Trade Francis, Start Mobes at the 2, Sign or Draft PG

Francis for Duncan.

 

I think you have watched the movie "Stripes" one too many times...clearly you are thinking of a different Francis than I am thinking of

 

I don't think there is any question that Jason Williams is the best player in the draft. He's a bona fide star already. He's got a high basketball IQ, and he can finish strong inside or shoot from long range. If the Rockets (miraculously) got the #1 pick, I would definitely take Williams in a heartbeat.

At that point, the Rockets should TELL Mobley that he's going to win Sixth Man of the Year next year going away. Start JWill at the point, move Francis to the 2, and bring Mobley into the game five minutes in to play the same "small ball" lineup we're playing now, but this time with 3 of the top 12 guards in the league!

 

i'd trade francis for andre miller and cleveland's #1 pick faster than you can say "mobley's an allstar next year!"

 

Are there any pass first PGs in this upcoming draft???

 

This makes no sense. Jason Williams looks to pass the ball less than Francis. We would be doubling the so-called "problem." Only the reason the Rockets should draft Jason Williams is to trade him for the Rockets real need: FRONT COURT PLAYERS!

I still don't understand why there are actually posts about trying to improve(change) the backcourt when the Rockets don't even have a starting small forward or center (in my opinion).

Lets say it again. The Rockets problem is the three frontcourt positions. The two strongest positions are the the two backcourt positions. Why not try to improve our weaknesses, before throwing away our strengths?

 

Although this is an interesting argument, the point is moot. Steve and Cat are joined at the hip. Cat not only accepted less money to stay here but brought his entire family along (Mom, siblings, er, baby and girlfriend?) So now Mobley is essentially a Houstonian. And hopefully Francis will be, too.

A real attempt to grab Lamar Odom or some such point forward would be the best option. Apparently we tried recently. Let's see what we can do this off-season.

Besides, as has been pointed out, without Mo and Rice, Steve's instinct is probably to "shoot it myself." Not always a great thing, but hopefully the return of our starting forwards will make a difference.

 

Bottome line you cant have high assists if ur team doesnt make shots............

 

When Moochie plays the point he does rack up assists. Heck, the last time he started and Francis was out he had 17 of them. Why does Francis not play as well when he and Moochie are in the game together, cause clearly, Moochie is a passing PG?

I just don't think Francis' natural position is SG.

For that matter, I'd be curious to see a split between his assist-turnover ratio on wins versus losses. Would they be that different? Who knows.

 

I would not trade Francis for any point guard in the league. Not Kidd, not Payton. Probably not even for Miller or Davis even with a couple #1s from those teams thrown in (though this would be more tempting if the migrane LT prognosis is real bad).

What I was saying I was saying we could consider drafting the best PG prospect (Williams or Wagner) and trading Francis. It could be for a select group of SGs, maybe Kobe has to leave LA if Shaq and him implode, or T-Mac wants to leave Orlando. I would trade Franchice for either without much thought, it would be a tougher call with Pierce or especially Carter. No other guards of any sort would I consider trading Francis for.

Or, yes, I would trade Francis for KG(probably), Dirk(probably), TD(definetely) or Shaq (maybe Kobe chases him out of town). That is all I can think of off hand, but after all, this is a business.

A team of Shaq, Mo/KT, EG/Walt, CM and JW with Cato, TM & Mooch defintely on the bench would look pretty good. We just need the Lakers to lose this year and have one of the superstars chase the other out of town. If they were going to trade one of them I would think Franchise is one of the few players they would consider as the meat of such a package. Stranger things have happened.

 

wagner is not a point guard. wagner is not a combo guard. wagner is a 2 guard.

 

as evidenced when he scored 100 points in a high school game...

 

to answer my own question.

my calculations have Francis at a 1.68 assist-turnover ratio in the wins and a 1.66 assist-turnover ratio in the losses. A difference of 0.02. I know, I know....lies, damned lies and statistics. But nonetheless, of all the things to worry about on this team, this one shouldn't be in the forefront. Heck, of the 5 times Francis had double digits assists (even I'll admit that that is somewhat low), 4 of them came in losses. His 3 best a-t ratio games of the season (a 6 a,1 to game; and a 10a, 2 to game; and a 10 a, 3 to game) all came in losses.

When the team as a whole gets better - better spacing, better decision making, better defense, etc - you will see Francis' assists numbers go up a bit, and the to numbers either stay the same or go down slightly, most likely.

As for now, we should worry more about improving this teams horrid defense and working on new offensive sets and the like before coming up with trade proposals for our star player.

 

Pass 1st: I understand your argument, but you totally ignored the meat of my arguments...

1. Francis is in his third year in the league. Most "playmakers" who happen to play the point suffer through turnover-plagued seasons. Averaging almost 7 assists per game in your third season WHILE averaging 21 points means that he is responsible for better than 35 points per game (assuming at least one of those assists is a 3). That is more than one third of the Rockets total offense. That is ridiculous.

2. Only one player on the Rockets who is healthy has the level of talent as Francis and the Rockets rank as one of the worst shooting teams in the league. With that being the case, how many assists do you think Francis DOESN'T get because players miss shots.

In addition, turnovers are generated by more than just fumbling the ball away. The passer gets credit for the turnover if the player he is passing to doesn't catch the ball. How many times have we seen Cato or another Rockets player lose a pass intended for them?

3. The best healthy players on the team besides him are Mobley and Thomas. Since Mobley and Thomas get the majority of their baskets unassisted, Francis can almost never claim an assist to either of them. On most nights, Mobley, Francis and Thomas account for the bulk of the scoring (over 60 percent on average). That leaves Francis to get assists from players who aren't the calliber of he Mobley or Thomas. If you had to depend on Cato, Williams, Griffin and Morris for assists, you'd be lucky to get 7 a game.

4. You absolutely cannot discount the cost of injuries. Basketball is a game of chemistry and timing. Being in and out of the lineup like Francis has been is HORRIBLE on timing. It's one thing to be out for an extended period (which he was). It is another thing to be in and out.

5. The record is clear. Not only does the team win more when Francis is in the lineup, they play better. During Francis missing games this year, the team shot a lower percentage, got fewer rebounds, got fewer assists and had more turnovers. It isn't just scoring where he makes a difference. The guy changes everything on the floor for a team. He makes the team better. That is what great players do.

You see Francis playmaking and scoring as a hinderance whereas I see it as a benefit. Having Francis and Mobley in the backcourt together makes them almost impossible to defend. Take one out and the opponent can focus their efforts on only one of them.

Besides, if Francis and Mobley aren't on the floor at the same time, how can you possibly give each of them 35 minutes per game.

One final thing...

In the year Babe Ruth broke the home run record, he also SHATTERED the record for strike outs. Great players take on both the glory of winning and the burden of defeat. In order to make plays, you take risks. We see that with Francis. But, take the ball out of his hands and your team is worse, not better. That is the way it is with ALL great players.

 

Well, Jason Williams passing has almost single-handedly made Carlos Boozer a lotto pick, imo .

ARGH! I agree with your point, but it's a bad analogy. Strikeouts have almost no correllation with success for a hitter. Most great hitters whiff very frequently. Turnovers, unfortunately, do have a strong correllation with lack of success in basketball.

 

Nah, Jwill only gets 5 assists per game. Duhon gets more assists, plus his Assist/TO ration is 2.3 where Williams is 1.41.

Duhon is more of a true point guard than Jwill.

 

Not always. Hakeem averaged nearly 5 turnovers a game from 1992 - 1995, when he was, arguably, the most dominant player in the game.

 

Yeah, it was a matter of Hakeem overcoming his turnovers. He was so good that if he was going to turn the ball over 5 times, it wasn't such a big deal. If he hadn't turned it over at all, he would have been that much better.

Strikeouts (for hitters) are a bogus stat; there's almost no correllation between striking out as opposed to making other types of outs and run production. It's so tiny as to be close to meaningless.

Sorry, Jeff. I know I'm going overboard here. You just triggered a pet issue of mine!

 

here's an idea, rudy and cd somehow find a freakishly athletic point guard who comes damn close to a triple-double every night. we then team him up with a left-handed dead on shooter with a tremendous first step, who, get this, he develops an unbelievable chemistry with. man if CD can pull that off, and give them more than 2 1/2 seasons together i bet we'll have something pretty nice.

putting jason williams on this team would be absolutely pointless, especially when the same people want to move steve over.here are a couple reasons- 1) he shoots more than steve and doesn't do any better at setting people up 2) cat is a better 2-guard than steve. i don't think williams is an absolute lock for a star but he'll probably become one, just not on our team.