and that's all that really should matter........ heck if Gaye goes on to be like Richard Jefferson, it shouldn't matter as long as Battier does what we expect him to do..... If we get to the championship game(which I don't see right now, but if we do) then it don't make a **** what Gaye does.
I've been wanting Gay since the season ended. But the more I think about it, the more I'm OK with the trade. Battier will be the better player over the next 2-3 years and that is the window we supposedly have.
People need to forget about the Denver game. It is not JVG's fault the Rox won. The players are the ones who win or lose. You can not expect a coach to go out there and tell his team not to score or intentionally lose. If that is the case why not just tell them to lose every game next season and hope things turn out well the following draft. Remember also we lost to Minnesota the last week or so which almost cost them the seeding. besides, with a lottery you are not guaranteed anything. Look at toronto, if they had lost more games, they would have had a different numbers combo and the combo that came up would not have been theirs. Last season is over and done with. Move on.
Fine you want to talk about trades. The great Jerry west traded Jason Williams, Antoine Walker and James Posey to Miami for Eddie Jones. Everyone said Miami made a bad trade because the parts didnt fit and they traded away their best defender. How did that work out. Everyone said the Baron Davis to Golden state trade was a raping and that Golden state would be back in the playoffs. I think NO is in a much better position then Golden state right now. We will have to wait and see how this trade plays out. Also what makes Gay a BMW. He is a player who underperformed in college against athletes who were nowhere near as good as him. Everyone is acting like we traded away Yao or tmac.
Just another thing to bring up was that the #8 pick wasn't worth much this year. Heck the #7 pick only brought in Sebastian Telfair for pete's sake. He isn't 1/2 the player Battier is and Stromile wasn't going to play much this year considering how he's played lately. Heck Memphis was a running team the year before last and he still couldn't get his game together. He just wasn't going to work here if anywhere. The trade wasn't that bad in fact I'll bet it turns into a big positive for the Rox.
1. They dumped La Frentz and his huge contract. 2. Celtics has tons of yong talent. 3. Just because Danny Ainge sucks, doesn't mean Houston needs to be Boston's cousin.
Precisely the same things I've been thinking about for a long time now. In fact, what you've described about the NY Knicks can easily apply to the Rockets under Dawson's (mis)direction for the past 10 years. This organization has consistently tried (and failed) to build a contending team in precisely the manner you described. Just go back and take a look at the veritable parade of so-called "solid veteran" players that have passed through this organization during the last decade and you can understand why my postings here consistently slam the incompetent fools calling the shots. I do so because they are short-sighted and have no true plan for building a contending team. It's been 2 years now since the blockbuster TMac trade and my feelings haven't changed one bit. Yes, it was a coup getting TMac but at that time you will recall nearly everyone here taking the position that all that was needed was to surround Yao & TMac with the right pieces. At that time, I openly questioned whether the Rockets had the right people in place at the top to properly execute that strategy. I based my beliefs on the extremely sorry draft record of CD as well as the poor personnel decision making. Well, it's two years later and nothing much has changed. We are all still waiting for CD & Co. to surround Yao & TMac with the correct role players. They have failed and will continue to fail because of the reasons you have provided. I have a real bad feeling about what they've done here - in essence, they are gambling that they can put together a Miami-like team and let JVG coach slow-down, defensive basketball in the West and be successful against teams that are younger, faster, more versatile and much more athletic. It's as if they seem to regard what happened in that last playoff game at Dallas as some sort of fluke. They are also appear to be discounting the events of the past year due to the injuries to TMac & Yao but to me, that is making a huge mistake. What they are ignoring or pretending that it never happened is how pathetic and non-competative this team was in it's division let alone its conference. If this fails to work then they will finally be faced with the dim prospect of having to completely blowup this team and start from scratch with a new coach and the only thing they will have to show for this disaster will be more wasted time and effort. And we fans will continue to be "frustrated".
Im sorry but your post makes no sense. You say the Rox can not expect to use trades to build a contender. What do you think caused Tmac to be here. It was only two years ago that a trade gave this team a legitimate chance to contend. Two years, not a 10 year history of failure which included the drafting of yao ming. After tmac, they bring in veterans through more trades and have a great year taking a very good dallas team to a 7th game in a series they should have won. Last year can not be counted with all the injuries. They have really only had one offseason to build around yao and tmac. Swift bombed but most of the experts covering the NBA felt with him, the Rox were going to be the 2nd best team in the west when the season started last year. Look at all the great teams. They used trades or signings to get better, not developing young stars like you do in baseball. Detroit became a real contender when they got Rasheed, he didnt grow up in their system. In fact Ben Wallace Chauncey Billups and Rip Hamilton all developed for other teams. The suns were nothing until they picked up their missing piece which was Nash who developed his game with the Mavs. The heat are an even bigger example. They won their championship by bringing in other vets. I know Wade is the reason they won, but until a trade for Shaq and the trade with Memphis he didnt win anything. Now look at the teams who are stockpiling young talent to develop it. The bulls have done okay but are not championship contenders. The celtics have all the young players in the world but are in the lottery every year. Do you think the blazers have a chance to win anything in the next few years. Battier helps the rox win more games during the next three years and that is when tmac and yao have the best chance of leading us to a championship. Lastly dont compare our situation to the knicks. If healthy, the rox are a 55 to 60 win team without cap room and two superstars. If healthy the knicks are a 30-35 win team 60 million over the cap without any superstars other teams would be interested in trading for.
Back then we had TRADEABLE ASSETS. Now we DON'T. Yes we took them to seven games last season. But what happened the next season? One by one the players went down due to career ending injuries. Why? Because they were OLD players. Exactly the kind of shortsighted patchup job that was being described here. The Spurs developed young stars in Ginobili and Parker. They DRAFTED Duncan, remember? So did the Mavs. The Pistons? They won ONCE. And it was partly because of the feud between Shaq and Kobe, and Malone and Payton. The Suns haven't even reached the Finals yet. And yes, Wade won them the chip, and he was DRAFTED by them. Thing is, we AREN'T stockpiling young talent to develop. We are only asking for ONE (okay 2 if you count Head) young talent to develop. In fact we have been doing the exact opposite. We are stockpiling old or soon to be old washed up has beens.
I got two words that will clear this all up for everyone. Eddie Griffen. Rudy Gay is another E G waiting to happen. 19 years old, a world of talent, but no drive inside to put it all together. He may show up now and then but in the end he will disapper. I can see it now, I just don't feel like playing hard. I'll take the night off. If a person can't play hard every night he is of no use. Shane plays hard every night and will be a great addition to the Rockets. What is hard to believe however, of all the players left in this draft after the 7th pick, none were better than Shane in the Rockets mind. It had to be about dumping a contract, plain and simple.
You spelled Eddie Griffin wrong. Have you ever even seen Gay play? My guess is that you haven't. BTW people have also questioned the drive of many great players. Ever heard of T-Mac?
Obviously Rudy Gay isn 't the next Lebron James or the younger version of Scottie Pippen, otherwise he would never slipped until nr.8! I think CD and JVG had their doubts about Gay. Because if he really is a very good player and NBA ready, Houston wouldn 't trade him to Memphis. The only thing I 'm upset about is that we trade Gay AND Stro to Memphis for Battier! I hope we could get Wright or Warrick with Battier and if not a future 1st round pick! But, I think Battier will give Houston an extra boost and increase the chances to get far in the playoffs ... but we need more players!
What do you expect. How do we get a player like tmac without giving up tradeable assets. Also, what exactly did these great pieces we gave up do for the Magic. I dont remember Mobley, Francis, and Cato exactly doing wonders for their franchise. What was your point with the Pistons remark. Are you saying that winning the championship only once is a bad thing. They also made the finals the following year. Im sure all us rockets fans would be disappointed if we win the championship next year, or have a season like the Suns did this year. Plus how can you say the Mavs are a better example then the Pistons when the Mavs have not won the finals yet. And the mavs dont make the finals without jason terry who did not get developed by them. He came over in free agency. The only way to stockpile young talent is to keep losing over and over again and be in the lottery. Either that or trade with the knicks like the bulls did. Are you willing to wait a few years to try to win when tmac and yao are in their prime now. Also let me ask you this. If young talent is all that matters would you trade our roster right now for the roster of the bulls, blazers, or celtics. Straight up, trade entire teams. I would hope not. Last season was completely due to injuries to two players. Yes Wesley and JB had injuries that will probably end their careers with the Rox. But what do we lose. Neither one is on our books like Alan Houston is with the Knicks. We just have to bring in the right guys to replace them.
The trade is actually decent for us, Shane Battier will do more than Stromile or Gay could have done. If we traded Gay for Battier straight up, I bet Memphis would have done it in a heartbeat, but we made them take Swift also. Swift is negative value, he has no basketball IQ and a long-term contract. Swift will never be a guy who can average a double-double. Someone like Miami's Udonis Haslem is a better player than Swift even though he's no where as flashy dunker.
Geez spin doctor, let's look at Pistons and Heat, should we? Detroit traded away Hill at the end of 2000 season, they got Rip and Chuancy in 02 and into the 2nd round, they have rookie Okur and Price in 03(who will be good contributors for their title) , into the East Finals, They finally got Rasheed in 04, putting them over then edge. Miami, drafted Wade and had Shaq fell into their lap in 05, got into east finals. In just next season, they find the right pieces to win it all. Notice how these teams don't have "oh, we are at the doorstep of a former trade-away, that's great" or "oh we get rid of the dumbest player we signed last season" moments. They don't go in circle. Now this will be 5th season since we drafted Yao, 3rd since we have Tmac and Yao. Yao will no longer on Rookie contract, in stead will on max. What pieces do we have around them? Battier? Rafer? maybe, We don't know how that will work out yet. What else can you find? Now, sit back and think why does all this mishap happens to Rockets?
a top-five selection in nex year's draft. that´s of course only the case,if the rockets don´t try to get stromile back at trading deadline...
I am not quite sure what you are talking about with the doorstep trade away comment. Look at things this way. Rox draft Yao five years ago. They realize Yao and Francis are not going to win. They trade for Mcgrady. they have a 51 win season and come very close to the 2nd round of the playoffs. Would have easily made it if they were the 6 seed instead of the 5 that year. Last year both their stars get injured so you cant judge that season. Now they have a nice piece added to help with defense and shooting. This year will be great. As for Wade, he was picked at 5 in a draft full of stars. Gay was the 8 pick in a draft without any major stars. There is a difference there. Anyone who thinks Gay will turn into wade during the next 3 years is crazy.
Amare Stoudamire is pretty good and he slipped to #9. Either way we gave up too much. Swift is not a "negative" value. If you play 20 minutes a game you're not a negative value.
