Trump, the Fools that Voted for Him, and the Fools that Stayed Home

It's smart that Dems have to wait in long lines to vote but Reps don't. Definitely one way you can tilt an election to your side even if you are the minority of the country.

 

Here is the thing about democracy. You can be so right, but if others don't see it your way, you are wrong. I was an adamant Hillary supporter, but Hillary did not have the backing of enough people. She has been in politics for too long and had too much baggage. It's unfortunate but that's the case. Unfortunately everyone will have regrets on this one. All the dumbasses that stayed home, all the Bernie or bust supporters that are essentially getting the opposite of what they wanted in the first place, and all the people who like myself who nominated a flawed candidate even though I think she is the most qualified to be POTUS.

I'm looking to the future. Let's hope his promises to drain the swamp are true and he can get term limits and anti lobbying laws enacted. Somehow I doubt it, but I need something to hope for.

 

But she got more votes than Trump.

I think the Clinton campaign absolutely understood what was going on - but how do you tear down the establishment when you are the very embodiment of the establishment?

When something this seismic happens, it's never one thing; instead, it's a million little things... all viable. For me, my two takeaways are the Bernie or Bust people busted and should be ashamed of themselves for allowing their own revolution to be torched through their selfish, irresponsible voting. The other component: 35% of a group Trump vilified and insulted throughout his campaign voted for him/not Hillary. I can't explain that. We know they registered in record numbers; at the end of the day, they were either poorly organized or misinformed, which makes them a potentially powerful group in the years to come if they can form a cohesive alliance. Attention: Democrats!

 

Yep; in hindsight, the Democrats should have handed her Secretary of State as her parting gift in '08, thanked her and Bill for their service and then put the Clintons out to pasture. She was rejected then on a platform of change, and the Democrats were wrong to read that as a change away from Bush/Republicans - it was the first pivot away from the establishment that we saw become a full-blown movement this year.

 

A new president was elected and in 1-2 weeks all this talk will be over. There will be some discussion once he is inaugurated. People will continue living, gas prices go up, rich people pay less taxes (someone will have to make up the difference), there might be a war which the middle class pays for in taxes, gas prices and by receiving less tax breaks/benefits.

Truly a day of Trump for anyone well over the 400k tax bracket. Bravo, idiots. You elected unemployment, high gas prices, higher crime and prison rates.

 

This is true. The DNC with Obama's cooperation fixed the race for Hillary to the point in which other candidates who probably could have beaten Trump decided not to enter. This included Biden and Warren. Only Bernie took up the challenge and we saw how they conspired to rig the election against him.

Hillary was like Jeb, Kerry, Romney etc. -- a passable candidates who had paid their dues, so it was their turn, , but who were uninspiring. If folks were not truly hurting such a candidate can win out, but not in a year in which folks do not want to continue the status quo.

Bernie showed Hillary how to win: keep your focus on several bread and butter issues that were sufficiently bold to give folks some prospect of economic relief. Bernie reused to get drawn into the media circus of the daily gotcha, by not responding to media continual attempts to redirect him back to the daily gotcha which the media thinks increases ratings. . Hillary could not resists as such daily sniping over Trump's stupidity of the day as counter attacking the daily Trump stupidity was so tempting, so in line with her rhetorical strengths and so desired by the media. Continually saying Trump was personally unqualified or scary was not sufficient.

 

Yes, agreed. Clinton was a god awful candidate. She managed to be so bad that despite 2 million voters finding Trump less palatable than Romney, she still lost.

 

Apparently there's a lot of fools who won't accept our democratic process. Instead they want to damage private property and cause unsafe road and traffic conditions.

 

I can't respect them either. Gary Johnson is pretty much a fraud. He is a conservative who likes weed and who discovered that some young low info, but potentially progressive voters could be swayed to vote against frequent elective wars which Hillary supported.

 

Frankly, it's the same strategy Trump employed.

You're comparing Bernie in the primaries, who never had to answer the shitshow that was Trump's campaign, to Hillary in the general election, in which she not only had to answer for the shitshow of Trump's campaign but all the nonsense swirling around her.

Bernie was Bill Maher two weeks ago and Andre Sullivan really went after him and Bernie could not pivot off of his messaging; almost embarrassingly. That tactic worked for Trump, so what do I know? - But I don't know if people wanted to hear Bernie work every answer - ISIS, immigration, etc. - back to going after the top 1%.

 

Hey I would like to go to that lunch, but Deckard might try to deck me.

 

She could have recognized dramatic change is needed but not the type of change Trump wanted.

She had to make a clear case why Washington was broken, and that it was because of gridlock and the refusal for Republicans to reach across the aisle. She should have said that if you want change give me the congress to do it. She should have said that she is picking Bernie as her VP so they can work together - to unite liberals and moderates to renew America from both sides. She could have said that it wasn't just about winning but about changing congress - that people who are fed up with a broken system must come to vote not just for a president but to kick anyone out who refuses to work with the other side.

That should have been her platform. Instead it was attacking Trump. Obama won on a positive message - on a vision. She had the opportunity for one but did not take it. Bernie was a gift that she shunned. She should have embraced him and made him her VP and said they would be a true team in change.

Bernie would have been far more effective than Tim Kaine in being Hillary's attack dog on Trump too.

The problem of the last 8 years was the Tea Party Congress. She could have said it's time for the Bernie Bro's to take Congress and revolutionize America.

 

Agreed, good post. Bernie as vp could probably have led to even Hillary winning. In the final days basically the only positive thing aside from decrying racism and , sexism that she could cite was the no college debt to families with less than $125 k that Bernie had to go to the wire to get the timid Hillary to espouse.

 

I think it's nearly impossible to be an agent of change when you are the embodiment of the very infrastructure both sides so desperately want to tear down.

Frankly, it was. But she was on the outside of this seismic shift, first with Sanders, then Trump. People did not care about issues, or, if they did, they were so narrow and specific, she was never going to get on their wavelength, hurt, of course, by her lack of charisma. Her only play was to attack Trump's character. It also didn't help that, you know, a foreign power was inserting themselves into the process, further putting her on the defensive.

That may very well be the what if of this campaign... Would naming Sanders have galvanized his supporters enough that they stuck with her? Gary Johnson totaled 2.9MM more votes this year over 2012; in June, Bloomberg reported 18% - or 2.4MM - of Bernie's supporters intended to vote for Johnson.

 

I've been inviting you to breakfast for years. Little did I know I just have been proposing lunch.

 

Hillary could have said all of that and it would not made a darn difference. There are not enough voters who believe whatever comes out from her mouth. In their minds, she is just not credible.

 

Thank you for being reasonable about the outcome even though you voted for Hillary! Attitudes like this will be what we need to make progress in this country.

 

It's hard for a party to get a third term. And if you can't be a change agent she shouldn't have run for president - it was hopeless for her. But I disagree that she couldn't have cast herself that way. It wasn't her history that made her establishment - it's her personality.

Her platform was "I'm with her" and a very standard platform. There wasn't much novel in it. It was practical and pragmatic but very safe. He talking points were nothing that struck a resonate tone, and she focused more on Trump than herself. So I disagree completely that it is impossible to be an agent of change - she didn't even try. And no it wasn't her platform at all

Her rationale was to vote for her because she has worked so hard for this, she's a woman, and she's got all the experience and temperament. If she wanted change, she should have have spoke about change and how to make it happen. She did not do that. Instead she capitulated on trade deals and tried to placate Sanders by adding some education policies.

There was no vision. She needed to tell America that manufacturing jobs are not coming back. Instead she talked about building jobs of the future - what does that mean for someone who works in manufacturing? She never explained what would happen to middle America and laborers. These people are desperate and that's why they voted Trump. They literally have nothing to lose.

And African Americans were not seeing what they had to gain in the same numbers as Obama being their president. She talked policy when people needed to hear a vision that they could believe in. She failed miserably to deliver.

 

No; that's her branding. I mean her platform. It was anything but standard - it was progressive and heavily influenced by the movement Sanders created. Just read some of her education policies - it'll sound very familiar if you supported Sanders.

She won the popular vote; it did strike a resonate tone. She was forced into attacking Trump because he was an 800-lb gorilla she simply couldn't rise above. It is the same problem 15 Republicans ran into, and likely the same problem any other Democratic nominee would've run into.

I disagree completely. Her rationale was that she would build a cohesive, inclusive country that provided opportunities for people to succeed by re-investing in infrastructure and education. She built on her prior commitment to create better futures for our children by focusing on the climate and building a Supreme Court that would embolden the many Americans the Republican party too often threatens.

No, no - if all you heard was attacks on Donald Trump, you didn't look hard enough. Her platform was actually a terrific one and among the many sad fall outs of this election, the specter of it being discarded is a big one for me.

I agree with all of this; the Democrats have struggled for years to speak to lower middle class and poor white people; they often talk down to them. I think the "deplorables" comment was far more damaging than people realized; she alienated a large group of people that are desperate.

 

Honestly the "she received more votes" argument should stop. Both sides know how it works. And quite frankly, I'm sure everyone is just really surprised it was even close (including Hillary)

I don't know if Trump will be a good president, this was a terrible offering by both sides of our government, but I am rooting for him to do well because like it or not, he is the captain of our ship now... rooting for him to wreck it is just stupid.