    After putting space ghost on ignore (because he’s clearly insane or just purposely dense), this thread reads funny because it looks like people arguing with themselves
     
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  7. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    Haven't you been arguing we should be sending more arms to Ukraine?
     
  8. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    sooner, not necessarily more.
     
  9. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    Why Ukraine Hasn’t Been a Boon to U.S. Defense Companies
    Soaring demand for munitions hasn’t translated yet into big sales for arms producers suffering from supply chain snarls, labor shortages

    The quantities of arms the U.S. is sending to Ukraine are eye-catching: thousands of artillery shells and missiles, and hundreds of thousands of rounds of ammunition, just to name a few. The total security assistance package, now worth more than $27 billion, should in theory mean a big payday for major weapons producers.

    Yet the largest ground war in Europe since World War II isn’t translating into boom times for U.S. defense contractors. Hobbled by supply chain disruptions, a tight labor market and a Pentagon procurement process that can take years, arms makers have been struggling to respond to the soaring demand.

    Lockheed Martin Corp., LMT 0.58%increase; green up pointing triangle the world’s largest defense company by revenue—and whose Javelin antitank missiles and Himars rocket launchers have been central to Western support for Ukraine—said last week that it expects annual sales to shrink for the second year in a row.

    Weapons suppliers, like Lockheed, and Raytheon Technologies Corp., RTX 1.15%increase; green up pointing triangle which coproduces the Javelin and makes Stinger antiaircraft missiles, don’t expect a bump in Ukraine-driven sales to emerge until 2024.


    https://www.wsj.com/articles/why-uk...defense-companies-11675176026?mod=djem10point
     
  10. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    I have friends at Lockheed and Raytheon which are huge up here in DFW. Lockheed employees especially are at least telling me that they are busy as hell right now, but important to note that most of the stuff they work on is essentially orders that came in during the Trump admin. They explained it to me about how long their cycle is. They often cannot recognize revenue until they have delivered too. It's still a very stable company to work for though for that reason. They have a 4 to 10 year super predictable revenue forecasts. Which allows them to hire the way they do, and invest the way they do.

    The way I look at it though, if their sales are shrinking or projected to shrink over the next 5 years, that's a good sign for world peace or at least stability. If countries that buy from the US were stocking up for a world war, you'd see Lockheed, and Raytheon projections shooting through the roof. Either that or most militaries have essentially came up to NATO standards of readiness in their stockpile, and are only in maintenance mode.
     
  11. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    doesn't sound like it's related to the war in Ukraine.
     
  12. dobro1229

    dobro1229 Contributing Member

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    Most of the Javelin orders were placed in 2019 apparently. Alot of that stuff is just being shipped out, and as I said... recognized as revenue. The order might have been placed and even invoiced in 19, but they can't officially recognize it till it's delivered. Ukraine, and Russia are really the only two countries right now that are using up supply, or in Ukraine's case in 19 to 21 was increasing it's supply to prepare for what was coming.

    It's just my hunch but I assume that much of their "customers" or NATO/Allied countries that buy from Lockheed, etc. are more in the readiness/maintenance mode with their weaponry. You hear the term NATO standard used alot with military folks. That essentially means you have the supply, and the latest artillery available at that time that is likely the newest stuff that Lockheed etc. has ready to build & sell.

    I don't think anyone should be concerned that Lockheed's revenue projections are set to decline by 1 to 5% YOY. That's probably a good thing.
     
  13. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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  14. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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  15. rocketsjudoka

    rocketsjudoka Contributing Member
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    So you don't support sending tanks and fighter jets to Ukraine?
     
  16. Major

    Major Member

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    Basso supports whatever Biden is not doing.
     
  17. basso

    basso Contributing Member
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    I've stated my preferences quite clearly in this thread.
     
  18. Redfish81

    Redfish81 Member

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    https://www.nbcnews.com/news/world/...ent-offensive-feb-24-putin-invasion-rcna68751

    Speaking to French media on Wednesday, Ukrainian defense minister Oleksii Reznikov said Russia had 500,000 troops ready for an assault in the coming weeks, nearly double the number Putin announced he was mobilizing in September.

    “Officially, they announced 300,000, but when we see the troops at the borders, according to our assessments it is much more,” he said.



    If this is accurate it will be very unlikely that Ukraine can hault this big of a Russian force without NATO airpower.
     
  19. DonkeyMagic

    DonkeyMagic Contributing Member
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    It’s scary because despite the successful resistance thus far, the sheer volume Russia has and the willingness to let them die can overwhelm Ukraine. I only hope Russian incompetence is raised to a whole new level because this year will be rough for Ukraine otherwise
     
    basso likes this.
  20. Dream Sequence

    Dream Sequence Contributing Member

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    "All the soldiers say, "It'll be alright
    We may make it through the war
    If we make it through the night"
    All the people, they say
    "What a lovely day, yeah, we won the war
    May have lost a million men, but we've got a million more"

     

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