Tyreke Evans: I make my game similar to Tracy McGrady

I can't believe I'm going to do this but here goes:

I'm sorry but when McGrady was in Orlando, there were MANY MANY debates on who was the better player--Kobe or McGrady--much like how people are debating LeBron versus Kobe. And those debates were valid because McGrady was that great of a player.

"Lazy on D"

I doubt there's anything that can back this argument up. He might not have the All-Defensive accolades Kobe received but he wasn't a defensive sieve by any means.

His steals and rebounds per game during those two great years in Orlando are VERY comparable to the numbers Kobe put up in the same timespan

"Never really worked on his jumper"

Yea that robbed him of progressing years later (i.e. in Houston) but the guy was absolutely sick. His jumper back then had not only high elevation but the fluid release was just awesome to watch. Criticizing a player for "not working on his jumper" when he won 2 scoring titles while shooting around 44% is a bit much

"How to move without the ball the way Kobe did"

I have to laugh at this because I want you to name 4-5 teammates that Kobe had during the 02-04 span and name 4-5 teammates McGrady had during the same span. The dude was by himself in Orlando. Darrell Armstrong? Andrew DeClerq? Bo Outlaw? Yea they match up real well with Derek Fisher, Rick Fox and Shaq. He did what he needed to do with the lack of talent around him.

Wow, somewhere DD is getting off at the fact that he's getting QUOTED by members. Look no one is denying that Bryant works hard on his game from day 1. That, in itself, has put him miles and miles ahead of McGrady. Bryant trains in the offseason relentlessy, McGrady did not. Bryant always looked for ways to improve his game, McGrady plays softball. But don't discredit McGrady's career because his tenure in Houston has been ho-hum.

I've wanted McGrady off this team for a while and I don't think he's the same player he was even 3-4 years ago but back when he was in Orlando, he was neck and neck with Kobe among who was the best player in the NBA.

Everyone sees the present Kobe playing tenacious D and thinks that he's been doing that all his life and I laugh. Kobe didn't start playing any semblance of lock-down defense until a few years ago. Back when McGrady was with Orlando, neither he or Kobe were defensive players.

 

McGrady's best year was 02-03 in Magic, he scored more points (32.1/6.5/5.5) than Kobe(30.0/6.9/5.9) for that year, but that's where it started and ended for that argument.

The Magic team was intended to build around Hill, so McGrady had no problem to take over. The Lakers, of the same time, was built around Shaq. And even in that case, Kobe had no problem stringing 40+ games when Shaq was healing company injury in company time. Kobe had slightly better assist and rebounds number as well. Back to that day, the league consensus was Kobe would have the scoring title if he didn't have to defer to Shaq, which was proved in 06 and 07, Kobe scored 35.4, a good notch above TMac's best scoring season.

In later years, we found out McGrady could never adapt to play efficiently with a dominant big man. He never shot over .431 in Rox, while Kobe always shoot above .450 with/without Shaq/Gasol (barring the two years that he's busy dealing with colorado case in offseason, and still shot .433 and .438). I believe this is the ultimate proof McGrady was never on the level of Kobe.

The guy never had the same level of defense (0 vs. 9 times all D team), not recognized as clutch. The playoff success was night and day. Having 2 scoring titles in a bad team was the only argument, and that's a very weak one. I mean, AI had 4 scoring titles and we don't hear the same argument.

 

The lack of talent actually helped his stats and efficiency, everyone was doing screen for him, the paint wasn't clogged with bigmen. If you watch how Nash and LBJ ain't as efficient with Shaq, you know what I am saying. And that's exactly what happened once TMac had Yao.

Kobe was in all defensive first team in 99-00, when he didn't have the reputation. And he maintained it in most years afterward. He's got 9 all D teams to days, it's laughable to say he's not a defensive players until a few years ago

 

Everyone knows that Tmac had better natural and physical basketball abilities than Kobe. He had a shot at being better than him - and almost was at some times - but he satisfied himself by beeing a GREAT player, when he could have, IMO, became a LEGEND if he worked as much as Kobe had/has.
As a famous Rocket player would have said: "Put Kobe's mentality in my body? Man theres no question. No question. GOAT."

 

This is wrong. Right out of high school I remember Kobe being put on Scottie Pippen for defensive purposes and locking him down. The kid was not nearly as smart a defender as he is now but the intensity and effort were there from day one.

He has been a very good defender from day one in this league.

 

I think Horace Grant who was on the team with T-mac said that McGrady needed to show more effort on D.

 

I think being more physically durable should count as a physical ability.

 

So the fact that McGrady constantly being doubled more than Kobe because there were no other offensive threats on his team means nothing.
The fact that no one else on the team could create for him or find him when hes open obviously helped his stats as well.
And the fact that his teammates couldn't convert wide open layups and shots that McGrady created for them obviously helped him with his assist numbers.

Your argument is ridiculous.

 

I Remember Having A Serious Debate On Our Hands
Let me drop a couple of average stat lines on you from the 2000-01 season through the 2004-05 season.
Player 1: 74.6 Games | 44.3% FG | 35.2% 3FG | 6.8 rpg | 5.3 apg | 1.6 spg | 0.9 bpg | 2.6 topg | 27.6 ppg
Player 2: 72 Games | 45.2% FG | 33.3% 3FG | 5.9 rpg | 5.4 apg | 1.7 spg | 0.6 bpg | 3.2 topg | 27.1 ppg
Looks pretty even, right?
It’s hard to tell who is the better player here. One is a little more durable. That same player is also a superior three-point shooter, a better rebounder, a better defender in terms of garnering steals and blocking shots and a better scorer. The other player shoots a higher percentage from the field and does a slightly better job passing the ball but has turnover issues.
Player 1 is Tracy McGrady. Player 2 is Kobe Bryant.
Now, I’m not trying to say Tracy McGrady was a better ball player than Kobe Bryant during these five seasons. There are plenty of factors to consider when comparing the two.

 

Are you kidding me? A healthy Tmac is considered one of the best players in the league. When Tmac is healthy, no one can guard him one on one. It just too bad that he had been hit with injuries. But if he was healthy, expect him to be our main guy today.

I just don't understand why so many clutchfans members hate him so much. He had been injured and dealt with a major surgery and everyone hates him.

Give it a rest bro. Tmac has done more for this team than Yao. The only reason why Yao got out of the first round last season is because he had a great team. Tmac never got any help in the playoffs. If Yao never had any help in the playoffs like last season, expect him to be knocked out of the first round.

 

So because you hate Tmac so much, you wouldn't want to have Tyreke Evans on this team? Any SG in the NBA would love to have the skill and talent level like Tmac. The ball handling ability, the court vision, foot work... Tmac's talents are off the roof

 

There are always plus and minus for different team setup. Different players favor different setup. Compare Magic with Rox, McGrady may be less doubled, but he's got a less clogged paint so that he can get more shots under the hoop, and latter no doubt help his accuracy. Now if the latter outweights the former, which seems to be the case for TMac, of course he's gonna be more efficient in Magic, as that's a fact in history.

And when you count assists, you have to take into account of usage. If you hold the ball for every possession, you are going to get many assists. If you put half of the possessions in the hand of YM and let him create, you are less likely to get that many assists.

Bottom line, compare apple to apple. TMac was not as good without a quality bigman, and much worse when he had a bigman.

 

As I said, Kobe was being the No.2 option most of the time for that duration, while Tmac being the No.1 option.

Just ask yourself this, how many No.1 option can score 27 ppg in NBA history, now how about No.2?

 

Why wouldn't you want to model your offensive game around a healthy T-Mac?

1. Amazing court vision
2. Willing and good passer
3. Ability to take over games
4. Unblockable jump shot
5. Excellent first step
6. High Basketball IQ
7. Ability to finish in traffic

I have no idea what goodbug is trying to say

T-Mac without help in Orl. - 32.1 ppg 6.5 rpg 5.5 apg 1.7 spg 0.8 bpg 2.6 turns

Kobe without help in LA- 35.4 ppg 5.3 rpg 4.5 apg 1.8 spg 0.4 bpg 3.1 turns

Tell me how they are incomparable?

 

I'd say Kobe's number was better, for very few people score over 35 ppg in history. But I don't want to argue on that, if you insist to say Tmac in Magic was comparable to Kobe in Lakers without help. I don't disagree, they had similar achievements too.

However, championships are won with at least one quality big man. And when there's quality bigman in the lineup, Kobe consistently has much better numbers than TMac, the achievements too. TMac has never proved he could play better or at least on par when he has a quality bigman. And that alone put them in different levels.

 

Sure, it is arguable who WAS better. But it doesn't matter now, because T-Mac is a problem atm and the present is what we should be focused on.

 

I understand kobe works/worked much harder than t-mac, and lets say have comparable talent, but sometimes I just feel people downplay the toll injuries have taken on t-macs game, I dont know i sometimes wonder that if t-mac wasnt so fragile he would still be a top player in the nba. well maybye he got injured because he didnt prepare right, but then its more of assumption than a fact.

and yeah, its normal nba players modeling their game on t-macs game, when healthy he really makes it all look so easy :grin:

 

You don't think a 3.0ppg differential makes the two players "comparable"?

Shaq in his Laker days was much more dominant than Yao ever was. T-Mac's peak year in Houston saw a still reticent Yao that put up a meager 19 ppg. He was hardly a dominant force to defer to. I cannot emphasize this enough, but the game becomes so much easier when you have a DOMINANT big man to play with. McGrady gets a lot of heat for saying exactly that, but it's the truth. If you replace Kobe with a prime McGrady on that Laker team, I think he'd get either the same or better numbers.

 

Why should we be focused on current T-Mac in this particular thread?

 

Where was this stated?