[Trump] An invitation for Evangelicals to Debate the Merits of Supporting Trump

Not trying to hijack the thread but...


In case you dont read German, the inscription is "God with us" with the swastika, implying God is a Nazi I guess? People have always been really good at convincing themselves that God wants whatever it is that they want. And other, manipulative people are good at using that.

Rallying people around the "will of God" has always been a way to generate support for war.

It's much less frustrating to bend your perception of God to to your desires, rather than bending your desires to God. People dont do it consciously. It's just much easier.

I say this only because, I dont think you can out-logic evangelical Trump supporters into abandoning him.

 

Then be respectful and dont post. If someone asks for open dialogue, engage in a respectful manner. The best insight I've had is when people have corrected me in a respectful manner instead of ridiculing me.

If you're MO is about ridiculing and insulting, stick with Fox/CNN, national political debates, Carl Herrara threads or the Kardashians.

 

So he was able to convince all the Nazis to give up Nazism and change their ways and he lived happily ever after?

 

I was raised catholic. The ring of pedophiles does not do it for me either. I have much more reason to believe in Eastern philosophies than any western theological religion.

What makes a person think that where they are born and proceeds to fall right in with what they are taught spirituality from a child onward? What are the chances that is really the correct path? Chances are it is not and you are wasting your damn time. And would be way better served going out and helping someone in need and make the world a better place with all of that time spent in a building “praising god”.

I hope Christianity and Islam will decline and that will indeed make the world a better place. Making a thread like this a mute point and the hypocrisy that it is.

 

If I were you I would block me on here because I’m not respectful enough with MO.

Merry CHRISTmas. Or as dumb ass Christians and others get offended by merry xmas (which is actually derived from the Greek alphabet) and not offensive at all.

 

Ok. Good luck with that.

My impression is 1000lb bombs and hanging the ringleaders by the neck in Nuremburg did a lot more to change the direction of Nazi Germany, but perhaps Bonhoffer would have caused the Nazis to change their ways eventually without that.

 

Why are you saying a generalized statement and the next sentence refer to yourself specifically? But of course not. There are of course many good Christians, Muslims and others.

But I no longer think it is needed and it has served its purpose. And there is high High odds that all of it is made up. People can distort truth and facts in the year 2020. The odds of almost everything happening in the Bible is extremely small. But go ahead and base a portion of your life on it. I guess

 

The south that most of us grew up in (yeah I’m from Arkansas but I’m lumping you Houstonians with me) is the Bible Belt and breeds evangelical support because there’s an inherent rejection of science and lack of education. I’m not saying Christians are automatically uneducated. Cory Booker is devout but I think he would be a great president.

But Trump Country is Bible County. I’d say you’re looking for an illusory answer. They’re trump supporters that just so happen to be regular church goers. Any answer I’ve heard is an excuse. “He commits sin but we all do and he seeks forgiveness.” Trump of course tries to quote scripture and fails at that. He’s visited a few churches here and there. Modern evangelism is so focused on defunct policy issues and the Left is simply the enemy. Mitt Romney was one of the most faithful candidates I’ve ever seen in politics, but evangelicals today will say Trump represents them best. Why? Because they’re dumb, not because they’re in touch with the Holy Spirit.

 

Read this in some stupid book once:

If you've ever been to a therapist, you don't sit down on a couch, tell them everything you've done wrong, and sit back and listen to them spit out a clinical laundry list of everything wrong about you. They don't go directly at you. They come at you from an angle and ask you questions that help you see how the problems in your life are connected back to your own decisions and actions.

Nazis didn't give up Hitler when the entire world told them what a bad dude Hitler was. In 1941 when they were marching on Moscow Hitler supporters were beyond help. But 4 years later at the point that Hitler's worldview had run his course and the fruits of it had been reaped and it was clear to them that their own personal ruin directly came from him, that is when they had the "come to Jesus" moment and were willing to change their ways. At that point they were willing to entertain ideas like those of the recently deceased Mr. Bonhoeffer. You don't change people's beliefs by heading straight at them. You approach obliquely and help find their own way to the truth.

If they aren't willing to come to the proper conclusion, they haven't suffered enough yet and won't change their minds anyway. Once you say, "Lets talk about Trump" the brains of Trump self-identifying supporters "lawyer up" and put up walls and become like cognitive porcupines. And since the fruits of his faults have not fully ripened, most of them probably aren't willing to listen any way. The best thing you can do is stand on the sidelines and when things start going really bad, help them to draw their own conclusion that Trump action A lead to result B and help them learn from their mistakes.

That was where I was generally trying to lead you, but too much effort, and you think I'm being condescending by not coming straight at you like a Mack truck - or what I see as the absolute worst way to get people to change their minds.

I appreciate your good intentions, but I take issue with your approach.

 

You're really missing the point. The people you are insulting for being ignorant is largely a reflection on yourself, just on the opposite end of the spectrum. There was a time on these forums when interesting discussions happened. Now most are close minded and refuse to acknowledge someone else belief structure.

Its ok though. Much like everyone else here, Im sure you're nice and respectful in person.

For those who are easily offended, Happy Holidays.