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Tracy McGrady: Just The Numbers...

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Clutch, May 18, 2009.

  1. Depressio

    Depressio Member

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    Tracy McGrady off the bench (if we re-sign Artest, of course). He'll be insulted, I'm sure, but this team has gelled without him and to throw a curveball at it with him returning straight into the starting line-up replacing either Battier or Artest would do more harm than good.

    But can you imagine? Tracy freaking McGrady coming off the bench? T-Mac, Wafer, Landry, and Lowry off the bench? How's that injection of offense straight into the bloodstream?
     
  2. DieHard Rocket

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    To me, it's really simple.

    If he's going to dedicate himself to rehab and come back determined, we're a title contender.

    If he gets semi-healthy and then just coasts through the season as he usually does, he's no good to us.

    We need him attacking the basket and creating opportunities for others. Our offense will be abysmal if we have him and Ron jacking up low-percentage shots all season.

    It's a tough call. If I'm Morey, I'm looking very seriously at all offers coming our way. If you can get some decent value for him, I think you have to take it. We can find another guy to be that 4th quarter "creator" ... it's not going to be a guy on the level of Kobe or Wade or Roy, but we can find someone that can create his own shot.
     
  3. heyangw

    heyangw Member

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    I even doubt if you are a fan of Rockets.
    T-Mac officially quit during the hardest time of early last season. It was Yao who carried the team and got a 5-win streak and then the first 12 wins of the 22 win streak.
    I do not deny the effort of T-Mac after he came back from injury last season and his contribution to the 22 win streak. But what you said is just not the truth.


     
  4. mms

    mms Member

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    When you measured his performance this past season you used some of the team stats but when you measured his last year performance you used personal stats. Actually his shooting was better this year with 38.8% from the field and 37.6% from 3, also 80.1% FT. His low fgp can be excused as his body didn't allow him to go to rim so he had to settle with long Js. If I remember correctly, Tmac played two 48-min games during the 22-game win streak. He did almost everything he could to win last year. You've got to give him "Some F Credit".
     
  5. Andy Sheets

    Andy Sheets Member

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    Discussions like this make me wish we knew what Morey's evaluation system was, because I have a feeling that whatever analysis he uses, it goes a lot deeper than simple "the FG% goes up when he's not playing" measurements. Of course, I'm sure Morey also assumes that McGrady will get at least somewhat healthy again, which he hasn't been in a couple of years - I think everyone can agree that a permanently limping T-Mac isn't much good for anyone.
     
  6. Pahokee

    Pahokee Member

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    T-Mac would help in situations similar to game seven yesterday. The team was struggling to get shots of their own. It was clear from the beginning that the Lakers were going to put effort into their defense and close out on the jump shooters. That's why the Rockets struggled in the beginning, and that's why they struggled all game.

    T-Mac would have been a help because of his ability to create his own shot, and his ability to create for others. That was something sorely missed on Sunday. When things break down offensively the Rockets struggled to move the ball around and get an open look. For the most part the Rockets during the playoffs depended on ball movement to get open looks. Yao wasn't the force he could be because so many teams doubled him and that forced the Rockets to rely on other scorers.

    When the offense broke down the Rockets had no go-to-scorer. It was essentially Ron Artest dribbling around for five second and jacking up a brick. This is where T-Mac comes into play. The guy can score in these situations. When things break down you can give T-Mac the ball and let him create his own shot, or create one for somebody else off the dribble.

    In a perfect world T-Mac would be great for the Rockets in one capacity--off the bench. Would he swallow his ego to help the team win and come off the bench? I doubt it. But this would make the Rockets a great team when healthy. Not good, but great. You put McGrady with all the hustlers and pitbulls of the second unit and all the sudden you have, when healthy, one of the game's best scorers off your bench. T-Mac coming off the bench also allows your first unit to flow offensively. He's not taking bad shots, and he's not dominating the basketball. This allows Aaron Brooks to continue to blossom, Yao to get his touches, and for the ball to move around. Plus, your first unit is now a strong one offensively.

    Would the ball movement, and defense been as good as it was during the playoffs with McGrady in the lineup? Probably not. But, could he have been a big help in games like Sunday's game seven? Absolutely.

    If he accepted a bench role to just be a scorer, and play 23-28 minutes a night this team would be great in my honest opinion.
     
  7. Andy Sheets

    Andy Sheets Member

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    Creating for others I can see, but I don't expect him to ever consistently attack the basket again. Kobe doesn't attack the basket very much anymore, either, and he's nowhere near as gimpy as T-Mac is.
     
  8. harryrms

    harryrms Member

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    But you have to base your decision on recent performance. It does not matter how he did for us in 2005. If we have 2004-2005 Tracey, we'd be talking about how to beat Denver right now.

     
  9. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    All 99ers are fans of the Rockets, it's in their DNA.

    Also, his nick is SamCassell.

    That's all you need to know.
     
  10. Pahokee

    Pahokee Member

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    I meant to say a strong first group defensively.
     
  11. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Nice post Clutch, and well spoken.

    It is ALL about efficiency...and Tracy is NOT an efficient basketball player.

    I want players that are smart, efficient and hustle.

    I hope we can get something for him.

    DD
     
  12. heyangw

    heyangw Member

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    I hate T-mac quit during the hardest time of the team during the past two seasons. But his talent is what the Rockets need even he can only play his 80%. The problem is if he wants to play within the system. The Rockets now are different from the JVG era when he and Yao took most of shoots. He just cannot play the same way as before. If he can play the similar style as the second game vs Denver this season and also plays hard on defense, I would like to see he comes back next season.

     
  13. Rocketeer

    Rocketeer Member

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    Well... at one point he commanded a double team every night. But then again, he won't be that guy anymore after surgery. To me, McGrady has already played his last game as a Rocket.
     
  14. ThaBlackKnight

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    With injuries and lost athleticism, his shooting has gone down a little bit. When he was healthy, he was able to elevate over any defender. Now, people are able to contest his shot much more.

    You mention his best shooting season was 43 %. You are absolutely correct about that, BUT, what do you expect him to shoot when JVG made him handle the ball 90 % of the time and he also had to try to bail the Rockets out late in shot clock situations when our offense broke down.

    In Orlando, he didn't have a post player occupying the middle. It made it harder for him to win that way, but it made it MUCH easier for him to drive to the basket. That made his field goal % a little bit higher considering since teams could still double and triple team him back then. However, he needed the post player to help him win games.

    Even when Kobe had Shaq, they had consistent 3 point shooters around them, so even when Shaq got doubled, the other remaining defenders were scared to death to leave Horry, Fisher, Fox, Rice, etc. open on the 3 point line, which is why Kobe could score with a dominant post player.

    With this Rockets team, he gets us easier shots. Do yall remember when Yao and Tmac were both relatively healthy, where Tmac and Yao could run that pick n' roll, and almost always get a good shot off?? Many times Tmac would zip a pass to Yao on the roll for a lay up or dunk. Tmac would have a wide open 20 footer at the top of the key, or he could turn the corner and get to the basket or get the open 3 point shooter in the opposite corner.

    That is with just 2 players running the offense, that all of those options are created. I know Rick Adelman did a great job this year of creating shots without a true playmaker, but did yall notice how much harder it was that way. All the pounding Yao took from the fronting and double teams.

    In late game situations, you need somebody to be able to get you good, high % shots. Yao is our #1 options late in games because he is our best shooter and most efficient player. He gets us the highest % shot. If he doesn't take the shot, he'll get it to an open player. However, teams can take Yao out of the game and make Artest, Battier, Scola, and Brooks beat us. They are all nice solid players, but they aren't there for clutch situations and they are all limited in getting their own shot off.

    Enter Tracy McGrady. Teams can't front Yao with Tmac there, because he is a top 5 player at creating his own shot for himself and for others. He is the other option you can go to, on the perimeter. I like Ron Artest as a player, but offensively, I cringe every time he is outside the 3 point line and I cringe even more when he tries to dribble from that far out. Its not his strength. Tmac's strength now a days maybe his creating shots for other people. He may not be the high flying fnisher anymore like he was back in 2005, but he can still get to the rim, and he is a very good passer. He'll get Yao easy lay ups and dunks. He'll get Battier that open 3 in the corner. He'll find AB and Ron Artest at the free throw line extended. He'll find Scola and Landry at the top of the key or cutting to the basket.

    With Lowery and Brooks handling the ball, Tmac can curl off screens and shoot the mid range jumpers that he can hit routinely. He can be the finisher of plays when he has to. He will only improve our team if he's healthy. If he's injured, he of course hurts our team, defensively. But even if he's hurt, he's the one guy that can pass the ball into our most efficient shooter in Yao.
     
  15. DaDakota

    DaDakota Balance wins
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    Count down to Black Knight, Tmac_1 and all the other Tmac guys coming in with their apologies.

    :D

    DD
     
  16. Depressio

    Depressio Member

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    Huh? Yeah, he does.

    I expect Tracy to attack just as much as he used to if he gets healthy.
     
  17. The_Yoyo

    The_Yoyo Member

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    how is this 2 words? ;)
     
  18. heyangw

    heyangw Member

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    I apologize for doubting a 99er a fan or Rockets as a 09er.
    But I do not understand that why some truth are so easily to be forgotten.


     
  19. tinman

    tinman 999999999
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    You mean the champion bus throwing team?

    Those guys are incredible they can throw Yao under the bus, and he's 7'2, 300lbs

    plus the entire team! and other players like Bobby Sura

    and everybody that played with Orlando

    and Toronto

    Get Metro and Greyhound ready for the Tmac-bus-throwing fans!
     
  20. DarkHorse

    DarkHorse Member

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    I actually stayed up late last night thinking what the Rockets could/should do barring any magical lightning bolt trades/free agent signings from the sky.

    To me, McGrady is still too valuable to give away and/or give up on, but I totally agree with what Clutch's numbers are saying, i.e. TMac has shown to be incapable or unwilling to play the style of ball this team needs. (even Ron has shown a willingness at times to play within the system)

    My conclusion was exactly this, that TMac would be better served coming off the bench to lead the second unit, Ginobli style. I'm thinking a lineup of Lowry, TMac, Wafer, Landry, and Hayes could be extremely effective both offensively and defensively. (again, barring any significant personnel changes... although I REALLY think we need a backup C badly)

    But yeah, it'll be difficult to Tracy to accept that role and stay motivated, in my opinion.

    It's certainly a quandary.
     

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