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To all the Morey loves who keep crying about “cheap Tillman” and the Harden deal..

Discussion in 'Houston Rockets: Game Action & Roster Moves' started by Htown Stros, Jan 24, 2021.

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After watching Oladipo & this team since the trade, do you still think Tillman/Stone suck?

  1. Yes, I truly believe the trade was bad and the team has a dark future

    6.3%
  2. Yes, I hate “cheap Tillman”

    44.1%
  3. Yes, because I can’t stop dreaming about Morey’s sexy beard

    3.1%
  4. No, I still hate “cheap Tillman” but my personal bias again him led my astray

    3.9%
  5. I’m one of the few who have been excited by the change in mgmt and this team’s future

    28.3%
  6. No, Oladipo is a lot better than I thought & wrong about the trade but I don't whine

    0.8%
  7. I’m one of the few who have been excited by the change in mgmt and the team’s future!

    13.4%
  1. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    https://www.google.com/amp/s/sports...ort-daryl-morey-thinks-houston-173212382.html

    The best GM ever, according to some of those I’m talking about anyway, thinks Tillman and Stone made a great deal. So who here wants to stand by their opinion, which I’ve obviously wholeheartedly disagreed with since the day Morey was finally told to pack his bags by “future title winning Tillman”, and will continue to stand by my opinion until proven otherwise, in which case, I will be the first to admit I was wrong.

    So with that said, who here wants to hop on the bandwagon with me and get Morey/Harden out of their mouth once and for all? It’s OK to hate “cheap Tillman” as you all love to call him while admitting you were wrong - I’ve included that option in the poll as well.

    P.S. - I know who the few are who actually shared my opinion from the jump. On the other hand, I know all the people I’ve been calling out over the past two weeks so think carefully before voting.
     
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  2. bobloblaw

    bobloblaw Contributing Member

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    You can’t combine Tilman and Stone in the poll. Tilman still hasn’t spent any money. The team can be fun to watch due to the GM but not competitive due to the owner.
     
  3. daywalker02

    daywalker02 Easter Egg Hunter - Tell me why? نحن عائلة

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    Rewind and make Morey a 25 year old greenhorn, do you think he can't pull it off?

    Not the greatest Morey advocate but that's just disrespect.

    Stone and Witus are Morey's guys, lol, they are Morey just not using Twitter that much.

    Morey got his own personality, quirky.
     
    Ramo$e and ipaman like this.
  4. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    What do you mean he hasn't spent any money? Did he not sign Christian Wood to a new deal? He didn't have to do that. And why doesn't he trade Wall & one, or two if needed, of those firsts to someone and dump Wall's contract if he is SO cheap? Why even ask for Oladipo and not just take Jarrett Allen on his cheap contract?

    Y'all amaze me. Tillman has spent as much if not more than Les did while owning the team and that's after he paid $2B for the team, which arguably was an overpay even BEFORE having the value of the team destroyed from his loser GM firing off a tweet about Hong Kong. Then you have the pandemic right after that...he hasn't exactly been the most lucky guy since buying the Rockets and yet so far there hasn't been a move he has made that anyone on this board can point to and say "we're doomed because of that decision"...speaking of which that leads me to Morey.

    First off, I respected the tweet until he backpedaled and deleted it then I just thought he was a hypocritical sellout who might have done it to save his job after putting this team in the position we were in by always catering to Harden's every wish. That said, regardless of that tweet and his choices after the fact, I can't believe people love him so much on this board. That incident just proved he's a spineless coward and that's probably why Harden controlled him and he got destroyed in contract negotiations. Speaking of dooming decisions, he made more detrimental decisions than I can count on one hand, and arguably we didn't win a championship because of those decisions. Finally, he let Harden run the show like he was LeBron, and because of that, it nearly left this team/roster in shambles.

    We're so blessed to have gotten a future all-NBA player (Wood) that is only going to get better and is 6+ years younger than Harden...regardless how Wall, Oladipo and Cousins pan out, we are going to be set with the draft picks we got in that deal plus the assets we'll likely receive in potential future trades if we are a bust this year. That said, I don't know how manyone can look at this team right now and not be thrilled - we finally have a crop of young players we've committed to developing (really like Tate and love Wood of course) and there's some fire power to go along with that in Oladipo, Wall and Wood who combined are averaging over 60 a game. What more could you want...

    Edit: For all of those who are illerate when it comes to finance/valuations in business, that tweet cost "cheap Tillman" between $200M-$300M. Everyone go ahead and keep crying about Tillman avoiding the luxury tax...

    NEWS FLASH teams going over the tax usually only do so when it's worthwhile like GS signing KD...not because their moron GM continues to overpay everyone and now you are forced to decide on whether keeping a fringe player that your moron head coach won't play during the playoffs anyway or paying a ridiculous amount in luxury tax just in case only 4 players from the 7 favorites are healthy and therefore your moron coach is literally forced to play said player you paid the tax to keep.

    https://fadeawayfinance.com/2020/02...rom-the-china-fallout-on-the-houston-rockets/
     
    #4 Htown Stros, Jan 24, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2021
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  5. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    https://www.spotrac.com/nba/tax/

    Just for reference only SEVEN teams are in the luxury tax and the Rockets are closer to it than the Mavs, Heat, and Bulls. They're basically on par with the Nuggets, Spurs, Raptors, and all the other teams not in the luxury tax for that matter. The Celtics are way down the list and the Knicks comically are at the bottom...maybe you all can become Knicks fans so you can appreciate Tillman and the Rockets after seeing how "uber cheap Dolan" finds a way to lose every year despite being one of the most easibly marketable teams in a huge market.
     
  6. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    Yeah I realize Stone is a Morey guy - I think Morey has a lot of great concepts/ideas and I believe he truly changed the game with the hyper focus on analytics. The role he is in right now where he's checked by Doc and Elton Brand when it comes to basketball and Josh Harris from the business side - he needs that clearly and I challenge anyone to prove to me he didn't continuously lose in negotiations...said another way, does anyone here really want to argue he didn't give out a handful of BAD contracts?

    From a basketball perspective, does anyone here truly think he was good in that regard? And I'm not talking analytics here, I'm talking solely about his head coach choices, McHale and MDA, during Harden's tenure. I truly believe if he had hired a coach like Silas instead of MDA we would have been holding a trophy at the end of the season that CP3 got hurt...likely because MDA continued to show poor judgement and run HIS players into the ground and not giving anyone else a true shot throughout the season which results in them being unplayable in the playoffs.

    Edit: For the record I think both parties (Morey and Rox) are going to look back and view the separation as a positive. He has a better home, especially with his skill set and Philly’s seemingly being one of the worst analytical teams, I think he will thrive in Philly where he has the team around him I mentioned. It really felt like we needed to move on and changed the culture of this team - I’m referring to never developing players, mainly because we never kept our draft picks, and the ISO ball that analytically might have looked great on paper but didn’t take into account the human element...we know this team every year has been divided in the locker room and that’s going to happen on ANY team that prioritizes individual play to the extent we did.
     
    #6 Htown Stros, Jan 24, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2021
    ashleyem likes this.
  7. Highlyrated

    Highlyrated Member

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    Stone >Morey
     
    Htown Stros likes this.
  8. Downtown Sniper

    Downtown Sniper Contributing Member

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    It's almost like you've never heard of an ex-employee not burning bridges and putting an X next to his name in his line of work.

    It's almost as if you think Stone (who by the way learnt EVERYTHING from Morey....) had to do some arduous work which no other GM could in getting this trade package. And it's all him and not 100% because of the player James Harden is.

    I fail to understand what your post even has to do with the thread title involving Tilman Fertitta. When in actuality if Tilman wasn't so cheap this team would have been MUCH better keeping Allen in the trade.

    This is a failure of epic proportions. Go ahead and jot my name down.

    Jesus. I would hate to see how some people on Clutchfans act after a real life breakup with an ex.
     
  9. Highlyrated

    Highlyrated Member

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    Patrick is that you? Lol, I'm already scouting and found 2 prospects that got very good potential, 1 is between 20-30pick and the other is in the 2nd rd.Id prefer to give yall my analysis rather than post it here because I know Morey got an account.
     
    #9 Highlyrated, Jan 24, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2021
  10. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    What in the literal hell are you talking about? For one Allen is making $4M a year...Oladipo is making $20M. Or are you referring to the deal for Cleveland's pick?

    See my responses about the luxury tax above, and after doing so, if you can present a REAL argument that provides factual evidence that Tillman is cheaper than say Mark Cuban, who I've seen others talk about in a positive light as a NBA owner, then I'm ready to hear it and I'll gladly say I'm wrong. Until then I'll continue thinking everyone, likely because of a personal vendetta again him, ignorantly pushing the narrative that he has been cheap is wrong, especially given his GM tanked the value of a BUSINESS he acquired for $2B by ~10%, which comes out to $200 million dollars in case you can't do math, and shortly after there was a once in a life time pandemic that forces the NBA to come to a complete stop and has yet to get back anywhere close to normal.

    If you don't feel like reading my responses above, in summary at a high level it is a FACT that the Mavericks consistently have spent less than us. It is a FACT that unless you are in the luxury tax or one of the truly cheap bottom seven payroll teams you are ONLY a couple million below or above us in terms of spending on player salaries. It is a FACT that he signed Wood and Cousins to deals this off-season when he could have done nothing and it is a FACT he could easily trade Wall, Oladipo, and even Eric Gordon if you included that Clevland first rounder to a team for salary relief...then it would become truly a FACT that "cheap Tillman" is real.

    I've presented my argument with FACTS showing why he ISN'T cheap as an owner so I'm just waiting on a reply with FACTS showing why I'm wrong...

    I'll wait though don't worry. Hint the If the guy was cheap this team would be the Bulls or the Knicks right now.
     
    #10 Htown Stros, Jan 24, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2021
  11. Downtown Sniper

    Downtown Sniper Contributing Member

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    Tl; dr Patrick.

    It is a FACT he took a 65 win team and refused to make them better by bringing money in.

    Rather, the FACT is he attached draft picks to ship contracts out so he could lessen payroll. The FACT is doing so pissed off the franchise player and lead the team to the doldrums that they're in now.

    FACTS FACTS FACTS FACTS FACTS. Did you jot my name down yet homie?

    You can live in your lala land homie trying to make yourself feel better at night. The FACT is Tilman Fertitta has been nothing short of a disaster for the Houston Rockets.

    FACTS FACTS FACTS FACTS FACTS.

    You made a long post with a lot of garbage trying to sound smart. Case in point - you mention how much he bought the team for. Can someone say loans! FACTS. Imagine spending THAT MUCH MONEY. When you don't even have ALL THAT MONEY. And you don't do everything you can to make them better. I know why he didn't do everything he can to make them better. Because he needed to recoup some of the money to pay those loans back. FACTS.

    HAHAHAHA. WE ARE THE F*CKING KNICKS RIGHT NOW ARE YOU SERIOUS. You don't go from a 65 win team to the laughingstock of the league and a perennial bottom of the Conference team in the span of three years without a disastrously bad and horrendous management. Hahaha.

    I'll say again. I'd hate to see how you react to a real ex breaking your heart not a basketball GM who has nothing to do with your every day life. Yikes.
     
    #11 Downtown Sniper, Jan 24, 2021
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2021
  12. HookemHorns1250

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    This is going to get tiresome. Every win there will be the "Haha suck it haters!", and every time we lose "Y'all still having fun!?"

    Take it one game at a time, be happy for current things but don't try to completely prove someone wrong over one dang game.
     
  13. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    We won't have a 2021 first rounder unless we tank and get a top 4 pick right? If I recall we are getting the Nets and Cavs 2022 first rounder.

    Also, if you or anyone knows the answer to this I'd appreciate it...with OKC owning the swaps, hypothetically if during a year that they own the swap right we have the Nets and/or Cavs first round pick and that pick is higher than BOTH our pick and OKC's pick, OKC can't choose to take the Nets/Cavs pick from us right? My assumption is that it only applies to our pick but want to make sure I'm not going to be pissed off in the future...
     
  14. madbomber

    madbomber Member
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    I think Tillman knows full blown tanking is not a good business decision short term financially . Tillman is trying to have the team somewhat competitive while retooling the roster . The Depo was a smart decision because of his contract and is a decent player to replace Harden with or let him go if it don’t work out . Kinda same thing Les wanted before Harden got here ... Retool , don’t full tank .
     
  15. DatRocketFan

    DatRocketFan Member

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    Front Office fans: any disgruntled player = bad, any trade even if **** = is good and part of the bigger plan for the "ring", any poster that points out how shtty the front office is = only player fans suck.


    Jury is still out on the Harden trade, and we may b winners in the long run with is all good for all rockets fan. The season isn't even over to gauge how the front office did.

    It's not only black and white, Stone could b doing a great job, saddled with a shtty owner who wants to avoid paying LTS. There has been multiple instances where the owner ship people out to avoid paying the LTS.

    U guys hate supposedly player only fan, but ride the dick of the front office in the delusion that u are tru fans that support the franchise only. Its quite disgusting, but hey each person support the Rockets in their own way.
     
  16. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    HAHAHA @ you talking about "garbage posts" while not providing a single example or insight worth reading. Thanks for spewing the same true garbage over and over again without any substance.

    I'll just go ahead and block you as I know I won't miss your well thought out posts. And sorry for cluttering your screen up with all of my "garbage", it's not like I work for one of the largest consulting firms in the world or anything. Definitely don't know anything about financial due diligence or M&A. Oh wait...I have and still do work at one.

    Maybe next time if somehow you magically become unblocked I'll dumb it down for you and speak in terms you can comprehend so that way my posts won't be so garbage.
     
  17. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    There are SEVEN owners right now paying the luxury tax.

    https://www.hoopsrumors.com/2019/04/recent-history-of-nba-taxpaying-teams.html

    NO ONE PAYS THE LUXURY TAX!!! WHAT IS WRONG WITH Y'ALL?!?

    Edit: In case you all haven't forgotten WE ARE HOUSTON, not NEW YORK.
     
  18. Downtown Sniper

    Downtown Sniper Contributing Member

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    I actually kind of did - when I mentioned the trades with draft picks attached to dodge tax.

    But since you seem to be a little simple. Brandon Knight. There you go. IS.. is that... is that /thread now? Boy you are dumb.

    But here I am left wondering what working for a consulting firm has to do with the idiocy of the Houston Rockets organisation the past 3 years. Hopefully you can fill me in on that before you ignore me hahaha.

    Thanks for the good laugh Patrick.
     
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  19. Htown Stros

    Htown Stros Member

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    And why did we have Brandon Knight? Serious question.

    Also, we lost a bottom end first round pick because of that trade...that has literally zero impact on this team’s chances.
     
  20. Swapshop

    Swapshop Member

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    Tilman is cheap and exacerbated by being in hospitality during the covid era but what deals do you think he should have approved on that would have won us the championship? I mean other than Ariza asking for about 4m more than he was worth and Rockets probably overestimating his replacability. Keep in mind we still would have been facing the Warriors and if you offer a free agent a deal doesn't mean they have to say yes.
     
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