Nah dude... I asked the OP how can he start his list off with Nas when impact and record sales was the start of his criteria. And Nas having the greatest album is an opinion... And everyone's opinion doesn't have to be the same as yours. In 1994 when Nas released Illmatic... That's the same year Outkast released Cadillac Music, Scareface released The Diary, Thug Life released their album (when the legend of Tupac began in my opinion), Organized Confusion released their album that year, Biggie released his album that year and many people may prefer listening to one of those albums than Illmatic. And being the most lyrical complex rapper (which he is not if you actually listened to those Rino tracks) doesn't necessarily equate to great music... Just look at the Bestie Boys Licence to ill. That's a great album. My favorite song by Nas is God Loves Us and that's no were near his best technical lyrics. You're trying to delegate what people should have on their list and you can't do that because it's all about preference. And in my opinion since the 90's it's the DJ's/music producers who have the most influence in the rap game. Like DJ Screw out of Houston. You hear many artists mentioning him and their songs... Way more than you hear people mentioning Nas.
You're doing THE SAME THING!! We all are.. it's okay. It's a top 10 discussion and it's okay to disagree, but I'm also gonna call you out for trying to minimize Rakim's greatness. My whole argument is separate from OP's criteria. I like to look at impact on the rap game as a whole. You told me point blank that Nas CAN'T be a top 10 most influential rapper. I'm not gonna cry about you "delegating" who's on my list, but I'm gonna call you out on that as being wrong (sure.. in my opinion)
Highly acclaimed by who...??? Illmatic took 7 years to go platinum. He wasn't even getting love in his own city. Lol.
I personally think Illmatic is the GOAT album in hip hop. Others that would be close to the top of the list: 1. Things Fall Apart-The Roots 2. Like Water for Chocolate-Common 3. LABCABINCALIFORNIA-THe Pharcyde 4. The Low End Theory-ATCQ 5. 3 Feet and Rising-De La Soul
You've proven for like the 5th time in this thread how little you know about rap as a whole... I'm done with this crap. Just embarrassing for you to even be in this thread right now.
yeah, that would be this. Spoiler Seriously though, it should be required listening for any fan of rap music. To this day I haven't heard an album that does a better job following a single narrative from beginning to end. They had tossed around the idea of making it a full feature-length film (really a loooong music video), but it never happened. It got as far as a "trailer" of various album snippets. <iframe width="420" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/U-guxZPyxrY" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>
http://musiccourtblog.com/2010/03/31/bob-dylan-hip-hops-godfather/ Homie, rappers have been jacking stuff from Dylan since Kurtis Blow. Lol.. There's a great article in Rolling Stone as well. Google it. And I forgot to mention Mr Rudy Ray Moore. You're probably too young to know about him. YouTube him. Rap goes back a long way dude. It just changes forms.
Look, I'm not even gonna spar with you on whether Bob Dylan was a rapper (the blog you linked disagrees strongly with that notion). Back on topic: Here's a very incomplete list of Acclaim for Illmatic: NME: "Rythmic Perfection" USA Today: "the most urgent poetry since Public Enemy's". Commended Nas for honestly depicting dismal ghetto life without resorting to the sensationalism and misogyny of contemporary gangsta rappers. The Source: Instant 5 Mics (unheard of at that time from a debut album) New York Timees: a "milestone in trying to capture the 'street ghetto essence'" New Rolling Stone Album Guide: "a portrait of an artist as a hood, loner, tortured soul, juvenile delinquent, and fledgling social critic, still stands as one of rap's crowning achievements". Pitchfork: #33 on top 100 albums (any genre) of the 1990's. "the meticulously crafted essence of everything that makes hip-hop music great; it's practically a sonic strand of the genre's DNA." Rolling Stone: One of 33 hip hop and R&B albums in their Essential Recordings of the 90's Ranked # 5 in "The Critics Top 100 Black Music Albums of All Time" Vibe: #4 best rap album of all time MTV: #2 best rap album of all time Rolling Stone: #314 on best albums (any genre) of all time Popmatters: the greatest album of all time" and stated, "Ten years after its release, Illmatic stands not only as the best hip-hop album ever made, but also one of the greatest artistic productions of the twentieth century." Just last year, Nas performed the entire Illmatic album live with the National Symphony Orchestra at the Kennedy Center in Washington, DC. I was fortunate to be able to attend this culturally significant event. This is a lazy list that I compiled straight off Wikipedia. You see, if you just look at the music and don't care about the culture, it may be possible to shun Illmatic as insignificant. But that's not me. It's about Hip Hop. Time is Illmatic
Trying to empirically judge any art is what Robin Williams warned against when he asked us to rip out that chapter of the book in his class in Dead Poets Society
I know what I know... And I know rap artist were making albums and tapes before 1987 when Rakim dropped his album. It's always been different styles of rap. Heck, Ice T was rapping in the movie Breaking in 1984, The 2 Live Crew dropped their 2nd album in 1986 (which is a classic), Dr Dre was with the World Class Wrecking Cru in 1983, and the list goes on. You're basically showing how little you know about rap music as a whole. Nope... I said influential... I also said rapping is not new... And I also said other names besides Dylan that you choose to ignore. Obviously the rap listening world didn't care about what the critics thought of Illmatic. Because there opinions didn't make people listen to it. And for the last time. It's okay if you think Nas and Illmatic are the greatest... But I don't. People are going to have different opinions which apparently you think they shouldn't. And hip hop didn't start with rappers seeing how technical they can be with their lines.. It was about making fun music. That's just a style within the confines of rap music. Guess you never heard of The Sugar Hill Gang, Whodini, and Afrika Bambaataa...
You said that Nas was not a top 10 most impactful artist and Illmatic wasn't an influential album. I understand opinions and personal preference. There are no magical formulas to come up with who is the "best", but IMPACT I believe you can measure. INFLUENCE is tangible. There are so many fallacies in your post above. NOBODY in this thread said that Rakim was the first rapper. Why are you even talking about that?? Of course he wasn't the first. Nobody thinks that. The fact that you think that artists LIKE Dylan are more influential to rap than Nas is just... LOL (and for the second time, the blog you linked agrees with me on that one. You should read it). Dylan may certainly have had shared some similar influences in his music as early rap, but we're talking about influential RAPPERS. If he's not a rapper, he's not relevant to this conversation. You laughed at the notion that Illmatic was highly acclaimed. I showed you a long yet incomplete list of how universally respected the album is, and all you come back with is "Nobody listened to it". You're wrong. You're dead wrong. You're comically wrong. It's been 20+ years and you've got places like the Kennedy Center bringing him in to perform the entire album beginning to end. That doesn't happen to albums that people don't listen to. It doesn't happen to ANY other rap album. And rap isn't about just "making fun music". It's an expression of the culture. That's my last post in this abysmal discussion.
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